This is fun reading, Steve: http://mashable.com/2014/03/06/kicks...c-burns-books/Originally Posted by Steve F.
I've had passing experience with musicians who shall remain nameless, who copped similar attitudes when they were unable to deliver on pledges after an extended period of time (nothing that devolved into torching of merch though!).
If you're actually reading this then chances are you already have my last album but if NOT and you're curious:
https://battema.bandcamp.com/
Also, Ephemeral Sun: it's a thing and we like making things that might be your thing: https://ephemeralsun.bandcamp.com
Wow. That's one hell of a story. What an asshole.
Music isn't about chops, or even about talent - it's about sound and the way that sound communicates to people. Mike Keneally
And that shit is legal? Isn't he a fraud?
"The White Zone is for loading and unloading only. If you got to load or unload go to the White Zone!"
maybe he's talking about thesepeeps__140422233738.jpg
I doubt he (or she?) was fraudulent; just some character who saw KS as a great way to make money without having to worry about pesky things like business plans, actual execution, and the like. I have dealt with musicians who had similar attitudes; all sorts of "hey, support us and be a part of the music-making process" at the start of a pledge campaign, and then after time (and multiple deadlines) had passed, suddenly they're talking as if pledges are fascists/capitalists who are simply greedy and unrealistic to have ANY expectations at all.
The main thing I took away from that story when I first read it, is that KS isn't like buying on Amazon; you aren't protected by any money-back guarantees or price matching or dispute arbitration. It's more like a spec deal. Even if the fundraising goal is met, there's no rock-solid guarantee that anything will actually come of it. And KS isn't going to police that. Like a few folks said, you can try and sue but that's more or a personal choice.
Most of my fundraising support has gone well for me. I've got one right now that is a potential dud (the new Goblin campaign on PledgeMusic seems to be stalled), but even there, if it blows up then that's my bad for supporting a bad plan to start with.
And sometimes folks can turn things around nicely, and have some fun with it: http://www.theverge.com/2014/10/1/68...k-danger-brown
If you're actually reading this then chances are you already have my last album but if NOT and you're curious:
https://battema.bandcamp.com/
Also, Ephemeral Sun: it's a thing and we like making things that might be your thing: https://ephemeralsun.bandcamp.com
Um....what part of that isn't fraudulent?
Music isn't about chops, or even about talent - it's about sound and the way that sound communicates to people. Mike Keneally
If he's destroying merchandise that people paid for, instead of shipping it to them, how is that not fraudulent?
"The White Zone is for loading and unloading only. If you got to load or unload go to the White Zone!"
Well, there are folks on here who are a bit more legally-knowledgeable than I am...to me, fraud implies there was never any intention of fulfilling pledges, and the plan was simply to take the $$ and run. I see these folks as, frankly, idiots who talk big but have no idea how to realize this stuff (they think they do, until it actually comes times to execute). And then, instead of owning up to those mistakes, it becomes a giant defensive tirade against "the man" and "capitalism run amok" and all that nonsense. After all, all those high & mighty morals weren't exactly present when they were asking fans for coin.
So don't get me wrong, I'm not defending these sorts of asshats. I see it less as fraud than gross negligent stupidity
If you're actually reading this then chances are you already have my last album but if NOT and you're curious:
https://battema.bandcamp.com/
Also, Ephemeral Sun: it's a thing and we like making things that might be your thing: https://ephemeralsun.bandcamp.com
Truth be told, that part I don't know where that falls in terms of legality. To me that was an insanely dumb move on his/her part, and would definitely give them little/no leverage were they to be sued.
I read further...according to the organizer he/she (some articles indicate this was actually a woman) is effectively bankrupt and don't have the resources to even do shipping. And eventually, despite all the big bluster, they updated the campaign with a cryptic messages to pledgers that "anyone who still wants a book can have one" but with no instructions on how to get one.
If you're actually reading this then chances are you already have my last album but if NOT and you're curious:
https://battema.bandcamp.com/
Also, Ephemeral Sun: it's a thing and we like making things that might be your thing: https://ephemeralsun.bandcamp.com
The agreements and contracts made through KS are legal and binding. If the guy said "Send me $$ and I'll send you a book" and you send him $ he owes you a book. The thing is, if he screws you you can't sue or go after KS. You have to sue the artist directly.
And who's going to sue over a $50 book....
Music isn't about chops, or even about talent - it's about sound and the way that sound communicates to people. Mike Keneally
Yep, sadly true.
If you're actually reading this then chances are you already have my last album but if NOT and you're curious:
https://battema.bandcamp.com/
Also, Ephemeral Sun: it's a thing and we like making things that might be your thing: https://ephemeralsun.bandcamp.com
"The White Zone is for loading and unloading only. If you got to load or unload go to the White Zone!"
The succinct bit written above could also represent the encapsulated postings of a number of folks found right here....
Steve F.
www.waysidemusic.com
www.cuneiformrecords.com
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
“Remember, if it doesn't say "Cuneiform," it's not prog!” - THE Jed Levin
Any time any one speaks to me about any musical project, the one absolute given is "it will not make big money". [tip of the hat to HK]
"Death to false 'support the scene' prog!"
please add 'imo' wherever you like, to avoid offending those easily offended.
You could go class action, maybe...
Cheers
If you're actually reading this then chances are you already have my last album but if NOT and you're curious:
https://battema.bandcamp.com/
Also, Ephemeral Sun: it's a thing and we like making things that might be your thing: https://ephemeralsun.bandcamp.com
In the UK, we have the small claims court system. Very easy to do.
Henry
Where Are They Now? Yes news: http://www.bondegezou.co.uk/wh_now.htm
Blogdegezou, the accompanying blog: http://bondegezou.blogspot.com/
This is why my Kickstarter lady that i have raised £40,000 for chose "not to go it alone" as she herself said she would have totally underestimated on studio time, engineers, mixing and good quality session guys etc, as well as the cost of shipping and actually "fulfilling" the Pledges, its not just about raising the money to "make the album" --its all the other costs and actually fulfilling the pledges. I think it can be a license to pluck a figure out of thin air in some cases.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
Bookmarks