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Thread: U.K. - First Album vs. Danger Money

  1. #26
    Moderator Poisoned Youth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boceephus View Post
    The into to Nevermore on the s/t is my single most favorite, spine tingling moment in all of rock. I can listen to the first album start to finish without being tempted to hit skip, as I do on Danger Money.
    This sums it up for me. I enjoy both albums, but the first is magical, and I don’t think there’s another album in my collection quite like it.
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  2. #27
    Member moecurlythanu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poisoned Youth View Post
    This sums it up for me. I enjoy both albums, but the first is magical, and I don’t think there’s another album in my collection quite like it.
    Yeah, I love both albums, but the first claims exalted status. And the "In The Dead Of Night" suite is their finest moment, imo.

    Also, the s/t is one of the few albums that has only grown in stature with me, since buying it upon release in the 70s.

  3. #28
    Member moecurlythanu's Avatar
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    And I might add, probably an outlier around here, but I like UK way better than any of the bands these guys were in prior or since.

  4. #29
    I love both discs equally. 2 different versions of a great band. Plus Danger Money was my introduction to Bozzio. My music teacher played me "The Only Thing She Needs" and I couldn't comprehend what I was hearing, coming from a pop/hard rock background up to that point. One of my prog turning points.
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  5. #30
    Danger Money for me. Rendezvous 6.02 is a classic - especially as I worked near Waterloo for many years!

  6. #31
    Member dgtlman's Avatar
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    To me it was like two different bands. I preferred the trio over the first album & definitely liked Jobson playing the Holdsworth parts with keyboards & violin live.

  7. #32
    Member Rajaz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean View Post
    I enjoy them equally. For different reasons.
    For me, these albums seem from totally different bands. The best of the two is by far the U.K. debut album; it has a super star band with Jobson, Wetton, Bruford and Holdsworth. I do consider Terry Bozzio a fantastic drummer but he is no Bruford who also brought compositions that were left from the Bruford Wetton & Wakeman sessions and his unique drum style. Not to mention the absence of the amazing Allan Holdsworth who joined Bruford in his band.

    For instance, "In the Dead of Night" and "Alaska" are show stoppers and classics that "The only thing she needs" and "Carrying no cross" come close but come short musically.

    Sadly these are the only two UK studio albums we can analyze as fans.

  8. #33
    Member since March 2004 mozo-pg's Avatar
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    S/T is pure prog and vastly superior. Danger Money veers towards Asia territory and is more prog pop oriented.
    Last edited by mozo-pg; 10-30-2020 at 10:44 AM.
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  9. #34
    I have an irrational prejudice in favor of the trio because I saw them live (opening for Jethro Tull, no less - the following year Jobson would _in_ Tull, which was my favorite Tull show that I've seen) and they were pretty magical. There is a nagging feeling that I "should" like the s/t album better, and I would certainly say that the night/day sequence on it is better writing than anything on Danger Money... still, I just prefer the latter. I think there was more competition for attention among the musicians in the first one, more sense of a band playing together instead of at each other on the second.
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  10. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Sturgeon's Lawyer View Post
    There is a nagging feeling that I "should" like the s/t album better,
    Exactly my experience. I'm always going to reach for Danger Money first, even if it has some elements of Asia, who I never liked. Objectively I can see that s/t is a fantastic album and I enjoy it when I have it on, but if I can only own one of the two, it's Danger Money...
    You say Mega Ultra Deluxe Special Limited Edition Extended Autographed 5-LP, 3-CD, 4-DVD, 2-BlueRay, 4-Cassette, five 8-Track, MP4 Download plus Demos, Outtakes, Booklet, T-Shirt and Guitar Pick Gold-Leafed Box Set Version like it's a bad thing...

  11. #36
    Member Sputnik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rajaz View Post
    For me, these albums seem from totally different bands. The best of the two is by far the U.K. debut album; it has a super star band with Jobson, Wetton, Bruford and Holdsworth. I do consider Terry Bozzio a fantastic drummer but he is no Bruford who also brought compositions that were left from the Bruford Wetton & Wakeman sessions and his unique drum style. Not to mention the absence of the amazing Allan Holdsworth who joined Bruford in his band.

    For instance, "In the Dead of Night" and "Alaska" are show stoppers and classics that "The only thing she needs" and "Carrying no cross" come close but come short musically.

    Sadly these are the only two UK studio albums we can analyze as fans.
    Pretty much where I'm at. The debut is a stone cold Prog classic in my book. Danger Money is a different beast. Definitely some fantastic stuff there, but far less quirky, experimental, not as challenging harmonically, and lacks the stellar instrumental fireworks of the debut. Carrying No Cross, to me, is a bit of a mess. Some cool playing, but it just doesn't add up to much in the end to my ears. And being this is such a pivotal track on Danger Money, that's always contributed to my feeling that this is the lesser of the two records.

    I think they should have found a guitarist to replace (I use that term loosely) Holdsworth. I feel a lot of the material would have come off better (Ceaser's Palace Blues, for example), and the extra voice could have contributed a lot. As it is, I guess I've made my peace with the album and do actually really like some songs (Rendezvous 6:02 in particular). But for me, the debut shines like a beacon, while Danger Money is sort of an "also ran." Obviously, mileage varies.

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  12. #37
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    Agree with many of the comments above and would add:

    The self titled debut is indeed an outstanding classic that has stood the test of time. One of my Top 50 albums of all time and probably more like Top 25. It is truly "Mental Medication" for me, from start to finish. With those 4 musicians on board, it was bound to be a stone cold classic.

    "Danger Money" is a very good album, in my view a B+. "Carrying No Cross" is a classic cut by itself and truly the highlight of the album. Also like the title cut and "The Only Thing She Needs". The two shorter cuts on side 2 are not up to par with the rest of the album.

    Agree that it's a shame that these four musical geniuses didn't record more as a quartet:

    UK_Polydor_1978.jpg

  13. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by JJ88 View Post
    Take away 'Nothing To Lose', and I don't hear the alleged commercialism on Danger Money. It's slick but so was the UK debut, in my view, compared to previous bands these guys had been in.

    Great point - Even "Nothing To Lose" with its violin solo is left field enough - not to mention in my humble opinion better than most Asia (specially from the 2nd album on - and on par with the best of the first). Someone mentioned that they were doing better music that ELP at the time - that's easy, so not a great compliment. I still resist the idea that any keyboard trio will sound like ELP - sure at times it might look like way, same as any heavy guitar group would sound the same to non-fans. I agree Danger Money-era UK might remind you of ELP -but that is somewhat superficial - Eddie Jobson made sure of that - not only by adding the violin but by letting his different influences come thru.

    Let me add a... hrm.. not sure I am using the word properly... a corollary...

    "John Wetton was a better songwriter than Greg Lake"

    (hides)

    v
    Last edited by vmartell; 10-30-2020 at 01:36 PM.

  14. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by SunRunner2 View Post
    Agree with many of the comments above and would add:

    The self titled debut is indeed an outstanding classic that has stood the test of time. One of my Top 50 albums of all time and probably more like Top 25. It is truly "Mental Medication" for me, from start to finish. With those 4 musicians on board, it was bound to be a stone cold classic.

    "Danger Money" is a very good album, in my view a B+. "Carrying No Cross" is a classic cut by itself and truly the highlight of the album. Also like the title cut and "The Only Thing She Needs". The two shorter cuts on side 2 are not up to par with the rest of the album.

    Agree that it's a shame that these four musical geniuses didn't record more as a quartet:

    UK_Polydor_1978.jpg

    Oh indeed - I mean that's the other point of my post - I don't think anyone would dare to say that "Danger Money" was as significant and/or better than the S/T - indeed, had it come out in 1975 or damn it, even 1976 impact would have been even greater... I also wish that quartet would have recorded more... all I said, even with all that, when I think, "OK, let's put some U.K. on the 'table", I reach for "Danger Money" way, way, way more often than the S/T.

    v

  15. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Rajaz View Post
    For me, these albums seem from totally different bands. The best of the two is by far the U.K. debut album; it has a super star band with Jobson, Wetton, Bruford and Holdsworth. I do consider Terry Bozzio a fantastic drummer but he is no Bruford who also brought compositions that were left from the Bruford Wetton & Wakeman sessions and his unique drum style. Not to mention the absence of the amazing Allan Holdsworth who joined Bruford in his band.

    For instance, "In the Dead of Night" and "Alaska" are show stoppers and classics that "The only thing she needs" and "Carrying no cross" come close but come short musically.

    Sadly these are the only two UK studio albums we can analyze as fans.
    Didn't these two compositions come from the Bruford sessions with the 1st album? I'm in the camp who enjoys both but the 1st (as someone already mentioned) is pure magic..

  16. #41
    Member dropforge's Avatar
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    Many of the comments add up to "the second album is good/fine/great, but it can't scratch the ass of the first"!

    I don't need a caveat to enjoy Danger Money. It's a five-star album in my book! It doesn't matter if Holdsy and Broof aren't on it. And Bozzio is an awesome drummer.

    P.S. There are no "elements of Asia" in Danger Money. Asia didn't exist. Think of Asia as an extremely watered-down, much less exciting version of U.K.

  17. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by vmartell View Post
    I am alone in this? Any love for "Danger Money" over the first album?
    I’m weird in that I like them more or less equally. The latter is definitely pretty much Jobson’s show, but I am perfectly OK with that. “Carrying No Cross” is a highlight not only of that album, but of the band’s oeuvre as a whole.
    Last edited by Progbear; 10-30-2020 at 04:27 PM.
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  18. #43
    Parrots Ripped My Flesh Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by happytheman View Post
    Didn't these two compositions come from the Bruford sessions with the 1st album? I'm in the camp who enjoys both but the 1st (as someone already mentioned) is pure magic..
    They were in UK's setlists before EJ and JW fired BB and AH,, along with Sahara of Snow.

  19. #44
    Member gearHed289's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian View Post
    Danger Money. One of my favorite concerts ever was seeing the Danger Money line up in Chicago 2012. Not playing together since 1979 and only having the weekend to reherse they were incredible. Bozio's drum set, if memory serves had six bass drums remot triggered and over one hundred cymbals, it occupiedhalf the stage.
    That was a great show! My drummer, along with Vic Salazar, pulled an all-nighter setting up Bozzio's kit.

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    So he used his portable set!

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    Quote Originally Posted by dropforge View Post
    P.S. There are no "elements of Asia" in Danger Money. Asia didn't exist. Think of Asia as an extremely watered-down, much less exciting version of U.K.
    I guess the wording is debatable, but I don't think there's any argument that Nothing to Lose was a sign of things to come.

    2012-05-01_21-10-58_756.jpg

  20. #45
    Parrots Ripped My Flesh Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SunRunner2 View Post
    With those 4 musicians on board, it was bound to be a stone cold classic.
    Which was the thinking of many people when they heard about Asia being formed, but...

  21. #46
    Member dropforge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gearHed289 View Post
    I guess the wording is debatable, but I don't think there's any argument that Nothing to Lose was a sign of things to come.
    If only anything Asia produced was that good!

  22. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by dropforge View Post
    If only anything Asia produced was that good!
    Agreed. “Nothing to Lose” is first-rate prog-pop. Asia is a second-hand portmanteau of Journey, Foreigner and The Babys with some half-hearted proggy fanfares grafted onto some of the songs. And even the slight prog flavoring was completely gone by the time of the execrable Alpha.
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  23. #48
    Moderator Sean's Avatar
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    Drama-lite?

  24. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Progbear View Post
    Asia is a second-hand portmanteau of Journey, Foreigner and The Babys with some half-hearted proggy fanfares grafted onto some of the songs. And even the slight prog flavoring was completely gone by the time of the execrable Alpha.
    Too much Mike Stone in Asia. Danger Money is a better balance of Prog and Pop than Asia which comes across to me as product and something I'm less interested in repeat listening.
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  25. #50
    Member moecurlythanu's Avatar
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    I don't hear much Pop in Danger Money. And listen to the fiery interplay between instruments on some of these tracks. Fairly jaw dropping, and reminds you just how good players these guys were.

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