YES featuring ARW 2016/2017 Tour Reviews

[Frumious B]

I'm a big Steve Howe fan, but I was a Trevor Rabin fan first and I've never had the issues with his interpretations of the seventies music that some have. I like that ARW are coming at it with some recklessness and some rock and roll energy. When one or both are in the set my impression of a given Yes concert is often formed by how much I enjoy the performances of "Heart Of The Sunrise" and "Awaken" and I thought ARW did great on both. Of course I impatiently want new music from them six months ago. Hopefully they get something out there soon.

[Frumious B]

^I think you said Fly From Here was their best selling album since Union or Talk. So they can rack up respectable enough sales even without Anderson. I wouldn't say it was a great album by any means but it's solid, and many fans seemed happy enough with it.

There was a lot of negative press behind Heaven And Earth (including interviews with Howe and Billy Sherwood being brought in to salvage something from the wreckage) before the album was even released. Early word of mouth from those who heard the album also suggested it was a bit of a turkey which may be the reason it underperformed by comparison with FFH. Indeed, I do not have the album. But I think they could turn it around with a better album.

I don't expect much if any new material from ARW because Anderson and Wakeman are known for their big claims in interviews, shall we say. But if they do, I think Rabin would prevent it from being a twee album full of songs like 'The Meeting'.

They were highest charting, but that doesn't mean they were the best selling since overall album sales are down so much and albums also get a first week chart boost from Amazon etc. taking preorders for months before the actual release date. How often do we see a new album from Geezer Band X chart surprisingly high the first week only to sink like a stone thereafter? That's because everyone who cares either preordered or bought the first week but an album needs something else to give it legs and to keep selling...strong word of mouth or a single or three if you are talking about a more mainstream act. Personally I miss going to Tower Records at midnight, getting my new releases and standing in line trying to sneak a peek at what other people were buying without being too obvious about it. You don't get that extra fun with your Amazon preorders.

Howe was talking up H&E before the album came out. I know because I preordered it based on all the positive chatter from Howe. I sure got burned there. He didn't really say anything negative in public about H&E until it was obvious to virtually everyone except for the absolute diehards that the album was a bust.

[everyday]

Thoroughly enjoyed the concert on Sunday. The band were excellent as was the sound. We were on the very back row upstairs - a few seats in front were empty but must have been 95% full. I don't really care if a note was changed here or there. I've seen Steve Howe playing Owner of a Lonely Heart so why not Trevor Rabin putting his own spin on the classics? My only criticism (if there was one) is that I've never really liked Awaken (doesn't really go anywhere for me) - I'd have preferred CTTE, Siberian Khatru, Onwards or Leave It. Classic moment when the band came on stage and the drummer tripped up and went flying.

[chescorph]

I am really surprised (well, maybe not) that there are no changes to the set list for this leg. What happened to all the material Trevor said they had worked out? This grouping should be causing a lot more goose bumps...hey, Jon was almost dead less than a decade ago, and he *is* the voice of Yes.

I still think this group has under delivered. Maybe when they actually deliver new material, and more than a few songs.

[Sunlight Caller]

^ My thoughts are that you can discard most everything that is said in advance of a tour, they are just words and sound bites to promote and sell tickets.

If they settle in a studio at the end of the day and pull something out of the bag then great, I'll look forward to it. Remember who is helming the management ship here, bottom line will dictate the direction of travel.

As Frum points out above, strong week one chart returns do not necessarily make a commercial success, and they may be guarded about which direction to take next.


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[bondegezou]

^I think you said Fly From Here was their best selling album since Union or Talk. So they can rack up respectable enough sales even without Anderson. I wouldn't say it was a great album by any means but it's solid, and many fans seemed happy enough with it.

There was a lot of negative press behind Heaven And Earth (including interviews with Howe and Billy Sherwood being brought in to salvage something from the wreckage) before the album was even released. Early word of mouth from those who heard the album also suggested it was a bit of a turkey which may be the reason it underperformed by comparison with FFH. Indeed, I do not have the album. But I think they could turn it around with a better album.

The band have said FfH was the best selling since something like Talk (can't remember details), but they also said they lost money on it. They spent less making H&E, but look what happened.

I'm all for new albums. I think the members of Yes and of ARW are all for making new music. However, they make more money touring and I think there is some frustration at the reaction new material gets: it gets ignored or it gets criticised as not being like or as good as the favourite classic albums. They all react in different ways to this: Sherwood, Wakeman and Downes just go on releasing tons, Howe and Rabin tend to take their time working on releases, Anderson talks about alternative ways of making new music available (an app, digital releases, beamed into your brain by laser-wielding faeries).

Focusing on Yes for a moment, I think Sherwood and Davison would love to make a new album tomorrow, Downes is up for it, and White is up for it once his back's better. The hold-up is Howe. Howe likes making new music: I understand he's got some solo or Trio release coming out soon. But he's sceptical about making another Yes album, and if he does it, he wants to do it properly, which takes time. Optimistically, Howe does seem to be on board with doing a new album (on his timescale) and it's just White's back that's held them back.

Henry

[bondegezou]

^ ARW, meanwhile, are definitely working on material. But it's coming slower than many of us had hoped. There was talk of working on it between the US tour and the current tour, but it doesn't seem like much happened. Rabin is also someone who likes to get things right and take his time. So, a 2017 release seems increasingly unlikely to me, but a 2018 release probable.

I think they have it in them to make a great album. I think they have it in them to deliver a stinker too! I await with interest and anticipation.

Henry

[yamishogun]

I think they have it in them to make a great album. I think they have it in them to deliver a stinker too! I await with interest and anticipation.

Henry

Unlike Anderson and Wakeman, Rabin would not allow a bad album nor has any been less than at least very good: 90125, Big Generator, Can't Look Away, Talk, Jacaranda.

A Heaven & Earth is a metaphyical impossibility in all possible worlds.

[everyday]

I really liked FFH but if the band saw the reactions on here I'm surprised they made H&E. I really hope ARW do record something.

[bondegezou]

Unlike Anderson and Wakeman, Rabin would not allow a bad album nor has any been less than at least very good: 90125, Big Generator, Can't Look Away, Talk, Jacaranda.

A Heaven & Earth is a metaphyical impossibility in all possible worlds.

Opinion might vary on that. I'd put Talk in the bottom 3 Yes albums, and Can't Look Away is OK, but not great. People also always ignore the dozens of film score albums he's put out, which vary in quality. I've been enjoying 12 Monkeys, but others aren't as strong.

Anderson's and Wakeman's output can vary too. The last time Anderson and Wakeman teamed up, The Living Tree, is so-so. The last and only time Rabin and Wakeman teamed up, a song on Return to the Centre of the Earth, is medicore.

On the other hand, Jacaranda is great, The Invention of Knowledge is great (to my ears -- I know it has some detractors). So I really think this ARW album could be anywhere from terrible to great! Which makes it fun waiting for it!

Henry

[Kcrimso]

Unlike Anderson and Wakeman, Rabin would not allow a bad album nor has any been less than at least very good: 90125, Big Generator, Can't Look Away, Talk, Jacaranda.

A Heaven & Earth is a metaphyical impossibility in all possible worlds.

Well I happen to think that Can't Look Away is even worse than Heaven & Earth so...

[2steves]

If you go by past history or solo albums and excellent music put out in the last 25 years---I can guarantee the current bad line up of Yes and or ARW have zero ability to put out a great album of Yes music.

[JJ88]

Opinion might vary on that. I'd put Talk in the bottom 3 Yes albums

Not a favourite of mine either. That middle section of the album ('State Of Play'/'Walls'/'Where Will I Be') is as bad as the worst songs on Open Your Eyes IMHO. Is the rest better, certainly, but still not as strong as 90125 or the highlights of Big Generator, IMHO...and yes, that includes 'Endless
Dream' for me.

[mozo-pg]

I put Talk at the top of the Rabin era Yes albums. Endless Dream is a return to form.

[Paulrus]

IMO what has pulled recent Yes studio work down is the shift from instrumental to conventional songwriter-y type fare. The instrumental material has either been an afterthought or simply sub-par ("Bumpy Ride" anyone?) I think that's why Invention of Knowledge worked as well as it did -- Jon had a collaborator keeping a close eye on maintaining a healthy symph factor. Hopefully Rabin and Wakeman will serve the same role in any new music from ARW.

But with Yes, Chris and Steve have been maddeningly uninterested in recent years to provide the sort of take-no-prisoners instrumental arranging that always provided the counterpoint to the verse-chorus stuff. Chris always talked about how Yes was conceived as a combination of good vocals (and where have the great harmonies been lately?) with strong instrumental playing. Someone needs to print that out and stick it to their foreheads.

[arturs]

IMHO if Billy Sherwood has another "Valley of the Windmill" in him, that would be a great demo for a full-fledged Yes album. That is where they should begin, not some Davison/Downes pop songs.

I'm still listening to Windmill regularly; it is occasionally great and never less than very good (I can't believe I'm saying that about a Sherwood record!). I think adding Howe's guitar and Davison's singing would have only made it better.

[yamishogun]

Opinion might vary on that. I'd put Talk in the bottom 3 Yes albums, and Can't Look Away is OK, but not great. People also always ignore the dozens of film score albums he's put out, which vary in quality. I've been enjoying 12 Monkeys, but others aren't as strong.

But almost nobody except you, 2steves, or anyone else who thought Going For the One was Yes' last decent album would say Talk is a stinker that most think OYE and H&E were..

('State Of Play'/'Walls'/'Where Will I Be') is as bad as the worst songs on Open Your Eyes IMHO

So you forgot about Man on the Moon, From the Balcony and No Way We Can Lose??

[Ken Baird]

IMHO if Billy Sherwood has another "Valley of the Windmill" in him, that would be a great demo for a full-fledged Yes album. That is where they should begin, not some Davison/Downes pop songs.

I'm still listening to Windmill regularly; it is occasionally great and never less than very good (I can't believe I'm saying that about a Sherwood record!). I think adding Howe's guitar and Davison's singing would have only made it better.

Thanks for reminding me about that album, I meant to pick it up. If Billy is in that kind of mode, we could be in for something cool. Also, with recent Yes tours focusing on Tales and Drama, and possibly Relayer soon, I think it bodes pretty well for a fairly intense original album. That's the hope anyway!

I have no real guess what an ARW album might sound like---maybe a little bit like a blend of Talk, Return to the Centre of the Earth and ABWH? I'm not sure, but very curious to see what they'll do. (if they do it)

[Thebigdipper]

I now regret not seeing ARW, given the feedback has been so positive. But, just like Yes, they are currently a touring group playing the Yes back catalogue and not working together to create something new. I don't think that is likely to change, given that touring makes money, recording doesn't and the senior people in each band are from the era of record company advances. We'll see...

[Ken Baird]

I now regret not seeing ARW, given the feedback has been so positive. But, just like Yes, they are currently a touring group playing the Yes back catalogue and not working together to create something new. I don't think that is likely to change, given that touring makes money, recording doesn't and the senior people in each band are from the era of record company advances. We'll see...

And Anderson was saying things like "I'm not sure what form the music release will take" implying that it might be a track here and there, possibly not a full album. It seems to indicate they're a bit worried about losing money on it or not making enough due to the state of the music business these days.

[Scott Bails]

And Anderson was saying things like "I'm not sure what form the music release will take" implying that it might be a track here and there, possibly not a full album. It seems to indicate they're a bit worried about losing money on it or not making enough due to the state of the music business these days.

Remember, Anderson didn't want to record an album with Yes after the relative failure of Magnification, which contributed to his bandmates moving on without him.

[yamishogun]

And Anderson was saying things like "I'm not sure what form the music release will take" implying that it might be a track here and there, possibly not a full album.

But there is also Rabin saying half of "the album" was essentially done in October. A full album can mean anything from 35 to 70 minutes of music. Through the mist I see ... a 42:39 album. I can hear... wow! This is great! But... oh no, Wakeman is overplaying again!!"

[Orcopian]

If ARW did produce an album what would success look like for the average PE reader? Would the avoidance of a heaven and earth type stinker be enough? With Trevor Rabin involved I would imagine anything they produced would be weighted towards the yes west template, but is that where Jon and Rick are creatively? Maybe Roine Stolte could add some symphonic sparkle and play bass (as he did for Steve Hackett). The options are endless.

[Sean]

He's not really very convincing on bass. IMO I'd vote for Pomeroy anytime. He really IS a bass player, and it makes a difference.

[Orcopian]

Absolutely, Pomeroy was fantastic with ARW, also his playing on the last headspace album was excellent. Roine is a great guitarist and I thought he did OK with Hackett on bass but I take your point about him not being a real bass player. Of course it's never going to happen but the mentions of invention of knowledge in this thread got me thinking of possibilities.