The two most obnoxious people I've come across were at Slippermen and The Watch Plays Genesis. Drunk fiftysomething men behaving like juveniles.Originally Posted by PotatoSolution
The two most obnoxious people I've come across were at Slippermen and The Watch Plays Genesis. Drunk fiftysomething men behaving like juveniles.
Interviewer of reprobate ne'er-do-well musicians of the long-haired rock n' roll persuasion at: www.velvetthunder.co.uk and former scribe at Classic Rock Society. Only vaguely aware of anything other than music.
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So I learned from this book that Eddie van halen is a fan of genesis. He contacted mike about doing an album. Mike flew to LA and jammed with him. But EVH likes working at 2 am and Mile couldn't handle the hours and didn't think the jams were working so flew back to the UK after a couple of days.
The only reason that doesn't surprise me is because of Eddie's contributions to Thomas Dolby's music. I think of Dolby as fairly prog, really, and it's cool that Eddie Van Halen played some solos for him.
CTTOI, at a recent Musical Box show there was this drunk adult guy who was moving around way too much in his seat, and the woman in the seat next to him I guess asked him to reign it in, and he yelled something like "you're the kind of person who has to ruin everything, you bitch!" But it was clear they'd never met before. This guys seemed not just drunk, but dumb. How do you get dumb prog fans who are in the know enough to go see a Canadian Genesis tribute band?
I remember hearing that EVH liked Brand X.
Some other factoids from Ruthy's book:
Genesis used to own a brothel in Dallas, Texas.
The Rolling Stones rented the Genesis lighting rig for one of their world tours. Mike was amused by the thought of the Rolling Stones writing big checks to Genesis.
Mike thought Voyage of the Acolyte was a decent album, but noted that Steve never paid him and Phil for playing on it. He didn't like the timing either, since it was made after Peter left and they needed all hands on deck.
Seems like Phil and Mike were the big druggies in the band. Peter and Tony were pretty straight laced.
He said Peter had a very extroverted personality. That was the opposite of what I had always heard. He said Peter was quiet around the band because they would fight so easy, but outside of the band Peter would always walk up to people and introduce himself and could talk at length about anything.
Elton John thought it was great and unique that Genesis ended their shows with an instrumental - Los Endos.
It didn't seem like they had much money all the way up through the Seconds Out era. They were playing before big crowds, but they spent the concert receipts on their big stage production. Their reputation as a live act enabled them to go from a small cult following into a big live act, but they weren't selling many records still. I believe Mike still had roommates in his London apartment up to that era (one was a gay dude who brought blokes home to bugger all the time. This guy didn't have much money either and started paying Mike with cocaine). Mike got married in 1977-78 and bought a house, but only had about 5 grand to his name and got a mortgage for 40 pounds or something like that.
Genesis hired a roadie who was really their American drug supplier. Pink Floyd hired the same guy for the same purpose. He eventually got a job in the post office.
He is good buds with Banks, but paints him in an unflattering light in this book I thought. You come away thinking Banks is a whiney pussy. He adores Phil though.
It's an interesting question -- would Genesis have used any of the Acolyte material on ATOTT? I have this vision of them hearing the demos and saying, "Nah, Steve, forget it" and going ahead with what they eventually ended up with. Maybe "Ace of Wands" or "Star of Sirius" would have been modified a little for inclusion, I suppose.
"Arf." -- Frank Zappa, "Beauty Knows No Pain" (live version)
I don't know if I'd call Banks a "pussy" but whiney? Perhaps. One thing about Banks is that he's stubborn and he is convinced he's right. I get that from watching interviews with him. There's an interesting bit of video of the three members of Genesis with an engineer listening back to, I think, a track from Duke, working on the mix. Phil keeps raising one of the pots on the mixer, presumably the drums, and every time he does this you see Banks' eyes shift over to note it. I can almost hear him thinking, "All right we'll have to bring that one down later to a more reasonable level."
There are three people I interviewed for the VdGG book years ago who know the Genesis guys well and worked with them a lot in the early years and still stay in touch with members of the group (obviously they worked with VdGG also). I've heard from all pretty much exactly what you just wrote about TB and PC. Phil is loved by all; Banks... errrrr.
Also surprising to see that Mike speaks of Gabriel being an extrovert; not what I've always heard, but he would know. I was told that in the very early days of Charisma, Gabriel would watch Hammill perform with VdGG from the side of the stage and that helped him come out of his shell a bit performance-wise (Hammill was a very charismatic frontman, tearing around the stage, etc)
I just finished reading the book and, while I usually get bored with endless descriptions of drug use, I found it refreshing that Rutherford was so open about his drug and alcohol use, as well with his interactions and descriptions of bandmates. I used to look at his photos from the 70s and he often looked very stoned. But given his wealth and status, I was surprised he was so candid about his wild past.
As for Banks, he is who he is and I will always love his playing no matter his personality. It would be interesting to read his take on things.
Last edited by the winter tree; 02-10-2014 at 08:56 PM.
I saw them at Saratoga NY on the DUKE tour and some idiot lobbed an M80 or M100 off the balcony and it exploded right above the band. They didn't miss a beat but I was watching Banks when it exploded and he almost jumped out of his skin. It was in an amphitheater which made it even louder. I was surprised that they didn't stop playing and walk off.
What's Mike's connection with status in British society?
I've got a bike you can ride it if you like
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ ;-)
I seem to recall that EVH was inspired by Hackett to start tapping. Could very well be mistaken, however.
Music isn't about chops, or even about talent - it's about sound and the way that sound communicates to people. Mike Keneally
Huh?
Yep, true story.
One of the directors of Showco, the lighting company Genesis used, persuaded them to go in on an investment opportunity in a soon-to-be-rejuvenated Dallas (this was the 70s), so they partnered in owning a car park and a hotel run by a guy named The Chinaman. Mike notes:
Thinking about it, his name should have probably been a clue, but The Chinaman always paid his rent on time and in cash, so no questions got asked. He had a good run of five years or so before anyone got wise to the fact that he was running a whorehouse.
Interviewer of reprobate ne'er-do-well musicians of the long-haired rock n' roll persuasion at: www.velvetthunder.co.uk and former scribe at Classic Rock Society. Only vaguely aware of anything other than music.
*** Join me in the Garden of Delights for 3 hours of tune-spinning... every Saturday at 5pm EST on Deep Nuggets radio! www.deepnuggets.com ***
It was Billy Gibbons that inspired the tapping. EVH was way into Holdsworth, I know that. He was going to produce an album for him, but Allan got impatient waiting for Ed to get off tour or something and moved on without him.
Back on topic - I think I'll be making this my first Kindle book purchase.
Well, Billy Gibbons may have inspired him, but according to Steve in an interview on UltimateGuitar.com:
"Eddie and I have never spoken about it, but yes, he has credited me with tapping"
I think that I'll pick this up, too. Sounds like a good read. And it doesn't seem as if there are too many quotes from Mike about how the early songs are "too busy", thankfully.
neil
There really aren't any of those. He does say this about their early songwriting / recording, though:
"We’d been playing Trespass live for a long time before we went into the studio and as a result it felt like performing, not creating. The feeling of freedom on every album since has been wonderful by comparison. The real problem, however, was the material itself. Because none of us really knew how to write a song, we’d each write bits. We’d then go and fight the others about which bits we should use, always arguing that our own bit was ‘for the good of the band’ (we were still just devious schoolboys at heart). One for all and all for one, but mostly every man for himself. This was one of the reasons why our early songs were so long: we’d just keep adding bits. Long songs might appear clever and hard to write but for us they were easy. We’d just take bit A and bit D and segue them together. What we didn’t realize was that it was generally better if you didn’t try to use the whole alphabet every time. A prime example was the opening track on the album, ‘Looking for Someone’. It started with Pete’s idea and began with just simple piano chords and voice – such a Pete thing. If I had it now, it’d be a fabulous song as I could make something out of just the first couple of bits. Back then we rambled on with another eight minutes, throwing in bits and pieces. We were determined to prove ourselves and, while Pete always realized that space in a track was important, the idea that less is more was completely alien to the rest of us. ‘Stagnation’ was another example: we should have limited ourselves to two guitars but instead we used about ten. The result was that they all ended up cancelling each other out on record and the final thing sounded so muted you couldn’t hear anything properly." Rutherford, Mike (2014-01-23). The Living Years (p. 72). Constable. Kindle Edition.
I disagree. I think ADD bit-based writing and a dozen guitar overdubs is always the way to go.
it wasn't a very big whore house, in fact you could say it was little, but it was considered the best in TexasYep, true story.
One of the directors of Showco, the lighting company Genesis used, persuaded them to go in on an investment opportunity in a soon-to-be-rejuvenated Dallas (this was the 70s), so they partnered in owning a car park and a hotel run by a guy named The Chinaman. Mike notes:
Thinking about it, his name should have probably been a clue, but The Chinaman always paid his rent on time and in cash, so no questions got asked. He had a good run of five years or so before anyone got wise to the fact that he was running a whorehouse.
Compact Disk brought high fidelity to the masses and audiophiles will never forgive it for that
Yep. Rutherford would kill 'Looking For Someone', by his description. What he doesn't take into consideration is that the bits from the different writers actually put more variety into a particular piece of music, and lends itself to repeated listens. Different moods within the same song are okay. More than okay, often enough. And the blended guitars in Stagnation are fantastic. I can't allow myself to even imagine the sacrilege that would result from a 3 minute Mike and the Mechanics style version of either of these songs.
And personally, I think even Mike's beautiful 'Ripples' would be (comparatively) nothing without Tony's stunningly beautiful instrumental section.
He wouldn't kill it. He'd just turn it into a so-so R&B-flavored pop song.
And yeah, culling the layered 12-strings would basically be castrating one of the things that made early Genesis so special. Way to go, Mike!
I'm holding out for the Wilson-mixed 5.1 super-duper walletbuster special anniversary extra adjectives edition.
Well there ya go!Ace Frehley was doing it as far back as '75 too.
I have to say, I've always been surprised Phil Collins has copped so much flak when you look at Mike and the Mechanics- the most 'commercial' side-project any member of Genesis has been involved with, by far. I have enjoyed a small handful of their singles ('Silent Running', 'The Living Years', 'Word Of Mouth', 'Another Cup Of Coffee', 'Over My Shoulder') but they are very middle-of-the-road most of the time. By contrast most of Phil's albums have at least something a little more off the beaten track on there...even the ultra-pop 'No Jacket Required' has 'Long Long Way To Go' which is a very atmospheric track, I think. 'Take Me Home' I've always liked too.
'Ripples' is maybe my favourite Genesis song, but as strong as the song is, a lot of that is down to the instrumental section. It's a mesmerising piece of music, and the lead-in back to the chorus at the end is lovely.
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