Audiophiles - Subwoofer and bass management

[Klonk]

Hey folks I'm just looking for some tips or advice on my sub. I have a nice home theater so obviously I appreciate good sound in my movies and music. I just bought a new sub ( I have Klipsch speakers so stuck with this name. They do the job nicely for my ears.) Anyway I hook it up via RCA to LFE, which will not change. My concern is crossover. I use the auto calibration (Audyssey) which always works fine for me through the fronts, center and surrounds...it's the sub that never seems to come out right. Right now I seem to have found a happy place at (80) in receiver. I keep the sub's crossove all the way up and only adjust the Gain if I want more or less thump.

Any other tips or advice on getting the best sound? Thanks!

[markwoll]

If you can feel your innards vibrate in time to the music, you have managed to get the sub dialed in.

[Klonk]

If you can feel your innards vibrate in time to the music, you have managed to get the sub dialed in.

I'm pretty sure I found that spot, but I can't help feeling it can be better!

[proggy_jazzer]

I have a 2.1 (B&W) setup in my listening room. My feeling about this type of system is that I want to have the crossover set in such a way as to make the transition invisible, i.e. that I'm just listening to a pair of excellent full-range speakers. Every room and every speaker system is different, and it took me awhile to get it dialed in, but I'm pretty happy now. YMMV

[markwoll]

With my setup ( a Yamaha rx-A3000) I tried the auto setup ( with a mic at the listening location ) for 5.1 with sub and found it 'unbalanced' for what I wanted.
Too much sub.
I twiddled and fiddled and got it to a point where I felt it was a good sound from most sources.
It was still really dependent on the album/movie producer as to how the sub behaved.

[Zeuhlmate]

If you have full range speakers then you dont need a subwoofer, unless you want more deep bass than was intended from the producers of the music.

I my experience one subwoofer is not enough, you need two (for stereo) and you might need external 'active adjustable crossover' device for them.

Here is a pricey one: http://www.bryston.com/products/other/10B-SUB.html

[Staun]

Watching movies, I do have a sub but as to music, I've stayed away. I felt that the speakers I have should do the job and to be honest, I'm happy with the low freq sound they produce. But I to would like to hear more from those who have high end systems that employ subs.

[Garyhead]

I have Martin-Logan Electrostatic Hybrid speakers. (Electrostatic panels over a 10" woofer). They are fine. Electrostatics inherently are weak at reproducing low frequencies hence the addition of the woofer. I had an opportunity to acquire a pair of Cerwin-Vega 18" Subwoofers from the old 70's Earthquake Soundsystems found in movie theaters. Each cabinet had its own 360w Amplifier to power it. I believe the cabinets were tuned to a 20Hz frequency.....sa-weet!
Now....these cabinets were reverse K configuration and measured 48" x 48" x 20" wide so these would NOT make the wife-approval factor. (no wife......happy life). I made new cabinets 24" x 24" x 24" and put a granite countertop on it for mass.
Bought 2 of those Bryston 10b Sub crossovers and eventually 6 Jeff Rowland Model 1 Power Amps. Bridged all the amps so the woofers and sub woofers got their 360watts and the electrostatics got 720watts. Holy Hell does it Work! Once I got the Brystons dialed in, I never needed to retweek. I have isolated each speaker by shutting down 5 of the six power amps at a time and was dismayed by what each one was doing......but all together?......what a wall of sound.
Overall......I think most problems arise with Subwoofers that are underpowered.......tubby, muddy.....from lack of power. A good design alternative are the Subs with the amps integrated......And room acoustics.......you can only do so much with a room. I have not kept up with the times on audio equipment. i.e. Subs with internal amps didn't exist when I started. In the early 90's with artists like Enigma and Enya, I realized something was going on in the bass region. It was muddled.....That's when I switched from the summing mono Sub woofer to Stereo Sub woofers....what a difference. please note I avoided all "theoretical" discussions and went with trial and error by ear for my setup. I used mostly recordings of acoustic instruments in a classical music setting as that was the sound I was trying to reproduce. (my girlfriend was a professional symphony musician as well as most of our friends who coached me on how the instruments should sound). When switching to Rock / Jazz the addition of electric instruments were easy compared to getting an Oboe in its sweet spot! Good luck with your journey......My setup took years due to cost...but, I kinda used a building block approach (the amps were stereo with the ability to bridge later.....the Brystons work as 2-way Stereo and 3-way Mono). It ain't cheap! That amp / crossover setup consumes 300watts just at idle 24/7. I seldom need to heat the living room because of it.

[BobM]

There's sub's for music and then there's subs for movies.

For movies, if you feel the dinosaur stomps then you're good to go.

For music, it needs to be integrated seamlessly. A few suggestions.
- if it's a front loaded sub, pull it away from the wall or corner and raise it about a foot off the ground. Use whatever you can to raise it up, but something sturdy is better. Cinderblocks don;t look good but...there you go. Now you might have to raise the volume on it a bit but by raising it you've gotten rid of the boomy wall and floor interaction.
- If it's a down firing sub, simply turn it over and put some kind of butcher block or other sturdy board on those upturned feet. Place something heavy on the board to hold it down and move the sub away from the walls. Again, you might have to raise the volume a bot now.
- Generally a sub crossover point should be about 10-15DB lower then the bottom specified response of your speakers. So if your speakers go down to 80 Hz then run the sub at about 70 Hz and turn up the volume until it works for you,.

[Klonk]

Thanks folks! I think I have found my "sweet spot" with the sub set all the way up at it's LFE setting and receiver sub setting at 80hz...sounds real nice for music AND dinosaur stomps Bob, it is front firing and away from the wall (not in corner that's too bassy) I will test out raising it up at some point.

Love hearing about the set ups! My speakers are all Klipsch Reference including the new sub. It's a nice sound for me without layin' out the big $$. Receiver is a Marantz which I swear by.

[Udi Koomran]

https://www.digido.com/portfolio-item/subwoofers/

http://www.bobhodas.com/to-woof-or-not-to-woof.php