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Thread: FEATURED CD : UK : Danger Money

  1. #1
    Moderator Duncan Glenday's Avatar
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    FEATURED CD : UK : Danger Money

    Credit for this featured CD : Mythos

    Based on a CD received from the collection bequeathed to Progressive Ears by the late Chris Buckley (Winkersnuff)

    Mythos's comments:[/TD]


    1st up for review from the CD’s received so graciously from the Chris Buckley (Winkersnuff) bequeathed collection is:
    UK – Danger Money

    The first UK release (simply entitled “UK”) featured and amazing line-up and I recall buying the LP when it was first released (1978). The line-up featured Bruford, Wetton, Holdsworth and Jobson, every one of them a legendary progressive music contributor. That firs release was great and I eagerly awaited their second release, in 1979.

    I believe that Bruford and Holdsworth had other commitments and could not dedicate the time on a second album, so Wetton and Jobson recruited Terry Bozzio to drum and decided to go with strong keyboards and violin in place of the guitar lines (big mistake)…

    I bought the second album, but did not like it and it sat on my record shelf for the last 40 years without a “listen”. I sold off my entire collection in early 2021.

    I played the CD twice in its entirety in my car (the one with the $9k stereo upgrade) and while I was mildly impressed with the instrumentation, the vocals (sorry Bill) were quite wimpy and without a guitar driving the songs they are all quite lackluster, especially when compared to the first release!

    As for the songs, there are two around 4 minutes, one at 5 minutes, two around 8 minutes and one over 12 minutes. Carrying the Cross (@ 12:20) was by far my fav and features some great instrumental passages. As I said the instrumentation is quite good, Jobson certainly gets to stretch his capabilities on violin and keyboards, Dales husband (lol) is quite competent with his drumming, and Wetton is Wetton on bass, it’s just that when this CD was released, progressive music was declining and I don’t feel this CD has held up well…

    Also included with my CD, was a ticket sub, where I assume Chris saw them live back in May-2012 and since the ticket is marked $75, I assume he had a great view!

    I can’t really recommend this CD, but I’m sure there are some that do and would love it, so I will play-it-forward and if someone here wants it (or better yet - has one of Chris’ CDs that they also want to move along) hit me up with a message and I will gladly make arrangements to pass it along.
    Regards,

    Duncan

  2. #2
    Insect Overlord Progatron's Avatar
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    I love this album, although it is a half-step down from the debut to me.

    As for Bruford and Holdsworth having 'other commitments', I think it's more accurate to say they weren't as welcome as they used to be, what with their disapproval of the more commercial direction Jobson and Wetton wanted to move in. I believe Bruford once described it as heading towards 'Asia territory' (which is a stretch IMO but I get his point). I don't think Wetton ever truly felt at home with the more challenging or complex prog-rock stuff. Not that he wasn't capable of playing it, but just that it wasn't where his heart lay. That's always been my impression, anyway.
    Interviewer of reprobate ne'er-do-well musicians of the long-haired rock n' roll persuasion at: www.velvetthunder.co.uk and former scribe at Classic Rock Society. Only vaguely aware of anything other than music.

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    Very good follow up album to the first UK, which was a masterpiece in my view. Obviously, it misses Holdsworth and Bruford but it still captures some of that same sound, with some shorter tunes being somewhat of a drawback. "Carrying The Cross" is a true classic and I also liked the title cut as well as "The Only Thing She Needs". However, on an overall basis, it is almost impossible to expect this line-up to match or exceed the greatness of the first one.

    A while ago there was a thread that discussed both the UK studio albums in some depth. That's a good one to refer to for a well-rounded discussion.

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    Insect Overlord Progatron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SunRunner2 View Post
    A while ago there was a thread that discussed both the UK studio albums in some depth. That's a good one to refer to for a well-rounded discussion.
    Indeed, a good one:

    https://www.progressiveears.org/foru...s-Danger-Money
    Interviewer of reprobate ne'er-do-well musicians of the long-haired rock n' roll persuasion at: www.velvetthunder.co.uk and former scribe at Classic Rock Society. Only vaguely aware of anything other than music.

    'The best stuff is really when Mick Pointer was a baby, banging on pots and pans. That was their most "out there" stuff.' - JKL2000

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    Member adap2it's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duncan Glenday View Post
    Credit for this featured CD : Mythos

    Based on a CD received from the collection bequeathed to Progressive Ears by the late Chris Buckley (Winkersnuff)

    Mythos's comments:[/TD]


    1st up for review from the CD’s received so graciously from the Chris Buckley (Winkersnuff) bequeathed collection is:
    UK – Danger Money


    Also included with my CD, was a ticket sub, where I assume Chris saw them live back in May-2012 and since the ticket is marked $75, I assume he had a great view!
    If that show was in Toronto...yes, he had a great view! and it was a killer show!
    Last edited by Duncan Glenday; 12-05-2021 at 12:20 PM.
    Dave Sr.

    I prefer Nature to Human Nature

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    Love this album, I remember not liking Carrying No Cross at first but it grew on me after a while. A step down from the debut I agree but still very good.

  7. #7
    The Enemy God
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duncan Glenday View Post
    Credit for this featured CD : Mythos

    Based on a CD received from the collection bequeathed to Progressive Ears by the late Chris Buckley (Winkersnuff)

    Mythos's comments:[/TD]


    1st up for review from the CD’s received so graciously from the Chris Buckley (Winkersnuff) bequeathed collection is:
    UK – Danger Money

    The first UK release (simply entitled “UK”) featured and amazing line-up and I recall buying the LP when it was first released (1978). The line-up featured Bruford, Wetton, Holdsworth and Jobson, every one of them a legendary progressive music contributor. That firs release was great and I eagerly awaited their second release, in 1979.

    I believe that Bruford and Holdsworth had other commitments and could not dedicate the time on a second album, so Wetton and Jobson recruited Terry Bozzio to drum and decided to go with strong keyboards and violin in place of the guitar lines (big mistake)…

    I bought the second album, but did not like it and it sat on my record shelf for the last 40 years without a “listen”. I sold off my entire collection in early 2021.

    I played the CD twice in its entirety in my car (the one with the $9k stereo upgrade) and while I was mildly impressed with the instrumentation, the vocals (sorry Bill) were quite wimpy and without a guitar driving the songs they are all quite lackluster, especially when compared to the first release!

    As for the songs, there are two around 4 minutes, one at 5 minutes, two around 8 minutes and one over 12 minutes. Carrying the Cross (@ 12:20) was by far my fav and features some great instrumental passages. As I said the instrumentation is quite good, Jobson certainly gets to stretch his capabilities on violin and keyboards, Dales husband (lol) is quite competent with his drumming, and Wetton is Wetton on bass, it’s just that when this CD was released, progressive music was declining and I don’t feel this CD has held up well…

    Also included with my CD, was a ticket sub, where I assume Chris saw them live back in May-2012 and since the ticket is marked $75, I assume he had a great view!

    I can’t really recommend this CD, but I’m sure there are some that do and would love it, so I will play-it-forward and if someone here wants it (or better yet - has one of Chris’ CDs that they also want to move along) hit me up with a message and I will gladly make arrangements to pass it along.
    Great quote I remember about Bozzio on this album
    ‘ A nuclear power station in meltdown’
    The sheer commitment in his playing on here is astonishing.

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    Swimming against the tide I prefer this to the debut (and I also prefer the Bruford albums to the UK debut). Although some of it was around when Bruford and Holdsworth were still there.

    Other than 'Nothing To Lose' (by far the album's weakest track), I don't find the album to be 'proto-Asia' at all. It feels a lot more complex to me than anything Asia ever did. I like some of Asia's stuff for what it is, but this is better. A ballad like 'Rendezvous 6:02' has a lot more going on than- say- an Asia ballad like 'The Smile Has Left Your Eyes'.

    But having said all that, I still prefer what Wetton and Jobson had done earlier in the 70s in other groups. When I play the album now, I do find it a little on the noodly side for my current taste, particularly from Jobson.

  9. #9
    Member Kcrimso's Avatar
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    Fantastic album. About as good as the debut. "Carrying No Cross" is very impressive composition.
    My progressive music site: https://pienemmatpurot.com/

  10. #10
    It was the first UK album I had and the only one I own on vinyl and I really love it. A step up to the first one, I think.

  11. #11
    Parrots ripped my flesh Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
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    80% as good as the debut, which is astounding because Bruford and Holdworth were missing. I couldn't imagine putting it on the sell pile.

  12. #12
    Man of repute progmatist's Avatar
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    I would describe this as more rock, whereas the debut was more jazz. Holdsworth was a jazz guitarist, and Bruford is at heart a jazz drummer. Even in the early days of Yes, he considered himself primarily a jazz drummer.
    "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama

  13. #13
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    I always really liked the title track and rendevous 6:02
    Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines.

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    Love the debut but believe it or not, I've never heard this one. A power trio with no guitar player always felt suspicious to me. The absence of a guitarist usually makes the keyboard player feel he's allowed every possible excess (ELP...).

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by LeFrog View Post
    Love the debut but believe it or not, I've never heard this one. A power trio with no guitar player always felt suspicious to me. The absence of a guitarist usually makes the keyboard player feel he's allowed every possible excess (ELP...).
    Nothing wrong with keyboardplayers taking the lead.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rarebird View Post
    Nothing wrong with keyboardplayers taking the lead.
    In my view it gives way to prog's worst excesses

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Rarebird View Post
    Nothing wrong with keyboardplayers taking the lead.

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    Love the album. HATE the Jobson remaster--by far the worst remaster I have ever heard. It sounds like he accidentally bumped into a graphic eq and ended up with a random pattern.

    As for Holdsworth and Bruford, they were forced out of the band. According to a Wetton interview I saw, Wetton never checked in with Bruford properly and just assumed he would want to leave if Holdsworth was forced out. It turned out Bruford was willing to stay, but the management had already hired Bozio.

  19. #19
    Parrots ripped my flesh Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
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    Buford's version:

    Following a chaotic free concert at Penn’s Landing, Philadelphia, Wetton “fires” Bruford and Holdsworth, but the band limps on to its last gig in West Hartford, CT. on October 8th. A short, fiery furnace.

  20. #20
    That's Mr. to you, Sir!! Trane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SunRunner2 View Post
    A while ago there was a thread that discussed both the UK studio albums in some depth. That's a good one to refer to for a well-rounded discussion.
    yup, you never heard/read it better there. vdiable.gif
    my music collection increased tenfolds when I switched from drug-addicts to complete nutcases.

  21. #21
    Member Zeuhlmate's Avatar
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    As I recall it Jobson wanted Holdsworth to play the same solos live over and over and wasn't keen on a more improvisational approach to the tunes.
    Holdsworth found it too rigid.

    Danger Money isn't as interesting as the first, and it lacks another soloist, but never the less its quite good.

  22. #22
    Gave this a fresh spin last night after not hearing it for a while.

    For whatever reason, I've never really bonded with this album. In theory, it has all the elements I like, but something about it always comes up short. The compositions just seem strangely incomplete to me. Rendezvous 6:02 is the exception, and is the piece here that I think works best. The rest have some really interesting ideas, but something in the arrangements or during the solo sections leave me flat. In the case of the title track and Caesar's Palace Blues, it really feels like they could have used another voice, and overall I think they would have done well to have recruited another guitarist.

    As I've said before, I think Carrying No Cross sounds "cobbled together." There are some jaw-dropping moments, but that whole middle section just sounds like a bunch of parts that were stuck together for their "flash" appeal rather than to serve any real compositional purpose. I love having a little "flash" in the music, but here it's always just sounded empty to me, void of the sense of direction that ELP and Yes brought to their best music, and even UK on the first album.

    I try to take this one for what it is, and as I say, there are parts I really like. But I think it could have been better with another voice and perhaps a little more baking time on some of the arrangements.

    Bill

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sputnik View Post
    I love having a little "flash" in the music, but here it's always just sounded empty to me, void of the sense of direction that ELP and Yes brought to their best music
    I think it's a fair criticism. As I said I increasingly feel the same way about some of this album generally- more about virtuosity than experimentation. Certainly ELP and Yes' best work managed a balance of both. (Though one could say it's a better ELP album than what ELP themselves were doing in the late 70s. )

    I like 'The Only Thing She Needs' as a song- it was one of the tracks that was around with the previous line-up- but I'm not crazy about how it ends.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trane View Post
    yup, you never heard/read it better there. vdiable.gif
    Except that your and my (now classic) exchanges were deleted from that earlier UK thread.

  25. #25
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    I love this album; I had almost lost all expectations after the departures of Bruford and Holdsworth but was pleasantly surprised on how good it was!

    Never could not understand why no remastered or special edition had not yet been released until the UK Ultimate Collectors edition in 2016. But sadly with no bonus tracks.

    My favorites on the album are: "The Only thing she needs" and "Carrying no cross" that are show stopper epic songs, Terry Bozzio's drumming is stellar. Rendezvous 6:02 is a very nice interlude and also showcases John Wetton's amazing vocal performance.

    It is interesting to note that the "In Concert" bootleg version that was circulating around for some time, had the original quartet performing several songs for Danger Money live before its official release. And honestly, I prefer the studio versions.

    BTW, What does the cover mean?

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