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Thread: Prog guilty pleasures and true confessions

  1. #101
    Member Emeritus (A.M.P.) rcarlberg's Avatar
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    The clip from Sagittarius above caused me to investigate & download the album. Playing it yesterday, I was reminded of the two great(?) lost psychedelic disasters of Chad & Jeremy, "Of Cabbages and Kings" (1967) and "The Ark" (1968). Reading further I discovered why: producer Gary Usher was behind all of them!

    Revisiting them made me want to hear Chad & Jeremy's earlier pop hits again, so I started downloading them off YouTube.

    I quickly discovered that several songs I remembered as being by Chad & Jeremy, were actually by Peter & Gordon. Seems that Peter & Jeremy & Chad & Gordon were all mixed up in my head. Both groups featured a guy in black glasses, both groups did a half dozen hits and a ton of dreck, both duos seem to have been singing over tracks by anonymous studio musicians.

  2. #102
    Member Guitarplyrjvb's Avatar
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    Okay.. after my wife went out this morning, I blasted Henry Cow's "Concerts" over the living room rig! Hah! She'll never know!

  3. #103
    Member Lopez's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    I was reminded of the two great(?) lost psychedelic disasters of Chad & Jeremy, "Of Cabbages and Kings" (1967) and "The Ark" (1968). Reading further I discovered why: producer Gary Usher was behind all of them!
    Taste is quite subjective. I love both of those albums and don't consider them disasters or even psychedelic (any more than the Four Seasons' Genuine Imitation Life Gazette is psychedelic). They are hippy products of their time. The sidelong suite on Of Cabbages and Kings features sound effects by "psychedelic" comedians the Firesign Theater. Their stuff sounds pretty dated today, too.
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  4. #104
    Member Emeritus (A.M.P.) rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Saleswise (and career-wise) they were unmitigated disasters. Musically maybe not -- that's why I included the "(?)"

  5. #105
    Member Lopez's Avatar
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    I agree with you there, sir. They pretty much sank like the proverbial stone. I wish I had a first pressing of The Ark with "The Arc" on the LP cover. Mine is a latter pressing with "Ark" spelled correctly.
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  6. #106
    That's Mr. to you, Sir!! Trane's Avatar
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    never felt guilty for liking music, and if I like it, it's good.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rarebird View Post
    I don't feel guilty about anything I like. Why should I.
    Yeah, women don't experience the shame/guilt about liking something "they shouldn't be", like men would, according to the guidelines or whatever social hang-ups men put in between themselves.

    Men would feel shameful to like girly pink cars and feel guilty to enjoy the one they bought in a plain brown wrapping paper delivered to their bunker, that only they have access to.
    There were a few girls taking workshop (named pompously "industrial arts") optional course in high-school without making a dent in their reputation (like being a "butch" or something), but the lone guy taking the "homek" courses (home economics, but this was cooking, sowing and cleaning stuff on top of budget for the home) in the same high-school was a pure "faggot", even according to most girls.


    BTW, I never even heard any names of those German artistes you named, but I bet a few of them are champions of Munich's Oktoberfest sing-along songs compilations
    my music collection increased tenfolds when I switched from drug-addicts to complete nutcases.

  7. #107
    Member Emeritus (A.M.P.) rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Most of us hopefully grew out of that phase of needing to conform that defines a boy’s adolescence. I remember school as a rigorous highly competitive highly stratified environment where everyone was either picked on or did the bullying — or both.

    But life since graduation has been a lot less judgmental. I’m free to dress any way I please, listen to whatever I want, and sing Donna Summer in the shower if I want. Haters gonna hate regardless.

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Playing it yesterday, I was reminded of the two great(?) lost psychedelic disasters of Chad & Jeremy, "Of Cabbages and Kings" (1967) and "The Ark" (1968). Reading further I discovered why: producer Gary Usher was behind all of them!
    Quote Originally Posted by Lopez View Post
    he sidelong suite on Of Cabbages and Kings features sound effects by "psychedelic" comedians the Firesign Theater.
    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Saleswise (and career-wise) they were unmitigated disasters. Musically maybe not -- that's why I included the "(?)"
    Quote Originally Posted by Lopez View Post
    I agree with you there, sir. They pretty much sank like the proverbial stone.
    Not entirely, even in their time. I remember hearing that side-long suite played repeatedly on WNEW-FM, out of NYC, back in the day. So there was at least one free-form commercial radio DJ who was a fan and got it.

  9. #109
    An album I've been listening to alot recently is Van Dyke Parks' "Jump" which initially sounds like pure schmaltz, but the writing is actually incredibly well done and intricate. In my opinion its a guilty pleasure intertwined with a legitimately satisfying musical experience, best of both worlds!

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  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazz2896 View Post
    An album I've been listening to alot recently is Van Dyke Parks' "Jump" which initially sounds like pure schmaltz, but the writing is actually incredibly well done and intricate. In my opinion its a guilty pleasure intertwined with a legitimately satisfying musical experience, best of both worlds!
    Van Dyke Parks is like that. He seems to simultaneously be a first-rate creative artist, a totally professional master of the expected, completely in love with almost every kind of traditional music, equally completely in love with some of the corniest commercial hokum imaginable, and finds no contradiction in any of it. I suppose that's what happens if you have that level of talent: You can make anything be your own music, find a way for it to be an expression of your own artistic voice even if you're following a path trodden into dust by lesser artists and not deviating an inch from it. In a way, it might be a point of pride to be able to create music that straight, that perfectly and correctly embodying every cliche of an idiom, that devoid of any individual flair but the subtlest. And yet this is the guy who wrote the lyrics for "Surf's Up".

  11. #111
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    I enjoy his Song Cycle a lot. Never heard any of his other albums though.

  12. #112
    Quote Originally Posted by Baribrotzer View Post
    Van Dyke Parks is like that. He seems to simultaneously be a first-rate creative artist, a totally professional master of the expected, completely in love with almost every kind of traditional music, equally completely in love with some of the corniest commercial hokum imaginable, and finds no contradiction in any of it. I suppose that's what happens if you have that level of talent: You can make anything be your own music, find a way for it to be an expression of your own artistic voice even if you're following a path trodden into dust by lesser artists and not deviating an inch from it. In a way, it might be a point of pride to be able to create music that straight, that perfectly and correctly embodying every cliche of an idiom, that devoid of any individual flair but the subtlest. And yet this is the guy who wrote the lyrics for "Surf's Up".
    I agree that he clearly absorbs and uses practically every trope of whatever style hes going for on an album, but I wouldn't say he plays it "straight." while his melodies are often very singable and traditional sounding, I find there's always something idiosyncratic in the harmony, arrangement, or rhythm that keeps his music from solely being a collection of genre exercises. "Jump" sticks out to me more in a guilty pleasure way because it's basically Parks' take on a Broadway musical numbers, which more often than not I personally find to be quite cheese drenched.

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  13. #113
    Member since March 2004 mozo-pg's Avatar
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    I don't really have guilty pleasures but for music eons outside the scope of progressive rock, I regularly watch American Idol (although Katty Perry is infinitely annoying) and The Voice because I like all music, even mimed music that is done well.
    What can this strange device be? When I touch it, it brings forth a sound.

  14. #114
    I think some people are misunderstanding the term ‘guilty pleasure’.

    It doesn’t mean that one actually feels guilt or shame or is pressured by social needs to conform or any of that, but rather that one enjoys something that the ‘community’ (in this case the PE community) does not generally hold in high regard.

    For example, I indulged a guilty pleasure recently at a craft beer joint by ordering a Corona. I wanted it. I enjoyed it. I felt no shame. But it was a ‘guilty pleasure’ nonetheless.

  15. #115
    Orange Tick Squasher Buddhabreath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post

    I’m free to dress any way I please, listen to whatever I want, and sing Donna Summer in the shower if I want. Haters gonna hate regardless.
    Sing Donna Summer in the shower? I now hate you.
    The combined fortunes of the world's 26 richest individuals reached $1.4 trillion last year — the same amount as the total wealth of the 3.8 billion poorest people.

  16. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Most of us hopefully grew out of that phase of needing to conform that defines a boy’s adolescence. I remember school as a rigorous highly competitive highly stratified environment where everyone was either picked on or did the bullying — or both.

    But life since graduation has been a lot less judgmental. I’m free to dress any way I please, listen to whatever I want, and sing Donna Summer in the shower if I want. Haters gonna hate regardless.
    Donna Summer?

    I think I prefer Bronski Beat, but I can't sing that high.

  17. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by Trane View Post
    never felt guilty for liking music, and if I like it, it's good.



    Yeah, women don't experience the shame/guilt about liking something "they shouldn't be", like men would, according to the guidelines or whatever social hang-ups men put in between themselves.

    Men would feel shameful to like girly pink cars and feel guilty to enjoy the one they bought in a plain brown wrapping paper delivered to their bunker, that only they have access to.
    There were a few girls taking workshop (named pompously "industrial arts") optional course in high-school without making a dent in their reputation (like being a "butch" or something), but the lone guy taking the "homek" courses (home economics, but this was cooking, sowing and cleaning stuff on top of budget for the home) in the same high-school was a pure "faggot", even according to most girls.


    BTW, I never even heard any names of those German artistes you named, but I bet a few of them are champions of Munich's Oktoberfest sing-along songs compilations
    Well, I used to feel guilty about reading certain books, and no, not Barbara Cartland or simular penny-novels, because I really don't like those.

    Some of the German artists I like are popular during carnaval, especially Brings, which started as hard-rock and had an album produced by Joey Balin and with Rob Halford doing backing vocals on one song.

  18. #118
    Quote Originally Posted by Teddy Vengeance View Post
    I think some people are misunderstanding the term ‘guilty pleasure’.

    It doesn’t mean that one actually feels guilt or shame or is pressured by social needs to conform or any of that, but rather that one enjoys something that the ‘community’ (in this case the PE community) does not generally hold in high regard.
    Yup. If it was an actual guilt or shame, we'd leave the pleasure part out of the description out entirely. In some cases, guilty pleasures can even be worn as a badge of honor, paradoxically undermining guilt to the point that it's reclaimed as some sort of personal power. Threads like this can be good therapy for the shame driven, assuming some bellend doesn't decide to drop in and personally attack the person for liking something they don't.

    Most of us hopefully grew out of that phase of needing to conform that defines a boy’s adolescence.
    There are still a lot of people that struggle to even admit the things they like to other people, usually for reasons of bullying and what not in their youth. My dad and a couple of friends I had growing up were like that. I understood why they were that way (judgmental parents, nasty siblings, bullies,) but I felt sorry for them because they were essentially always in flight from themselves. They genuinely felt passionate about something and wanted to share it with others, but were so stricken by shame and negative experiences that they lied to save face, effectively betraying their own personalities to placate people they didn't even like. I can't imagine what it must be like to go through a day with such a conflicted, fearful mindset.

    Men would feel shameful to like girly pink cars and feel guilty to enjoy the one they bought in a plain brown wrapping paper delivered to their bunker, that only they have access to.
    I started playing guitar with a hot pink pick after realizing how practical it was to have. I shed picks like dead skin cells, and pink is a hard color to misplace.

  19. #119
    Banned Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teddy Vengeance View Post
    For example, I indulged a guilty pleasure recently at a craft beer joint by ordering a Corona. I wanted it. I enjoyed it. I felt no shame. But it was a ‘guilty pleasure’ nonetheless.
    The same company puts out a product called Chelada Tamarind Picante that is beer with tomato, salt, lime, tamarind and chipotle pepper added, and that's a guilty pleasure of mine because I always poo-pooed people who added lime to beer. It's hard to find around here, and they go for $3-something apiece, but it's absolutely great accompaniment when you're having a steak.

  20. #120
    Member Emeritus (A.M.P.) rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lopez View Post
    I wish I had a first pressing of The Ark with "The Arc" on the LP cover. Mine is a latter pressing with "Ark" spelled correctly.
    Discogs has a picture of it.

  21. #121
    Banned Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    I quickly discovered that several songs I remembered as being by Chad & Jeremy, were actually by Peter & Gordon. Seems that Peter & Jeremy & Chad & Gordon were all mixed up in my head. Both groups featured a guy in black glasses, both groups did a half dozen hits and a ton of dreck, both duos seem to have been singing over tracks by anonymous studio musicians.
    Well, this won't help any:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chad_%...00s_and_beyond

    Peter and Jeremy have done fairly recent touring together.

  22. #122
    The Carpenters, Tori Amos and Sarah McLachlan's earlier stuff (first 3 albums). Also many non-prog KSHE classics.

  23. #123
    Member Emeritus (A.M.P.) rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buddhabreath View Post
    Sing Donna Summer in the shower? I now hate you.
    I didn’t say I sing her WELL. The door stays closed.

  24. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by winkersnufs View Post
    Cleveland's Michael Stanley Band
    Stagepass is one of my favorite live albums

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