ELP Brain Salad Surgery - changes to the Deluxe Edition

[Valen]

From Burning Shed today:

"Thank you for pre-ordering Brain Salad Surgery - Deluxe from us: https://www.burningshed.com/store/pr...oduct/99/5688/

We have just been advised that the DVD-A/V with this edition does NOT contain 5.1 files.

5.1 files are only available on the Super Deluxe package: https://www.burningshed.com/store/pr...oduct/99/5687/

If this affects your reasons for ordering the deluxe edition and you would like to cancel this pre-order please let us know as soon as possible. We are hoping to be able to begin shipping within the next two weeks following the manufacturer's delays to the original release date."

Bummer....

[JJ88]

Not that I 'do' these things anyway but if the standard release doesn't have 5.1 mixes, I think that's a big miscalculation. Good on Burning Shed making people aware of it.

So what exactly *is* on the DVD then??

[battema]

A feature-length apology from whomever tried to manage this release, for his inability to maintain order amidst the ELP chaos, perhaps?

I don't blame him...plenty of these deluxe editions have gone off without a hitch. ELP's maintenance of their back catalog seems as well-handled as their "current" group career...

(IMHO)

[JJ88]

I don't think Steven Wilson was involved here. He bowed out from the catalogue- wasn't it an Innerviews interview where he said he didn't like the other albums enough to bother doing them?

It is puzzling how Yes and King Crimson can offer the 5.1 mixes in the cheaper packages, and yet an ELP release cannot.

[Dan Marsh]

This is total bullshit.

[battema]

Fixed my post

In the other cases, it looks like band members are more closely involved (not 100% sure about Yes, although I suspect that is the case). Fripp watches this stuff very closely, I have the distinct impression Ian Anderson is involved with the Tull stuff, Banks was all over the Genesis boxes...with these ELP releases they feel more like a "me too!" kind of release than something that has been closely and carefully packaged and put together.

(again...100% pure organic IMHO)

[Brian Griffin]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the final answer that everything on this had already been released in some form already, on the previous 15 releases of the album?

BG

[battema]

Yes, but not in a big box together! That's important...

I actually was lucky enough to pick up the original DVD-Audio release of BSS when it first came out. It *does* sound really great, to be honest. A shame it kind of became a bit rare after that. Having the 5.1 more widely available in a reasonably-priced package would have made a lot of sense. I honestly and seriously suspect this was supposed to happen and that this was a whoopsie.

[BarryLI]

Well, if it doesn't have a 5.1 mix I'm hard pressed to think of a reason to buy it, and I've a feeling I'm not alone.

[jefftiger]

No, you're definitely not alone in this! I'm feeling very ripped off that the 2CD/DVDA package that I have on pre-order with Amazon UK will only have the new high res Jakko stereo mix. The alternative album appears to be generally worthless with all but two of its tracks having appeared on previous "deluxe" releases. I don't feel inclined to pay nearly $90 for the deluxe box set since I'm only really interested in the new 5.1 Jakko mix and, to a lesser extent, Jakko's new stereo mix. The documentary DVD is identical to what's been released and I have no need at all for any vinyl.

[Mister Triscuits]

5.1 files are only available on the Super Deluxe package: https://www.burningshed.com/store/pr...oduct/99/5687/

...which is listed as "Out of Stock." Does that mean that it's already sold out on preorder, or that they don't have a release date?

[jefftiger]

...which is listed as "Out of Stock." Does that mean that it's already sold out on preorder, or that they don't have a release date?

You can buy the "super deluxe" package from Amazon UK right now. It's in stock and shipping. I thought about it earlier this morning, but decided against it.

[BarryLI]

No, you're definitely not alone in this! I'm feeling very ripped off that the 2CD/DVDA package that I have on pre-order with Amazon UK will only have the new high res Jakko stereo mix. The alternative album appears to be generally worthless with all but two of its tracks having appeared on previous "deluxe" releases. I don't feel inclined to pay nearly $90 for the deluxe box set since I'm only really interested in the new 5.1 Jakko mix and, to a lesser extent, Jakko's new stereo mix. The documentary DVD is identical to what's been released and I have no need at all for any vinyl.

I have it pre-ordered on Amazon specifically for the 5.1 mix, if this decision holds I'm canning it for sure.

[Sunhillow]

This is total bullshit.

Seconded.

[Brian Griffin]

The alternative album appears to be generally worthless with all but two of its tracks having appeared on previous "deluxe" releases.

Having some trouble figuring this out - what two tracks are those?

TIA


BG

[jefftiger]

Having some trouble figuring this out - what two tracks are those?

TIA


BG

I can't find the source of this now, but I thought that it was discussed recently on the Quadrophonic sound forum. A poster there said that the two final tracks on the alternate BSS CD (CD2, I suppose) have not been released before. The other alternate takes on that CD have all shown up in other BSS deluxe packages (like the one that Sanctuary released in 2008, I believe).

[Sid Smith]

Cancelled my order once I heard the 5.1 mix wasn't included in the 3-disc set. You have to wonder if small indie labels can do low-cost 5.1 editions why can't the majors?

[zorknapp]

Was the box set not getting the sales they wanted, so this would be a way to drive sales to that product? If so, it seems like the added sales of the big box wouldn't balance out the lots of smaller sales the 3 disc set would get with the surround mix in the package...

[BarryLI]

Cancelled my order once I heard the 5.1 mix wasn't included in the 3-disc set. You have to wonder if small indie labels can do low-cost 5.1 editions why can't the majors?

The superflous crap on the more expensive versions, much of which has been released before doesn't justify the expense, but there are a goodly number of buyers interested in the 5.1 mixes, so by releasing them in the least expensive sets it probably adversely effects the box set.

If I could control the world (ha!) I'd see nobody spent a penny on these, to offer then pull them back is just a reprehensible business practice, whoever made the decision should be punished.

[Dan Marsh]

I also cancelled my Amazon UK order.

[N_Singh]

I had already bought the 2 prior albums. No way in hell am I going to buy this.

[JJ88]

Was the box set not getting the sales they wanted, so this would be a way to drive sales to that product? If so, it seems like the added sales of the big box wouldn't balance out the lots of smaller sales the 3 disc set would get with the surround mix in the package...

I suspect that if this is indeed the thinking, it will backfire- these super deluxe sets are just too expensive for most people. They are easier to stomach when, as King Crimson have been doing, you include the 'best bits' in a budget set, like the 5.1 mixes.

ELP haven't exactly been short of reissue campaigns in the past, too. And nothing much of any substance has appeared as a bonus track on many of them, as far as I can see. I still have the only ones I ever bought, the Sanctuary releases of the classic albums from just over 10 years ago or whenever it was.

[Sid Smith]

It's interesting to compare the approaches of the big labels and the smaller indies.

When it comes to King Crimson, Panegyric/DGM cater for three different kinds of KC fans: hard core Crimheads & collectors who want to buy a complete (or as much of it as exists) run of shows on a tour, ie The Complete LTIA & TRTR and (forthcoming the next multi-disc box) Starless In Europe.

Then, for those who feel that 7 more versions of Easy Money isn't for them but would like to access things like new stereo and 5.1 surround sound mixes and whatever extras maybe included, then they provide low-cost alternatives ie 40th Anniversary Editions CD/DVD-A. These retail for around £10 - 15.

And for those who don't want 5.1 mixes but do fancy giving the new stereo mix with a couple of extras plus the original mix a bit of a spin, then there are the 2CD versions which will set you back a tenner or thereabouts.

So, the approach by the small indie label in this instance is to give punters of different degrees of commitment a real choice. There’s no hustle or rip off in this approach.

The decision by Pink Floyd / ELP catalogue owners (and let’s be clear it’s the labels and NOT the bands) to restrict 5.1 mixes to high cost options appears at best cynical and at worst, well, let’s not go there.

In the end a casual Pink Floyd / ELP buyer such as myself have to make a decision about what we’ll purchase or not purchase, and as a fully grown-up big kid I’m fine with that. Disappointed of course but basically fine. In the grand scheme of things in life there are probably more important things to be worried about I guess.

[Rufus]

This also reminds me of the upcoming Quadrophnia release. To get the 5:1 DVD-A you have buy the super duper box set at £80. A rip off & should be available on the 2CD deluxe edition as should BBS.

In relation to what's hasnt been released before there is an alternative version of Toccata that hasn't previously been released.
Also the extra's state they are alternate takes, previous releases were only different mixes. So in that context the extra's havnt been released before?

Would also like to know the reasoning behind the Genesis Box sets rip off. The first batch were release as single deluxe discs or the box set, giving the consumer a choice. Subsequent relases were only the box sets. So as a result I had to buy the box sets for the DVD-A's at an astrominal price for some albums i had no interest in buying or listening to. The single edition releases allevitated the problem of not ending up with albums i had no interest in. What explanation ever given for the reasoning behind dicontinuing single album relases. Was that for commercial reasons of squeezing the pockets of the consumer?

[Jeremy Bender]

This also reminds me of the upcoming Quadrophnia release. To get the 5:1 DVD-A you have buy the super duper box set at £80. A rip off & should be available on the 2CD deluxe edition as should BBS.

I remember how baffled I was when I got the "remastered" version of that great album. I put it on and when The Real Me started, I thought my stereo system was not set up right. Lo and behold, the album had been remixed, which was only noted in small print in the small booklet. Boo! I went back and got the original CD issue and that's the one I listen to.

So where's Tiger in the Spotlight on this? It was recorded at the BSS sessions, why was it left off? *sigh*

I'll get the 3-CD set as I don't have a 5.1 setup, it's fairly cheap (about $24 with shipping).