Page 1 of 4 1234 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 85

Thread: FEATURED CD : Frank Zappa - Burnt Weenie Sandwich

  1. #1
    Moderator Duncan Glenday's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Frederick, MD
    Posts
    1,438

    FEATURED CD : Frank Zappa - Burnt Weenie Sandwich

    Credit for this featured CD : Jerjo

    Based on a CD received from the collection bequeathed to Progressive Ears by the late Chris Buckley (Winkersnuff)

    Jerjo's comments:



    “If you end up with a boring miserable life because you listened to your mom, your dad, your teacher, your priest, or some guy on television telling you how to do your shit, then you deserve it.”

    I’ll give this much to Zappa, Burnt Weenie Sandwich isn’t boring. First, a caveat. I’m not a Zappa fan. There was too much pointless buffoonery, his lyrics off had a truly puerile sense of humor. and just stop with the goddamn doowop tributes. And of course, this album starts and ends with doowop.

    There’s a lot of nonsense going on before Frank gets down to business. The wobbly doowop cover, two short nonsensical nods to Stravinsky, and “Overture to a Holiday in Berlin” that does nothing but waste the listener’s time. Ditto for “Aybe Sea”. This is exactly the crap that assaults me every time I attempt to listen to Frank, and it definitely keeps me away.

    The remaining instrumental pieces are quite good. There’s some spectacular playing and the compositions are well thought out. Some themes make me feel like I’m listening to a Hanna Barbera cartoon but most of it works. This is stuff I can return to now and then. The album ends with more bad doowop.

    This is probably going to be blasphemy for Zappa fans but that’s where I stand. I’ve tried a few times to “get into” Frank and he just doesn’t work for me. I first heard “Don’t Eat Yellow Snow” when I was fifteen and my first thought was that this song would have really worked for me when I was nine. I’ve tried several times as an adult to try and capture what I’ve been supposedly missing and all I have determined is that it’s not just for me. But it’s all subjective, isn’t it?
    Regards,

    Duncan

  2. #2
    Insect Overlord Progatron's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    southern Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    4,544
    I don't consider it so much 'blasphemy' (which I always consider a silly term when discussing musical taste), I just disagree. But then, I am a Zappa fan, and I *love* the song Valarie. Big fan of this album. Frank is not for everybody, no doubt about it.
    Interviewer of reprobate ne'er-do-well musicians of the long-haired rock n' roll persuasion at: www.velvetthunder.co.uk

  3. #3
    Member Steve F.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Fluffy Cloud
    Posts
    4,229
    One of the string of incredible and far-sighted greats from FZ between 1967-1969
    Steve F.

    www.waysidemusic.com
    www.cuneiformrecords.com

    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

    Any time any one speaks to me about any musical project, the one absolute given is "it will not make big money". [tip of the hat to HK]

    "Death to false 'support the scene' prog!"

    please add 'imo' wherever you like, to avoid offending those easily offended.

  4. #4
    Jazzbo manqué Mister Triscuits's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Utopia
    Posts
    3,682
    "Aybe Sea" is crap? "Igor's Boogie" nonsensical? Man, I'm afraid we cannot be friends.

    About that doo-wop: compare Zappa's cover to the original of "Valarie." Frank plays it straight, with a plaintive lead vocal and that lovely shimmering guitar. The Jackie & the Starlites version, all overwrought sobbing, sounds like a parody. Franks version is magisterial. On the other hand, if "W-P-L-J" doesn't make you smile, what does it take?

    This is a fucking masterwork of an album.

  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Isle of Bute
    Posts
    257
    I love this album but if I never hear any doo wop ever again that would be great.

  6. #6
    Member StarThrower's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Location
    Upstate NY
    Posts
    1,159
    Quote Originally Posted by lovecraft View Post
    I love this album but if I never hear any doo wop ever again that would be great.
    Just the opposite for me. I love FZ's doo wop covers. And everything else on this charming and varied collection.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Duncan Glenday View Post

    I’ll give this much to Zappa, Burnt Weenie Sandwich isn’t boring. First, a caveat. I’m not a Zappa fan. There was too much pointless buffoonery, his lyrics off had a truly puerile sense of humor. and just stop with the goddamn doowop tributes. And of course, this album starts and ends with doowop.
    I agree with most of those sentiments. I especially find the doo-wop stuff annoying, given Frank's attitude toward most everything that replaced doo-wop as the "music from America's youth". I'll take Scorpions over whoever it was who recorded the original version of WPLJ, that's for sure. But having said that, the doo-wop things are really well done. And at least here, it's not completely stupid like Cocksucker's Ball.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Triscuits View Post
    " On the other hand, if "W-P-L-J" doesn't make you smile, what does it take?
    It's an alright song. Yeah, I guess it makes me smile. I certainly never hit skip on it.

    BTW, something I've always wondered; what's the deal at the end of side two, just before Valarie starts, with the live recording where someone in the audience (presumably) is yelling at the stage, and Frank says something like "Don't kid yourself, everyone here is wearing a uniform". The frell was that all about!?

  9. #9
    I love it from start to finish, all included. Must have played it so many times, that the vinyl is by now indeed a Burnt Sandwich.

    Holiday in Berlin sends waves of happiness to my heart. How life affirmative this music is!

  10. #10
    Member adap2it's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Ontario Canada
    Posts
    1,062
    Quote Originally Posted by Duncan Glenday View Post
    Credit for this featured CD : Jerjo

    Based on a CD received from the collection bequeathed to Progressive Ears by the late Chris Buckley (Winkersnuff)

    Jerjo's comments:



    “If you end up with a boring miserable life because you listened to your mom, your dad, your teacher, your priest, or some guy on television telling you how to do your shit, then you deserve it.”

    I’ll give this much to Zappa, Burnt Weenie Sandwich isn’t boring. First, a caveat. I’m not a Zappa fan. There was too much pointless buffoonery, his lyrics off had a truly puerile sense of humor. and just stop with the goddamn doowop tributes. And of course, this album starts and ends with doowop.

    There’s a lot of nonsense going on before Frank gets down to business. The wobbly doowop cover, two short nonsensical nods to Stravinsky, and “Overture to a Holiday in Berlin” that does nothing but waste the listener’s time. Ditto for “Aybe Sea”. This is exactly the crap that assaults me every time I attempt to listen to Frank, and it definitely keeps me away.

    The remaining instrumental pieces are quite good. There’s some spectacular playing and the compositions are well thought out. Some themes make me feel like I’m listening to a Hanna Barbera cartoon but most of it works. This is stuff I can return to now and then. The album ends with more bad doowop.

    This is probably going to be blasphemy for Zappa fans but that’s where I stand. I’ve tried a few times to “get into” Frank and he just doesn’t work for me. I first heard “Don’t Eat Yellow Snow” when I was fifteen and my first thought was that this song would have really worked for me when I was nine. I’ve tried several times as an adult to try and capture what I’ve been supposedly missing and all I have determined is that it’s not just for me. But it’s all subjective, isn’t it?
    This exactly how I feel about FZ. Chris was a big fan and we discussed his music at great length. I like the instrumental stuff a lot and wish that his vocal output didn't define him as an artist.
    Dave Sr.

    I prefer Nature to Human Nature

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarGeek View Post
    BTW, something I've always wondered; what's the deal at the end of side two, just before Valarie starts, with the live recording where someone in the audience (presumably) is yelling at the stage, and Frank says something like "Don't kid yourself, everyone here is wearing a uniform". The frell was that all about!?
    This is from a concert at Royal Albert Hall in London (as are a few musical bits earlier in Little House). I haven't given this part a close listen in a while but the Donlope site has an attempted transcription of it (I guess the "Man In Uniform" was venue security):

    FZ: Thank you, good night . . . Thank you, if you'll . . . if you sit down and be quiet, we'll make an attempt to, ah, perform "Brown Shoes Don't Make It."
    Man In Uniform: Back on your seats, come on, we'll help you back to your seats, come on . . .
    Guy In The Audience: Take that man out of here! Oh! Go away! Take that uniform off man! Take off that uniform before it's fuckin' too late, man!
    FZ: Everybody in this room is wearing a uniform, and don't kid yourself.
    Guy In The Audience: . . . man!
    FZ: You'll hurt your throat, stop it!

    https://www.donlope.net/fz/lyrics/Bu...ch.html#Little

  12. #12
    Member StarThrower's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Location
    Upstate NY
    Posts
    1,159
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarGeek View Post

    BTW, something I've always wondered; what's the deal at the end of side two, just before Valarie starts, with the live recording where someone in the audience (presumably) is yelling at the stage, and Frank says something like "Don't kid yourself, everyone here is wearing a uniform". The frell was that all about!?
    It's pretty obvious if you listen closely. The person in question is not yelling at the stage but at a uniformed usher or policeman and mocking him for his attire which elicited Frank's response.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Triscuits View Post
    About that doo-wop: compare Zappa's cover to the original of "Valarie." Frank plays it straight, with a plaintive lead vocal and that lovely shimmering guitar. The Jackie & the Starlites version, all overwrought sobbing, sounds like a parody. Franks version is magisterial. On the other hand, if "W-P-L-J" doesn't make you smile, what does it take?
    I guess you know that there is an alternate "Valarie" as a bonus on Greasy Love Songs with FZ's parody of/tribute to the overwrought version.

  14. #14
    Jazzbo manqué Mister Triscuits's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Utopia
    Posts
    3,682
    Quote Originally Posted by pb2015 View Post
    This is from a concert at Royal Albert Hall in London (as are a few musical bits earlier in Little House). I haven't given this part a close listen in a while but the Donlope site has an attempted transcription of it (I guess the "Man In Uniform" was venue security)
    Zappa says it was "two London policemen--bobbies." They had just escorted off a kid who had jumped onto the stage.

  15. #15
    Ι have a soft spot for this album as it is the first Zappa album I purchased. And got infected.
    Macht das ohr auf!

    COSMIC EYE RECORDS

  16. #16
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    1,982
    Quote Originally Posted by adap2it View Post
    This exactly how I feel about FZ. Chris was a big fan and we discussed his music at great length. I like the instrumental stuff a lot and wish that his vocal output didn't define him as an artist.
    This is my take on Zappa as well; buffoonery, nonsense and a lot of novelty songs for 9 year old's. Some good songs here and there but way too sporadic for my ears to appreciate on a regular basis. I stay away from commenting on the many threads focusing on him as he is revered like nothing else on this site. Now, seeing some of the reactions to this album, I'm realize I'm not alone in my view.

  17. #17
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2021
    Location
    Molise
    Posts
    638
    After Zappa's phenomenal jazz-rock excursion on "Hot Rats", it was time again for a Mothers record; in terms of sound, the band is somewhere between the two previous albums, "Uncle Meat" & "Hot Rats": jazzy improvisations are combined with almost "classic" tracks and typical Zappa comical aspect, although it's not quite as experimental as with the former and not as energetic as at the latter. The album is framed by two doo-wop covers: "WPLJ (The Four Deuces)" and "Valarie (Jackie and the Starlites). In between there are thematically linked shorter tracks and a long track, similar to "Uncle Meat". "Igor's Boogie 1/2" is probably Zappa's homage to Igor Stravinsky: really short, little weird pieces for wind instruments and drums. "Overture to a Holiday in Berlin" and "Holiday In Berlin, Full-Blown" are wonderfully out of tune and burlesque sentimental salon waltzes, the second part also leading into a long guitar solo by Zappa.

    In addition "Theme from Burnt Weeny Sandwich", again mainly a guitar solo with percussion tinkling over two chords. "Aybe Sea" is a nice short track for acoustic guitar, spinet and piano. "The Little House I Used to Live in" also begins with a calm, jazzy solo piano by Ian Underwood and, after a thoroughly composed, hectic part featuring "Uncle Meat"-like melodies, develops into great "Hot Rats"-like solos by Zappa, Sugar Cane Harris (violin) and Don Preston (piano).

    All in all, "Burnt Weeny Sandwich" is again a really great Zappa & The Mothers record with lots of beautiful moments, but, in my humble opinion, it doesn't seem quite as succinct compared to its two predecessors, although it still works nicely.

  18. #18
    Just heard the opening-track on YouTube and I like it. Nothing wrong with some Doo-wop, though it brings the late Proggeezer to my mind.

  19. #19
    Parrots ripped my flesh Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    42°09′30″N 71°08′43″W
    Posts
    4,268
    Ahem.

    weeny.jpg

  20. #20
    Jazzbo manqué Mister Triscuits's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Utopia
    Posts
    3,682
    Trivia note: Cal Schenkel's cover collage was originally intended for an Eric Dolphy release on the Moop label, a business partnership between Zappa and Alan Douglas that never got off the ground. Zappa repurposed the artwork for Burnt Weeny Sandwich, and Douglas released the Dolphy tapes on his own label as Iron Man.

  21. #21
    Member StarThrower's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Location
    Upstate NY
    Posts
    1,159
    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Triscuits View Post
    Trivia note: Cal Schenkel's cover collage was originally intended for an Eric Dolphy release on the Moop label, a business partnership between Zappa and Alan Douglas that never got off the ground. Zappa repurposed the artwork for Burnt Weeny Sandwich, and Douglas released the Dolphy tapes on his own label as Iron Man.
    Interesting bit of history! I love that Iron Man album.

  22. #22
    Nothing wrong with some good old-fashioned buffoonery and nonsense in music. Unless everyone has to be making "serious music" all the time. I know that "prog" is serious business to some.

    Zappa made plenty of "serious music" in his lifetime too. A genius composer. Someone truly progressive in the field of rock music.

    I don't enjoy his gutter humor. But the stuff he did just to be silly? Yeah, I love that stuff. I don't care if songs like "Montana" and "Greggery Peccary" sound childish because of high-pitched voices and weird sound effects and absurd, goofball humor -- I've moved past the aversion to (and fear of) enjoying things that might be considered "childish".

    If that makes me a 9-year-old mentally, I'm actually fine with that.

    Burnt Weeny Sandwich is a masterpiece, far ahead of its time. No time spent listening to it is wasted.
    "what's better, peanut butter or g-sharp minor?"
    - Sturgeon's Lawyer, 2021

  23. #23
    Parrots ripped my flesh Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    42°09′30″N 71°08′43″W
    Posts
    4,268
    I never got around to getting Iron Man because when I looked into it I found out there was a newer 3-disc set Musical Prophet that was supposed to include the same material with better sound, but all the clips are mono and the clips of Iron Man are in stereo, so I got fed up and didn't get anything.

  24. #24
    Member Steve F.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Fluffy Cloud
    Posts
    4,229
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave (in MA) View Post
    I never got around to getting Iron Man because when I looked into it I found out there was a newer 3-disc set Musical Prophet that was supposed to include the same material with better sound, but all the clips are mono and the clips of Iron Man are in stereo, so I got fed up and didn't get anything.


    The original stereo masters are lost or misplaced. I have a mid 70s issue, obviously properly made from the stereo masters.

    IMO, Ressonance made the right call; great mono definitely beats mediocre stereo.
    Last edited by Steve F.; 3 Weeks Ago at 05:51 PM.
    Steve F.

    www.waysidemusic.com
    www.cuneiformrecords.com

    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

    Any time any one speaks to me about any musical project, the one absolute given is "it will not make big money". [tip of the hat to HK]

    "Death to false 'support the scene' prog!"

    please add 'imo' wherever you like, to avoid offending those easily offended.

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Monet View Post
    After Zappa's phenomenal jazz-rock excursion on "Hot Rats", it was time again for a Mothers record;
    The Hot Rats Sessions box includes some material related to Burnt Weeny (some parts are from the same sessions).

    This outtake has Zappa's guitar solo from the title piece in its original context, and also some stuff from Lumpy Gravy. Too bad this hasn't shown up on an official release yet.


Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •