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Thread: Yes- From A Page- Released to digital formats

  1. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by flatliner View Post
    But they released it to streaming now, which is the least amount of money for them for any format. Makes no sense....though I’m listening to it now on Amazon....very good!
    It was initially only available directly from the band. Then they made it available through Burning Shed. Some time later, they are making it more widely available. This is a standard tactic: early release for those who will pay more, later release for those who will pay less. Get everyone who will pay the higher price to pay, then make it available at a lower price for those who were never going to pay the higher price.

    Having done an early physical release, presumably the market for a physical release through a label with wider distribution is limited, but there is a market for a digital release. A digital release may have better margins than a physical release through a label. But, as you say, they've also made it available on streaming, which is lousy for generating income. I presume they'll have made what they wanted to make through the earlier physical release, so now the focus is on the other possible benefits of streaming.

    Henry
    Where Are They Now? Yes news: http://www.bondegezou.co.uk/wh_now.htm
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  2. #27
    Member Top Cat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bondegezou View Post
    It was initially only available directly from the band. Then they made it available through Burning Shed. Some time later, they are making it more widely available. This is a standard tactic: early release for those who will pay more, later release for those who will pay less. Get everyone who will pay the higher price to pay, then make it available at a lower price for those who were never going to pay the higher price.

    Having done an early physical release, presumably the market for a physical release through a label with wider distribution is limited, but there is a market for a digital release. A digital release may have better margins than a physical release through a label. But, as you say, they've also made it available on streaming, which is lousy for generating income. I presume they'll have made what they wanted to make through the earlier physical release, so now the focus is on the other possible benefits of streaming.

    Henry
    I figure the way the music industry is today, bands and record companies have to be as creative as possible to generate income from their product.
    I remember Dave Kerzner talking on Facebook one day about sending his album to have cds made, and it's a delicate line one has to walk to decide or predict how many will be needed.
    Normally, you order in batches, and the more you order, the less you pay per batch. But there is always the worry you won't sell them all, ask some of our musicians in here, how it feels to have boxes of left over cds sitting in their basement.

    What you write makes sense, in getting the most out of the initial release from fans who will pay the prices. Nothing wrong with that, it's good business sense.
    Streaming? might as well hand the few pennies you get from Spotify over to a charity.
    Soundcloud page: Richard Hermans, musical meanderings https://soundcloud.com/precipice Bandcamp: https://richardhermans.bandcamp.comYouTube: https://youtu.be/F34jl6fQVmA

  3. #28
    ^ It's telling, I think, that Yes self-released Return Trip and From a Page, but signed to BMG for The Royal Affair Tour: Live from Las Vegas, a live album from the next tour and possibly a new studio album. That makes sense to me. RT and FaP are both great projects to my ears, but spin-offs projects from new studio work do not have the same appeal as live albums, which seem to sell much better to the general public, or presumably as a proper new studio album.

    Artists want to reach a big audience. But they also deserve to make a decent amount from their music. The fundamental economic problem is that you have one product but a range of price points your audience are willing to pay. Sell it at a high price, you'll get some some buyers, but lose out on others. Sell it at a low price, you'll get more buyers, but there's a bunch of people who would have happily paid more. The music industry has developed two solutions to this. One is to vary the product to appeal to different price points (deluxe edition with bonus tracks, art prints and signatures versus a regular release versus a digital release). The other is early release: those who will pay more get it a couple of years earlier.

    Henry
    Where Are They Now? Yes news: http://www.bondegezou.co.uk/wh_now.htm
    Blogdegezou, the accompanying blog: http://bondegezou.blogspot.com/

  4. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    What you write makes sense, in getting the most out of the initial release from fans who will pay the prices. Nothing wrong with that, it's good business sense.
    Streaming? might as well hand the few pennies you get from Spotify over to a charity.
    When it comes to streaming, I think it's more about reaching a wider audience than making any kind of serious income. That's the reason why Steven Wilson eventually decided to go with it.

  5. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by dregsfan View Post
    ^ Part of your preference has to be Steve and Alan being 10 years younger than today. Chris > Billy, Oliver maybe slightly better than Geoff, Jon D. a wash with Benoit.
    Agree and well, it makes a hell of a big difference...

    v

  6. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    I figure the way the music industry is today, bands and record companies have to be as creative as possible to generate income from their product.
    I remember Dave Kerzner talking on Facebook one day about sending his album to have cds made, and it's a delicate line one has to walk to decide or predict how many will be needed.
    Normally, you order in batches, and the more you order, the less you pay per batch. But there is always the worry you won't sell them all, ask some of our musicians in here, how it feels to have boxes of left over cds sitting in their basement.

    What you write makes sense, in getting the most out of the initial release from fans who will pay the prices. Nothing wrong with that, it's good business sense.
    Streaming? might as well hand the few pennies you get from Spotify over to a charity.
    This explains why a lot of our local bands for the last couple of years had stacks of CD's at their table for free..

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by aith01 View Post
    When it comes to streaming, I think it's more about reaching a wider audience than making any kind of serious income. That's the reason why Steven Wilson eventually decided to go with it.
    Yep, at least people hear the music that they would otherwise have not. Also, there's a (slim?) chance that some of the streamers will buy physical copies if they like what they hear

  8. #33
    I had given this music the widest berth, never even bothering with Live In Lyon, there were just too many Yes live releases by then. However Iíve just given it my first listen and I have to say itís a lot better than I expected. The studio songs are interesting and showed promise for the lineup. I had to double check the lineup for the live album, Alan sounds really good and itís such a shame he has had those health issues slowing him down in more recent tours. All in all, I listened on streaming, but Iíll pick this set up too, itís a worthwhile addition to my Yes collection.

  9. #34
    Member gearHed289's Avatar
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    I like the new tracks, but I had completely forgotten that the set included those live tracks! There's something odd about the mix, I'll have to give it another listen, but the performances are good. I sometimes forgot that it's not Jon A singing. And there were a few moments where it sounded like a woman was singing.

  10. #35
    Mod or rocker? Mocker. Frumious B's Avatar
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    In my perfect world all new releases would have an option for purchasing a CD plus lossless file bundle. I’ve made a few purchases that had this as a choice on Bandcamp and it was the best. I still really like From A Page. It’s a much better farewell type release for Chris Squire than Heaven & Earth was. The EP tracks aren’t life changing, but they are highly listenable and “Gift Of Love”, especially, has that Beatles/Beach Boys thread working that runs through much of my favorite Yes music. Also, Lyon is really the only post Anderson live album that I can enjoy front to back.
    "It was a cruel song, but fair."-Roger Waters

  11. #36
    Member Rajaz's Avatar
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    This release is an oddity; it only has a handful of unreleased tracks and is mostly comprised of the contents from previously released live material from the In the present Live at Lyon CDs.

    Of the four songs (one is repeated), To the Moment is for me, the best. At least, Benoit and Oliver have left their mark in Yes recorded history not only as live performers but also as composers.

    If this would have happened in the 70-80's, it could have been an EP and it could have been a shorter CD now. So if this is not being released widely, why repeat the live tracks?
    I would buy this just to have the Roger Dean cover besides those 4 great songs but I see that the live stuff is only been cut & paste on it to justify a possible commercial release in the future.

  12. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Rajaz View Post
    This release is an oddity; it only has a handful of unreleased tracks and is mostly comprised of the contents from previously released live material from the In the present Live at Lyon CDs.

    Of the four songs (one is repeated), To the Moment is for me, the best. At least, Benoit and Oliver have left their mark in Yes recorded history not only as live performers but also as composers.

    If this would have happened in the 70-80's, it could have been an EP and it could have been a shorter CD now. So if this is not being released widely, why repeat the live tracks?
    I would buy this just to have the Roger Dean cover besides those 4 great songs but I see that the live stuff is only been cut & paste on it to justify a possible commercial release in the future.
    I think the answer to that goes like this...

    They realised they had a bunch of tracks ("To the Moment", "Words on a Page", "The Gift of Love") and wanted to release them. Oliver conjured up "From the Turn of a Card" to add a fourth, but there's not enough to make an album.

    Album sales are poor, these days, so the approach most bands take is to go with big box sets, deluxe releases. Us older rock fans often have disposable income and are clearly happy to buy things multiple times over! So while an EP might have been commercially viable in the 1980s, these days it wouldn't be. Instead you look to go big: that meant combining these studio tracks with a re-release of In the Present, plus a previously Japan-only bonus track on In the Present. Instead of licensing that to a label, they sell it through a dedicated website and then also through Burning Shed. That means fewer sales than a more general release, but a much higher cut of the sale price.

    You're not expecting to reach people who have never heard of Yes before: this is a deluxe package, selling to a niche market. After a couple of years, you then stick it on digital platforms to get the sales of people who you couldn't get to buy the box set.

    Henry
    Where Are They Now? Yes news: http://www.bondegezou.co.uk/wh_now.htm
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  13. #38
    Mod or rocker? Mocker. Frumious B's Avatar
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    The live tracks were completely out of print and Lyon was actually selling for decent money on Ebay. Now they are available again. Looks like there is a pretty sizable chunk of the Yes catalog that is currently unavailable. Talk, Magnification, Fly From Here (original release), and Heaven & Earth are all available only from secondary sellers and none are for sale as digital releases or on streaming. Also the Like It Is live albums are gone.
    "It was a cruel song, but fair."-Roger Waters

  14. #39
    I love this release. It makes me long for more from this lineup. Benoit David has an excellent voice in studio as also evidenced by the excellent Mystery releases from that era and Live from Lyon has such excellent live sound. Perhaps the best sounding live Yes release.

  15. #40
    Member yesman1955's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frumious B View Post
    The live tracks were completely out of print and Lyon was actually selling for decent money on Ebay. Now they are available again. Looks like there is a pretty sizable chunk of the Yes catalog that is currently unavailable. Talk, Magnification, Fly From Here (original release), and Heaven & Earth are all available only from secondary sellers and none are for sale as digital releases or on streaming. Also the Like It Is live albums are gone.
    I still have several copies of Magnification that I acquired when the local FYE store closed years ago.

  16. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquatarkus View Post
    I love this release. It makes me long for more from this lineup. Benoit David has an excellent voice in studio as also evidenced by the excellent Mystery releases from that era and Live from Lyon has such excellent live sound. Perhaps the best sounding live Yes release.
    I totally agree with this. Thanks for spelling it out.

  17. #42
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    I want to buy it...the CD. Maybe someday the price will come down...
    So much music....so little time....

  18. #43
    Mod or rocker? Mocker. Frumious B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flatliner View Post
    I want to buy it...the CD. Maybe someday the price will come down...
    My guess is they are unlikely to press more copies. Really your best bet would be to hit Qobuz and buy the four new tracks in CD quality individually. That gets you the EP in lossless for around $6.00 which is quite reasonable IMHO. Pretty much anything that isn’t a huge major release has to be treated like a limited edition these days in terms of getting a physical copy.
    "It was a cruel song, but fair."-Roger Waters

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frumious B View Post
    My guess is they are unlikely to press more copies. Really your best bet would be to hit Qobuz and buy the four new tracks in CD quality individually. That gets you the EP in lossless for around $6.00 which is quite reasonable IMHO. Pretty much anything that isn’t a huge major release has to be treated like a limited edition these days in terms of getting a physical copy.
    Thanks for the advice. I may do just that.
    So much music....so little time....

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by yesman1955 View Post
    I still have several copies of Magnification that I acquired when the local FYE store closed years ago.
    Magnification is available for lossless download on Qobuz.

    Sent from my SM-T290 using Tapatalk

  21. #46
    Mod or rocker? Mocker. Frumious B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yesman1955 View Post
    I still have several copies of Magnification that I acquired when the local FYE store closed years ago.
    I ended up buying five copies of Magnification the year it came out:

    1. UK import which came out first by a couple of months
    2. Best Buy with exclusive bonus disc
    3. Borders with exclusive bonus disc
    4. FYE with exclusive bonus disc
    5. Autographed copy from Barnes & Noble

    My three cousins all got Magnification for Christmas in 2001 after I harvested the bonus discs, which I still have. I kept the UK import and the autographed copy and I have a spiffy four track live album in my digital Yes collection called Masterworks Live which is made up of the three epics from the Masterworks tour plus the orchestra overdubbed “Long Distance Runaround” all ripped from the bonus discs with the cover of the Masterworks tour book as album art.
    "It was a cruel song, but fair."-Roger Waters

  22. #47
    Mod or rocker? Mocker. Frumious B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve983 View Post
    Magnification is available for lossless download on Qobuz.

    Sent from my SM-T290 using Tapatalk
    Interesting. It’s gone from streaming and also the iTunes Store. For some reason I neglected to check Qobuz despite the fact that I buy virtually all of my music from them lately.
    "It was a cruel song, but fair."-Roger Waters

  23. #48
    Member yesman1955's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frumious B View Post
    I ended up buying five copies of Magnification the year it came out:

    1. UK import which came out first by a couple of months
    2. Best Buy with exclusive bonus disc
    3. Borders with exclusive bonus disc
    4. FYE with exclusive bonus disc
    5. Autographed copy from Barnes & Noble

    My three cousins all got Magnification for Christmas in 2001 after I harvested the bonus discs, which I still have. I kept the UK import and the autographed copy and I have a spiffy four track live album in my digital Yes collection called Masterworks Live which is made up of the three epics from the Masterworks tour plus the orchestra overdubbed “Long Distance Runaround” all ripped from the bonus discs with the cover of the Masterworks tour book as album art.
    Wow, you should be listed in the YES collectors hall-of-fame! 😉

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