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Thread: New vinyl is about to get a whole lot more expensive!

  1. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by yamishogun View Post
    Actually, price changes downward pretty quickly. Look at the connection between crude oil and gasoline prices:

    https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/...uctuations.php

    Look closer. January 2009, crude drops and flatlines for about one month. Gas price goes right back up. Same thing with January 2015. There are a number of crude flatlines that are not reflected in gas flatlines.

    But, whatever. I don't want to derail this thread.
    "A conspiracy of silence speaks louder than words."

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  2. #27
    Member LASERCD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    And yet, there were only two places in the world to get a lacquer made. And one of them just burned to the ground.

    Is the vinyl market strong enough for somebody to invest in creating a new one? Or maybe, as Ken predicts, other means of mastering will take over? Only time will tell. I actually hope physical product does not disappear, despite worrying sales figures. But nobody's going to rescue the industry out of nostalgia. It must make good business sense.
    Pure speculation on my part but I expect a company to step up to the plate. I think everyone is pointing a finger at Acoustic Sounds. Chad has the financial resources and certainly would benefit from taking lacquer manufacturing in-house.

    I agree with you - nobody will rescue the industry out of nostalgia. Chad is the perfect example of using good business sense. Instead of relying on RTI for quality pressings, he bought up and refurbished old presses that were in storage. He hired some of the top vinyl guys - some them about to go into retirement - to work the presses. He created a state of the art plant in Salinas, KS. Probably got all kinds of assistance from the state. There is an 8-10 month wait for pressing at QRP. His prices are the highest in the industry and he's swimming in business.

  3. #28
    That's Mr. to you, Sir!! Trane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LASERCD View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Maybe Compact Discs will come back
    OK with me!
    I'd welcome that only because some albums are not being released in CD anymore

    Quote Originally Posted by simon moon View Post
    NO!!!
    I am scoring so many great CDs (especially jazz and classical), for next to nothing.
    I've added so many late 20th century and contemporary classical CD's to my connection in the last couple of years for under $5 each.
    Last thing I want, is for them to beccome popular again.
    It will be a niche market if it does. Even if all vinyls buyers nowadays revert back to CD, this won't even double the CD share of sales

    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    It’s a golden time to be collecting music.
    Got what I need in terms of what's been released yesterdecade (maybe some jazz stuff I've missed so far) and space is not infinite. Outside the odd reissue (usually coming to my attention here), I am only looking for new releases.

    YT and BC can be my friend if I have a scratch for something past that's new to me and that I don't own yet
    my music collection increased tenfolds when I switched from drug-addicts to complete nutcases.

  4. #29
    Member Paul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simon moon View Post
    There are only 2 companies in the entire world that produce lacquers used in the cutting of vinyl, one in Japan, the other in Banning, California (Apollo/Transco Masters).
    A quick google search found this company in Nashville which does lacquer mastering https://www.urpressing.com/lacquer-mastering/. Presumbaly there will be others as well?
    Tu veux un camembert?

  5. #30
    Jazzbo manqué Mister Triscuits's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul View Post
    A quick google search found this company in Nashville which does lacquer mastering https://www.urpressing.com/lacquer-mastering/. Presumbaly there will be others as well?
    Lots of companies do the mastering. The hitch is that we've lost the biggest source for the basic materials they need to do it.
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  6. #31
    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Question: DMM (direct metal mastering), how does that work? Is it the actual stamping masters that are engraved by the mastering cutter?
    Quote Originally Posted by Wikipedia
    Unlike conventional disc mastering, where the mechanical audio modulation is cut onto a lacquer-coated aluminum disc, DMM cuts straight into metal (copper), utilizing a high frequency carrier system and specialized diamond styli, vibrating at more than 40 kHz (i.e. 60 kHz) [1] to facilitate the cutting.

    The DMM copper master disc can be plated to produce the required number of stampers using the one-step plating process. Rather than having to electroform a master (or "father"), mother and then stampers (the traditional "three-step process"), the DMM copper disc serves as the 'mother". Bypassing the silvering process and two electroforming stages reduces the risk of introducing noise that can be generated in the electroforming (galvanic) process. In cases where hundreds of stampers may be required, the DMM disc is often used as a mandrel to electroform a master and mother, from which many stampers are then made. Chemical passivation of the metal surface of each part precludes "plating," so the parts can be mechanically separated from each other upon removal from the tank.

    Along with mechanical audio recording, DMM is now more or less a thing of the past (certainly not in the mainstream of the sound recording industry any longer). Since the sale of Neumann to German microphone manufacturer Sennheiser, Neumann no longer produces lathes or supplies parts. The lathes in use today are kept operational by independent service consultants, as well as cutting room personnel themselves, often by buying incomplete lathes and stripping them for parts.

  7. #32
    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Maybe Tom Cruise will get involved .
    Quote Originally Posted by Wikipedia
    As of 2009, there are six or seven DMM cutting facilities left in the world—all located in Europe. The USA lost its last DMM cutting facility in 2005 with the demise of New York City-based record manufacturer Europadisk LLC. Europadisk's DMM lathe was sold at auction on 20-SEP-05 to the Church of Scientology for US $72,500.

  8. #33
    Member hFx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Question: DMM (direct metal mastering), how does that work? Is it the actual stamping masters that are engraved by the mastering cutter?
    No, but fewer steps are possible! While the lacquer cut technique requires also a father (or metal master) and a mother before creating the stampers (see image below), with DMM the stampers can be (but not always are) directly made from the more sturdy direct-cut metal master.


    Source: http://www.qualityrecordpressings.co...cfm?go=process
    Last edited by hFx; 02-22-2020 at 10:32 AM.
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  9. #34
    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    And "direct-to-disc" recording eliminated the tape recorder, with the musicians playing directly into the cutting head while it engraved the lacquer master.

    Lots of attempts were made to eliminate steps in record production since each step added noise and distortion.

  10. #35
    Jazzbo manqué Mister Triscuits's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    And "direct-to-disc" recording eliminated the tape recorder, with the musicians playing directly into the cutting head while it engraved the lacquer master.
    ...which required the musicians to perform each LP side live without a break, with no possibility of editing, overdubbing, or remixing the results. That made the technique of pretty limited usefulness in the rock world.
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  11. #36
    Member frinspar's Avatar
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    I'm worried about the satanic backward messaging industry.

  12. #37
    Member hFx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Lots of attempts were made to eliminate steps in record production since each step added noise and distortion.
    ...and that's why the traditional lacquer master is so highly regarded?
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  13. #38
    Man of repute progmatist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trane View Post
    I'd welcome that only because some albums are not being released in CD anymore.....

    .....It will be a niche market if it does. Even if all vinyls buyers nowadays revert back to CD, this won't even double the CD share of sales
    Many if not most of the CD sales from past decades have been the repurchase of people's older vinyl and/or cassette collections. People liked their old music, but wanted to hear it without those annoying pops and clicks, or tape hiss. They also lamented their tapes being eaten by their machines, or their records warping in their cars.
    "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama

  14. #39
    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by progmatist View Post
    They also lamented their tapes being eaten by their machines, or their records warping in their cars.
    That's why automobile turntables never really caught on.

  15. #40
    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frinspar View Post
    I'm worried about the satanic backward messaging industry.
    Yrtsudni gnigassem drawkcab cinatas eht tuoba deirrow m'i. Llew dna evil.

  16. #41
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    As long as it still skips crackles and pops who cares where it comes from.

  17. #42
    Man of repute progmatist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    That's why automobile turntables never really caught on.
    If you've ever seen the movie Johnny Dangerously, a record playing was at least partly responsible for D.A. Kelly's car crash.
    "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama

  18. #43
    Member Vic2012's Avatar
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    I actually read that backward. I can read upside down too......

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