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Thread: Black Sabbath's Debut Album is Now Fifty!

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by viukkis View Post
    The vocals on the first album could probably have been better if they had more than one day of studio time. The last track recorded was Warning and on that one Ozzy really sounds like he needs to rest his voice a bit.
    I always thought his voice was altered in the studio on the first one to make it sound more bluesy and deeper. He sounded more like The Ozzy we came to know on Paranoid.


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  2. #52
    Part of the secret of why those first two Sabbath albums sound so heavy is because of the use of half time rhythms, like on Black Sabbath itself and the intro of War Pigs. That's a big part of making it sound so ominous, it's like Godzilla wading in from the ocean, about ready to pounce on a Japanese fishing village or something. Another thing a lot of people miss out is Ward's drumming, which drew more from jazz than rock n roll drumming. In fact, I think that swing element was a secret ingredient in a lot of rock music of the late 60's and 70's. Everyone from Cream to Sabbath to Deep Purple to Kiss had that element, and I think that's a big part of why I prefer a lot of that music.

    And there was also more dynamics in their music, which again was something that disappeared with later metal bands. It was like someone thought if they got rid of the quiet stuff and the slow stuff and just played everything as loud and fast as possible, with the double bass drum stuff going non stop, the cookie monster vocals, etc, they were somehow going "one step beyond" past metal bands, like it was supposed to be "even heavier" and it really wasn't. Not to my ears, it wasn't, anyway.

  3. #53
    Man of repute progmatist's Avatar
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    ^^ If memory serves, the intro to War Pigs is in 12/8 time. Then for the main body of the song, it goes to 4/4.
    "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarGeek View Post
    Part of the secret of why those first two Sabbath albums sound so heavy is because of the use of half time rhythms, like on Black Sabbath itself and the intro of War Pigs. That's a big part of making it sound so ominous, it's like Godzilla wading in from the ocean, about ready to pounce on a Japanese fishing village or something. Another thing a lot of people miss out is Ward's drumming, which drew more from jazz than rock n roll drumming. In fact, I think that swing element was a secret ingredient in a lot of rock music of the late 60's and 70's. Everyone from Cream to Sabbath to Deep Purple to Kiss had that element, and I think that's a big part of why I prefer a lot of that music.

    And there was also more dynamics in their music, which again was something that disappeared with later metal bands. It was like someone thought if they got rid of the quiet stuff and the slow stuff and just played everything as loud and fast as possible, with the double bass drum stuff going non stop, the cookie monster vocals, etc, they were somehow going "one step beyond" past metal bands, like it was supposed to be "even heavier" and it really wasn't. Not to my ears, it wasn't, anyway.
    This is a good article that digs into Iommi's style.

    https://www.guitarplayer.com/techniq...ike-tony-iommi

  5. #55
    This is a perfect late autumn / winter album for me.
    I think the title track is a great example of a song that perfectly showcases the band : it is the opener of the first s/t album, and it is a song that encapsulates the essence of Black Sabbath - doomy, heavy, but also atmospheric and featuring an interesting progression.

  6. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Interstellar View Post
    This is a perfect late autumn / winter album for me.
    I think the title track is a great example of a song that perfectly showcases the band : it is the opener of the first s/t album, and it is a song that encapsulates the essence of Black Sabbath - doomy, heavy, but also atmospheric and featuring an interesting progression.
    One of the great opening tracks of a debut, right up there with The Doors' "Break on Through."
    "A conspiracy of silence speaks louder than words."

    - Dr. Winston O'Boogie

  7. #57
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    Part of the secret of why those first two Sabbath albums sound so heavy is because of the use of half time rhythms, like on Black Sabbath itself and the intro of War Pigs. That's a big part of making it sound so ominous,
    The tubular bells add to the ominous sound too. Wonder who's idea that was? It's pretty awesome.

  8. #58
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    Just listened to Black Sabbath, the title track. My god Geezer was/is a bass god. He was a HUGE part of that heaviness.

  9. #59
    Man of repute progmatist's Avatar
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    ^^ It was Geezer who spawned the creation of the eponymous song, Black Sabbath. He was playing Holst's Mars, Tony walked in and put his own spin on it, thus creating that classic riff.
    "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama

  10. #60
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    Yeah Geezer is an unsung, rock bass god. He basically invented a style, because he wasn't really a bassist originally. So one guy didn't really play bass, and the other lost fingertips in an industrial, metal factory. And they unleashed a beast.

  11. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Vic2012 View Post
    Yeah Geezer is an unsung, rock bass god. He basically invented a style, because he wasn't really a bassist originally. So one guy didn't really play bass, and the other lost fingertips in an industrial, metal factory. And they unleashed a beast.
    If you ask him, he says he was just following Tony.
    "A conspiracy of silence speaks louder than words."

    - Dr. Winston O'Boogie

  12. #62
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    Yeah I've seen a few Sabbath documentaries. He (Geez) followed Tony, and Ozzy followed Tony and Geezer. And metal was born.

  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vic2012 View Post
    Just listened to Black Sabbath, the title track. My god Geezer was/is a bass god. He was a HUGE part of that heaviness.
    1000 TIMES YES.

  14. #64
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    Hell yes....

  15. #65
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    Perfect album imo, love the production and Ozzies husky vocals
    no tunes, no dynamics, no nosebone

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vic2012 View Post
    Yeah I've seen a few Sabbath documentaries. He (Geez) followed Tony, and Ozzy followed Tony and Geezer. And metal was born.
    Yes indeed, Metal was born. I always found Martin Popoff's analysis of when and what gave birth to Metal, denoting the trilogy that he believed gave rise to the genre, although he also credits those who blazed the path before and after 1970's eruption:

    "Martin argues for the “real” or “correct” answer to the titular question being Black Sabbath given their groundbreaking Black Sabbath album, issued February 13, 1970, but also that band’s Paranoid, Uriah Heep’s debut, and most important of this set of three, Deep Purple’s In Rock".

    Amazing that these 3 bands would release such quintessential albums in the same year, all within a few months of each other, resulting in a revolution in Rock's historical timeline.

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    Uriah Heep hadn't really settled on a sound or even a line-up at that point (look at how many people are credited on Very 'Eavy...). But clearly things like 'Gypsy' were a sign of things to come.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JJ88 View Post
    Uriah Heep hadn't really settled on a sound or even a line-up at that point (look at how many people are credited on Very 'Eavy...). But clearly things like 'Gypsy' were a sign of things to come.
    True, Salisbury is where they settled into a more prog rock defining sound, although Gypsy was the bees knees for their debut. On Salisbury, Byron and Box moved over and made room for Hensley's participation in the composing department. Popoff declared Salisbury as a "failed experiment", but that seems a bit harsh.

  19. #69
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    ^I love 'Salisbury'. The intro alone is epic. I play it more than Deep Purple's Concerto..., that's for sure.

    'I'll Keep On Trying' is another great song on Very 'Eavy. I quite like the less 'heavy' tracks like 'Come Away Melinda' and the progressive 'Wake Up Set Your Sights'. But these latter two were basically Spice tracks, rather than Uriah Heep per se- Ken Hensley hadn't even joined the band at that point.

  20. #70
    Man of repute progmatist's Avatar
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    In the late 70s through the 80s, while still pissed about being fired, Ozzy said bluntly it was Geezer who wrote most of the songs for which the band is famous.
    "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama

  21. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by progmatist View Post
    In the late 70s through the 80s, while still pissed about being fired, Ozzy said bluntly it was Geezer who wrote most of the songs for which the band is famous.
    He was the primary lyricist.
    "A conspiracy of silence speaks louder than words."

    - Dr. Winston O'Boogie

  22. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by SunRunner2 View Post
    Yes indeed, Metal was born. I always found Martin Popoff's analysis of when and what gave birth to Metal, denoting the trilogy that he believed gave rise to the genre, although he also credits those who blazed the path before and after 1970's eruption:

    "Martin argues for the “real” or “correct” answer to the titular question being Black Sabbath given their groundbreaking Black Sabbath album, issued February 13, 1970, but also that band’s Paranoid, Uriah Heep’s debut, and most important of this set of three, Deep Purple’s In Rock".

    Amazing that these 3 bands would release such quintessential albums in the same year, all within a few months of each other, resulting in a revolution in Rock's historical timeline.
    Hard to believe that's only 3 years removed from this.

  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave (in MA) View Post
    Hard to believe that's only 3 years removed from this.
    Oh, my gosh! It's not hard to believe it's impossible (but you provided the evidence, so....). It sounds and looks like a Brady Bunch tribute to the Cowsills. And, who is that predecessor to Jon Lord on keyboards? She looks like a prettier version of Karen Carpenter.

    Well, at least we know where the sound basis for "Speed King" originated.

  24. #74
    That's Mr. to you, Sir!! Trane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spellbound View Post
    I still have the LP. Didn't save any of my old 8 tracks.
    I only kept the first two albums and H&H. Discovered the band through the We Sold Our Soul double anthology and that was part of the reason, why I got into heavy rock and Blues Rock around that same time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fracktured View Post
    Groundbreaking for sure. Some of the scariest music at the time. Just the cover and the thunderstorm with the church bells in the beginning was scary to me when I first heard this. Time to break out the Sabbath.
    Quote Originally Posted by JJ88 View Post
    There was that Rolling Stone review/ramble about Paranoid where it turned out the guy was reviewing Black Widow. Based on their album Sacrifice, that band were not especially 'heavy', really, despite using some of the same gothic imagery as Black Sabbath.
    Widow wasn't nearly as heavy, unless you mean "Heavil", but they sounded often a bit ridiculous, whereas Sab sounded serious.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerjo View Post
    Rolling Stone buried this at the bottom. Good news about Ward mending fences but dama, May/Iommi?! I so want to hear this

    Ward now plays in his own hard-rocking Bill Ward Band and another group called Day of Errors; he has lots of music he hopes to release, and says he has mended fences with the rest of the band.
    Glad to see Ward back on the road (there was a time where he had real health issues) and solving his BS problems

    Quote Originally Posted by Guitarplyrjvb View Post
    Just listened to the first record. It's raw, lyrics are juvenile, vocals are bad, and the material is very thin. It's amazing how they progressed by the second record. Great material, great vocals and really stellar production. It's like the first record was a very rough draft of their sound hurriedly scribbled down in the few hours they had in the studio. Stunning how they had grown by Paranoid. All IMHO, of course. I know some love this record. Not me.
    Well, Paranoid is a real improvement, but yeah, the debut , but everything was already there on the debut. a bit like a blueprint, really.
    In one of the tracks you can hear Iommi lifting a solo from Tull's Cat's Squirrel on This Was.

    Quote Originally Posted by SunRunner2 View Post
    Wow. All the reasons you cited for not liking the album are what made the release so outstanding in my view. As to lyrics being juvenile, Paranoid didn't exactly step up the maturity and quality aspect:

    Goin' home, late last night
    Suddenly I got a fright
    Yeah I looked through a window and surprised what I saw
    A fairy with boots and dancin' with a dwarf
    All right now

    So I went to the doctor, see what he could give me
    He said son, son, you've gone too far
    'Cause smokin' and trippin' is all that you do
    Yeah
    fave Sab track evah

    Quote Originally Posted by ronmac View Post
    I wouldn't change a thing.
    yeah with warts an' all

    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarGeek View Post
    Another thing a lot of people miss out is Ward's drumming, which drew more from jazz than rock n roll drumming. In fact, I think that swing element was a secret ingredient in a lot of rock music of the late 60's and 70's. Everyone from Cream to Sabbath to Deep Purple to Kiss had that element, and I think that's a big part of why I prefer a lot of that music.
    Absolutely Ward's jazzy ways was fantastic with Geezer's wandering bass lines. They had one of the most inventive rhythm section .... at least for the first two album... Too bad they lost much of that with the shorter formats and more standard song-structure on MOR and Vol 4 and later.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vic2012 View Post
    Just listened to Black Sabbath, the title track. My god Geezer was/is a bass god. He was a HUGE part of that heaviness.
    He's the guy (with Casady, Entwistle & Bruce) that made me listen to the low frequencies of rock

    Quote Originally Posted by JJ88 View Post
    Uriah Heep hadn't really settled on a sound or even a line-up at that point (look at how many people are credited on Very 'Eavy...). But clearly things like 'Gypsy' were a sign of things to come.
    not impressed at all with Heep's debut... Only appreciate Gypsy. if there wasn't that track on the album, I'd have to commit suicide

    Salibury and LAY are so much better (hard to believe it's the same band, really)

    Quote Originally Posted by progmatist View Post
    In the late 70s through the 80s, while still pissed about being fired, Ozzy said bluntly it was Geezer who wrote most of the songs for which the band is famous.
    Surely he meant lyrics
    my music collection increased tenfolds when I switched from drug-addicts to complete nutcases.

  25. #75
    Banned Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SunRunner2 View Post
    Oh, my gosh! It's not hard to believe it's impossible (but you provided the evidence, so....). It sounds and looks like a Brady Bunch tribute to the Cowsills.
    This tune is a bit easier to accept as a precursor to what Gillan and Glover would do next. (rough sound quality)

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