The Flower Kings "Waiting For Miracles" - new double album - 8 November 2019

[Progatron]

My review is up, for anyone interested!

https://www.velvetthunder.co.uk/the-...ide-out-music/

Thanks for the review. 6 instrumental tracks. I like the sound of that!

Bear in mind that three of them are shorter in length (House Of Cards 1&2 and Busking At Brobank), but instrumentals all the same. The album has a lot of instrumental sections throughout, even in the vocal songs.

[Interstellar]

You should check out Banks of Eden. It's probably my third favorite of theirs. There is no filler, imho, and it is two discs that are about 40 minutes each. Very easy listen. Rather than elaborate on every idea he as, Stolt seems to take the best stuff he's come up with and use that. I'd be interested to see what Roine would come up with if he worked with an outside producer like Nigel Goodrich or something. Less is more as far as I'm concerned and I just think it's impossible to create a perfect double album. I see the template for a classic as CTTE; an epic and two mini-epics. I wonder how Stolt would do with those restraints. I could take any one of their albums and maybe pull together a classic like that. Sorry...rambling now.

Thanks for the advice. I may check BOE with this in mind. I've had the same kind of thoughts as you about a "less is more" approach.
But I guess the "everything but the kitchen sink (or including it)" approach is part of TFK's identity...

[Plasmatopia]

If combining singular and plural within the same sentence fits your definition of "lovably quirky", then I get what you're saying.

Indeed it's ultimately a matter of personal preference. It's strange (to me) that those most bothered by these approximations in this thread are both French, and the native English speakers mostly don't seem to mind. It would also be a problem for me if this was about non-French writing in poor French - which is almost systematically the case when it happens, incidentally. Although I prefer English-sung music as a rule, it's really rather people sang in their own language rather than opt for English.

Interesting comments that made me think of this interview with Noam Chomsky. Check it out in particular beginning just a little before the 7-minute mark.




I listened to a few tracks from the English version of the new Opeth after having heard only the Swedish version a few times and the English just didn't feel right somehow.

[Top Cat]

I listened to a few tracks from the English version of the new Opeth after having heard only the Swedish version a few times and the English just didn't feel right somehow.

We listened to PFM's The World friday night and it was the Italian vocal version. Both my wife and I love the way the the vocals in Italian just flow better with the music than the English version.

[LeFrog]

I listened to a few tracks from the English version of the new Opeth after having heard only the Swedish version a few times and the English just didn't feel right somehow.

I realized the English version didn't really work for me when I was reading along to the lyrics, but without them I couldn't really make out what he was singing anyway so it didn't sound all that different from the Swedish version !
It's not that it's bad English but the sentences don't always seem to make much sense, as if the goal was first and foremost to sound as similar as possible to the Swedish version, with the actual meaning being secondary.
So both versions work for me as it seems they sound quite similar by design, but I prefer the English version where I can occasionally catch a line or two, unlike Swedish.

[Plasmatopia]

I realized the English version didn't really work for me when I was reading along to the lyrics, but without them I couldn't really make out what he was singing anyway so it didn't sound all that different from the Swedish version !
It's not that it's bad English but the sentences don't always seem to make much sense, as if the goal was first and foremost to sound as similar as possible to the Swedish version, with the actual meaning being secondary.
So both versions work for me as it seems they sound quite similar by design, but I prefer the English version where I can occasionally catch a line or two, unlike Swedish.

I could see myself listening to the English version a couple of times to get an idea of what the songs are about, but I'd probably revert back to the Swedish. It could be all psychological, but the Swedish feels like it was meant to be. And of course we know that's what was first intended anyway.

[Plasmatopia]

We listened to PFM's The World friday night and it was the Italian vocal version. Both my wife and I love the way the the vocals in Italian just flow better with the music than the English version.

It would be surprising if the English version seemed more natural! I'm sure certain things (in any language) are hard enough to translate in a satisfying way in the first place, but to have the correct flow and rhythmic structure seems unlikely happen.

[zumacraig]

Thanks for the advice. I may check BOE with this in mind. I've had the same kind of thoughts as you about a "less is more" approach.
But I guess the "everything but the kitchen sink (or including it)" approach is part of TFK's identity...

LOL, good point about TFK's identity. Everything just clicked for me on BOE. Great cover art, an epic that is interesting all the way through and a few really good memorable songs. I was so excited that the band went straight back to the studio to do Desolation Rose. That turned out to be a bloated mess to me. Only a few memorable choruses and lots of minor chord riffs and just a bigger sound than BOE. BOE really had that warm, in-studio feel. FWIW, I though Sum was a fairly concise album too.

[Rick L.]

"No more kiss will seal the lie" is actually one of the worst offenders.

He means KISS. The band. Now, it makes total sense.

[aith01]

LOL, good point about TFK's identity. Everything just clicked for me on BOE. Great cover art, an epic that is interesting all the way through and a few really good memorable songs. I was so excited that the band went straight back to the studio to do Desolation Rose. That turned out to be a bloated mess to me. Only a few memorable choruses and lots of minor chord riffs and just a bigger sound than BOE. BOE really had that warm, in-studio feel. FWIW, I though Sum was a fairly concise album too.

I loved BoE too, but I really loved Desolation Rose as well. It was a different style for TFK, but it had some really lovely things IMO. "Resurrected Judas" has this autumnal feeling that reminds me of some of the mid-period Genesis songs, like Squonk or Entangled, for some reason.

Desolation Rose took more time for me to appreciate, but it's a diverse and rewarding listen I think.

[JKL2000]

This might not be a bad place to ask: what does the Manifesto of an Alchemist album sound like? If it sounds different from the previous couple FK albums, how so? I have it but haven’t listened to it yet.

[SRS]

on the Banks of Eden vs. Desolation Rose debate I side with Desolation Rose. Mostly because I never really warmed up to "Numbers" - although the ending of that song is great. DR really worked for me all the way through.

Re: What does Manifesto of an Alchemist sound like? It doesn't sound anything like BoE or DR that's for sure! I think it sounds like a missing early Flower Kings album. I would slot it as sounding like something that would have come out between The Flower King and BitWoA. Some of this has to do with Roine and Michael Stolt handling the bass. Except the songs aren't quite as strong all the way through as on those early albums. Where they are good they are really good (High Road, Rio Grande, Six Thirty Wake-Up) but there are also a few songs I'm not so keen on.

[aith01]

on the Banks of Eden vs. Desolation Rose debate I side with Desolation Rose. Mostly because I never really warmed up to "Numbers" - although the ending of that song is great. DR really worked for me all the way through.

Re: What does Manifesto of an Alchemist sound like? It doesn't sound anything like BoE or DR that's for sure! I think it sounds like a missing early Flower Kings album. I would slot it as sounding like something that would have come out between The Flower King and BitWoA. Some of this has to do with Roine and Michael Stolt handling the bass. Except the songs aren't quite as strong all the way through as on those early albums. Where they are good they are really good (High Road, Rio Grande, Six Thirty Wake-Up) but there are also a few songs I'm not so keen on.

I agree with pretty much all of this, although I do really like "Numbers".

"High Road" is one of my favorite songs Roine has ever done.

[ScottAM]

Good interview! Sounds like Anderson/Stolt isn't coming out anytime soon though, which is a bit of a bummer. Though I guess a new TFK album and a new TA album will make up for that a bit! At least it's still in the works.

I'd also love to know more about the "falling out" Roine and Tomas seem to have had, or if it was really down to Tomas' hearing issues (Tomas did initially seem upset that he wasn't at least asked to join the Flower King Revisited tour which eventually became the current Flower Kings). I think we may never know.

I think Roine spelled it out pretty clearly here. Having interviewed Roine a few times, including this one that you're referring to, what I take from it is that Roine didn't really feel like he was close friends anymore with Tomas and that there wasn't a good enough "vibe" in the band that leads to enjoying the music and having a good time on tour with each other. Sounds like the new band members are making it all meaningful again for Roine/Hasse/Jonas, rather than just going through it by the "Numbers". Tomas' tinnitus may have played a part, but I think it sounds more like personality issues.

[Plasmatopia]

I think Roine spelled it out pretty clearly here. Having interviewed Roine a few times, including this one that you're referring to, what I take from it is that Roine didn't really feel like he was close friends anymore with Tomas and that there wasn't a good enough "vibe" in the band that leads to enjoying the music and having a good time on tour with each other. Sounds like the new band members are making it all meaningful again for Roine/Hasse/Jonas, rather than just going through it by the "Numbers". Tomas' tinnitus may have played a part, but I think it sounds more like personality issues.

Also (in other interviews) Roine mentioned that most other TFK members had not expressed any enthusiasm or interest in doing another album. So when Tomas expressed disappointment at the recent touring without him it seems there was a bit of a disconnect there.

[miamiscot]

This might not be a bad place to ask: what does the Manifesto of an Alchemist album sound like? If it sounds different from the previous couple FK albums, how so? I have it but haven’t listened to it yet.

I truly enjoy Manifesto. It was a low-stakes affair but Roine sounds like he was happy again in the studio. Obviously not as good as any proper TFK's release but still extremely worthy. I found it to be very groovy...

[Garden Dreamer]

I never picked up Manifesto, been out of the loop I guess. Will see if any tunes are on YT to sample and check it out.

[3LockBox]

Stolt's lyrics are visual and psychedelic and very rarely cliche. Universal love etc. He does pronounce things weird sometimes. Morse has gone a long way on rhyming 'okay' with 'day'. And of course he never actually sings about what happens after you find Jesus.

Sometimes his attempts at 'Americanisms' seems a bit off.

[3LockBox]

But then again, Paul McCartney's lyrics played fast and loose with syntax and grammar when it served him too

[calyx]

But then again, Paul McCartney's lyrics played fast and loose with syntax and grammar when it served him too

Apart from the famous "...in which we live in..." in "Live and Let Die", are there really that many instances of this happening ?

[aith01]

Apart from the famous "...in which we live in..." in "Live and Let Die", are there really that many instances of this happening ?

As many as with Roine Stolt's lyrics? Probably not. But Roine isn't from England either.

[JKL2000]

Apart from the famous "...in which we live in..." in "Live and Let Die", are there really that many instances of this happening ?

I always thought it was the correct "...in which we're livin'."

[Splicer]

Sometimes his attempts at 'Americanisms' seems a bit off.

It might be because the English that Swedish people learn in school is British.

[Dan Roth]

This track sounds pretty great to my ears:

[yesstiles]

I think Roine's lyrics are charming in their oft-goofiness and cross-pond attempts.