Canterbury Binge: 2021

[Steve F.]

Yes, Mark did a great job remastering this.

I strongly agree. It is a very listenable release now.

...you can hear the band is a lot more tighter than during the Progman Cometh Music Festival-show one year earlier.

I was at that show and was pretty underwhelmed...

[interbellum]

I strongly agree. It is a very listenable release now.



I was at that show and was pretty underwhelmed...

I based my opinion on a bootleg I got from an American friend. I believe I remember Holdsworth wasn't too happy when one of the old Soft Machine-compositions was announced to be played.

[chalkpie]

Soft Machine - Noisette:

I forgot this had flute on this, love that. Having these melodies doubled on winds adds a nice, fatt beautiful layer. Wonderful playing of course - it's fun to focus in on one player at a time (like Hugh or Robert for example).

[Steve F.]

I believe I remember Holdsworth wasn't too happy when one of the old Soft Machine-compositions was announced to be played.

Alan was never happy. That's everything you need to know about why his career looks like his career.

[calyx]

I based my opinion on a bootleg I got from an American friend. I believe I remember Holdsworth wasn't too happy when one of the old Soft Machine-compositions was announced to be played.

That's interesting. Reminds of something i'd forgotten. That Hugh and Elton decided to play "Facelift" as an encore which they hadn't rehearsed and Allan had never played before, and they said, "Well, just solo during the E pedal section, play whatever you want, it's open"... I do remember two things about Seattle - (a) that Allan personally went to check that the multitrack recording hadn't been running and/or that the hard disks containing said recordings be erased; (b) in his hotel room after the show, Allan telling us (Leonardo, myself, probably Ken Kubernik ?) that he'd ruined the show and the other three had played so much better than he had.

It's a long time since I heard that first gig. I remember thinking it was good for what it was - I never thought of it as a "real" Soft Machine reunion, rather like a "jazz" project with four guys bringing their personalities and fusing them together rather than trying to emulate an existing style. The Live in Japan is very good. Whether it's a quantum leap from Seattle I couldn't say. I saw them one last time at Baja Prog (so I ended up seeing their first AND last shows) and it was still pretty much the same repertoire.

[Conti]

I remember buying the Softworks Abracadabra album when it was released and being really underwhelmed. For me, it lacked fire, edge and passion. As much as I love all players, I could never really connect with it, still don't. I don't known whether it was the "post-production" by Allan or simply the fact that maybe it was just another gig for the players. I wonder if the live album captures more of the spark one would assume to exist between them.

[chalkpie]

Just started Of Queues and Cures....the Esoteric remaster. My buddy Lieto (Mike) just picked the vinyl of the s/t National Health this past weekend. I ordered a NM vinyl of the s/t Hatfield from Discogs, should be here soon. It's an Italian pressing - I have an Italian Rotters pressing so they'll be siblings.

Phil Miller is a deity.

[chalkpie]

I remember buying the Softworks Abracadabra album when it was released and being really underwhelmed. For me, it lacked fire, edge and passion. As much as I love all players, I could never really connect with it, still don't. I don't known whether it was the "post-production" by Allan or simply the fact that maybe it was just another gig for the players. I wonder if the live album captures more of the spark one would assume to exist between them.

Alberto do you dig the newish SM Live at the Baked Potato?

[Progatron]

I remember buying the Softworks Abracadabra album when it was released and being really underwhelmed. For me, it lacked fire, edge and passion. As much as I love all players, I could never really connect with it, still don't. I don't known whether it was the "post-production" by Allan or simply the fact that maybe it was just another gig for the players. I wonder if the live album captures more of the spark one would assume to exist between them.

To be honest, Dean is the star of that project for me, and that's of course really saying something considering the luminaries aboard. The album doesn't get a ton of attention in the grand scheme of things, seemingly rather quickly forgotten, but Dean's playing has a kind of melancholic vibe (sometimes) that appeals to me when in the right mood. Some of Holdsworth's playing does feel 'by the numbers' on occasion, and like you I wonder about the live album, which is why I brought it up. I'm looking forward to hearing him more engaged with the band.

[NogbadTheBad]

Just started Of Qeues and Cures....the Esoteric remaster. My buddy Lieto (Mike) just picked the vinyl of the s/t National Health this past weekend. I ordered a NM vinyl of the s/t Hatfield from Discogs, should be here soon. It's an Italian pressing - I have an Italian Rotters pressing so they'll be siblings.

Phil Miller is a deity.

I thought Dave Stewart was ........ (you know)

[pb2015]

Here is some interesting stuff that John Trimble, a fellow RW fan and drummer/artist in his own right, wrote while we were in correspondence when I was writing my book. Unfortunately it was a bit too specialised to be used more than "in spirit", but it fits right in with the present discussion :

"[On] Little Red Record Wyatt uses his snare drum with the snares flipped off, normal snare tone is not used once, unheard of for that time. Although he is using his standard late Soft Machine set-up on his Ludwig kit – 24” bass drum, 14” rack tom-tom, single 18” floor tom-tom and snare -- he is obviously looking for a non-jazz, non-rock tonality. For live performances, at least, he made three adjustments. First, he took a smaller crash cymbal and placed it under his larger ride cymbal in a rather unconventional placing both on the right hand side of his bass drum. Second, he returned to using his 16" crash cymbal above the hi-hat. This allowed him more varied cymbal tones which are evident on the live recordings in particular. The third change was sonically disappointing. At some point during or after making Little Red Record Robert removed the bottom head from his rack mounted tom-tom which negated the inherent resonance of the drum. This was very in vogue in the early 1970’s with a lot of rock drummers doing the same, John Densmore of the Doors, as an example. But sadly it just kills the tone of the drum."

Just watched the "Smoke Signal" video from ILEA TV and it shows the rack tom with no bottom head.

[chalkpie]

I thought Dave Stewart was ........ (you know)

Absolutely, but Phil deserves it too, he is such an original and beautiful player. I could listen to him blow solos endlessly. Both those guys together created magic.

[Conti]

Alberto do you dig the newish SM Live at the Baked Potato?

Not yet, to be honest. When was it recorded, by rhe way? I've got to see them Live in São Paulo years ago and it was a terrific experience. I could have never imagined being in the same room with John Marshall, Roy Babbington and John Etheridge. Just imagining the list of musicians these cats have played with gives me goosebumps. Hoje good is the album?

[Conti]

Just started Of Qeues and Cures....the Esoteric remaster. My buddy Lieto (Mike) just picked the vinyl of the s/t National Health this past weekend. I ordered a NM vinyl of the s/t Hatfield from Discogs, should be here soon. It's an Italian pressing - I have an Italian Rotters pressing so they'll be siblings.

Phil Miller is a deity.

So cool about the first Hatfield on vinil, this is actually how I discovered the band in the early nineties. Found a mint UK pressing of it in a local shop in my hometown (probably from one who's changed for the cd version, which was supposedly the right thing to do at the time).

I was starting to immerse myself on Soft Machine (got Third on cd) and Caravan (Cunning Stunts and Canterbury Tales on vinyl) , but at the time I didn't have a clue about a possible link between all these bands. Bought the HATN album based on the cover only, and on feeling by the names of the songs that I was probably going to like it anyhow. Best album by the band, and argually my favorite album from anyone for many years...until I've got to know Magma. Still a favorite, though.

[chalkpie]

Not yet, to be honest. When was it recorded, by rhe way? I've got to see them Live in São Paulo years ago and it was a terrific experience. I could have never imagined being in the same room with John Marshall, Roy Babbington and John Etheridge. Just imagining the list of musicians these cats have played with gives me goosebumps. Hoje good is the album?

I think it's a wonderful recording - if you saw that gig live and loved it then I think this is a must. It's a killer recording sound-wise too, especially played on the living room hi-fi set-up cranked up. Moonjune Records too

Here is a taste:

[Mister Triscuits]

So cool about the first Hatfield on vinil, this is actually how I discovered the band in the early nineties. Found a mint UK pressing of it in a local shop in my hometown (probably from one who's changed for the cd version, which was supposedly the right thing to do at the time).

I can't tell you how much I regret doing that. I've been working on buying the vinyl back again, but they'll never be the beautiful new copies I had in the '70s. I'm still looking for an original copy of Rotters Club.

[Conti]

^Me too. I sold and/or gave away to friends many of my vinyl copies of great albums, to much of my later regret.

[chalkpie]

Yeah, Discogs seems to be the best way to score these again, but you need to be willing to lay down some coin. The Hatfield s/t LP I ordered was about $26 USD including shipping, so for a NM copy that seems pretty reasonable to me. Its not a UK original but judging from my Italian Rotters' pressing pressing it should be great.

[Conti]

I think it's a wonderful recording - if you saw that gig live and loved it then I think this is a must. It's a killer recording sound-wise too, especially played on the living room hi-fi set-up cranked up. Moonjune Records too

Here is a taste:

Excellent rendition. Faithful to the original yet definitely owned by the players. Great!

[chalkpie]

Sorry if this was covered here already, but why was "Eammon Andrews" never recorded on a studio album?

[calyx]

It was briefly quoted from in Teeth. Since it was a link piece, it made little sense to record it on a studio album.

[Steve F.]

It was briefly quoted from in Teeth. Since it was a link piece, it made little sense to record it on a studio album.

I’m ashamed that I have to ask this, but where is the quote?

[calyx]

Halfway through the piece, when the fuzz organ and sax play intertwined looped melodies with Hugh playing heavy fuzz notes underneath, then switches to clean sound, plays the 9/8 bass line from "Eamonn Andrews" (at 4:20) and the Pianet joins in. It's brief, but clearly a proper quote from "E.A.".

[Steve F.]

Halfway through the piece, when the fuzz organ and sax play intertwined looped melodies with Hugh playing heavy fuzz notes underneath, then switches to clean sound, plays the 9/8 bass line from "Eamonn Andrews" (at 4:20) and the Pianet joins in. It's brief, but clearly a proper quote from "E.A.".

Oh, yes.

I just thought that it was HH being HH-y. I’m not completely certain that it was a quote or MEANT as a quote, honestly, as musicians have their language and styling that they bring to the table in all circumstances, but if you TRULY think so, I defer to my betters.....

[calyx]

Oh, yes.

I just thought that it was HH being HH-y. I’m not completely certain that it was a quote or MEANT as a quote, honestly, as musicians have their language and styling that they bring to the table in all circumstances, but if you TRULY think so, I defer to my betters.....

It's not just Hugh, when Mike joins in with his Pianet riff (clearly a formal idea, not an improv or merely a cool riff), it's clearly "Eamonn Andrews" for a few seconds.