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Thread: Post-Dio Rainbow

  1. #51
    Insect Overlord Progatron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scrotum Scissor View Post
    that Blackmore's Night endeavour I was forced to see/hear all those many years ago was possibly among the 20-or-so most pitifully kitschy endeavours I've ever had to endure.

    Big breasts though, and that always counts for something.
    Hey, he's an old man now... that can happen!

    ....Ohhhh, you meant Candice Night. Oops.
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  2. #52
    That's Mr. to you, Sir!! Trane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JJ88 View Post
    Even Rising (their best album) has a dud in the shape of 'Do You Close Your Eyes'. I can't believe they even played that thing live, it screams filler.

    Last time I played that Germany 1976 live album, the version of 'Stargazer' held up better than I remembered (although it's admittedly 'noodly'). Not sure why they didn't include it on the On Stage double album, that's not much over an hour as it stands! Always felt that track was by far their peak. 'A Light In The Black' doesn't seem to have been a set-list regular.

    Blackmore's Night has always been a must to avoid for me, I'm afraid.
    Amazingly on many live albums from their 76 tour (Germany mostly), Close Your Eyes was the only Rising track present (Stargazer being the second-most present). Neither Run With the Wolf and Tarot Woman ever made it (as Light In The Black), and Starstruck only in a medley. If only Kill The King hazd been on Rising, we'd have a near-perfect album (ALITB is still only OK).

    And yes, On Stage is sometimes criminally short on time playing.

    I forced myself to review a couple of BN albums (borrowed from my library sytem) for PA, but it was mostly pathetic.
    my music collection increased tenfolds when I switched from drug-addicts to complete nutcases.

  3. #53
    Blackmore rules, period. Even the non Dio albums have great material and I enjoy them in a different way.

  4. #54
    There are a few songs from the JLT era that are a guilty pleasure to me : "Stone Cold", "Street Of Dreams" or "Desperate Heart". Nice Poppy songs with the Blackmore touch. The rockers from that era sound quite generic to my ears ("Power", "Rock Fever"...). I felt the magic of the Dio era was gone, as was most of Blackmore's aura of edginess (is that a word ?) and mystery, but I liked the melodic playing that the man in black refined in the 80s.

    I never could stand listening to Blackmore's Night more than a few seconds, so no guilty pleasure there.

  5. #55
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    There's some great songs from the post Dio albums, Stone Cold for one is excellent although does sound rather like Foreigner but that's not a bad thing. On the instrumental front Difficult To Cure was fun and also Maybe Next Time.

  6. #56
    Member dropforge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Progatron View Post
    Hey, he's an old man now... that can happen!

    ....Ohhhh, you meant Candice Night. Oops.

  7. #57
    Member dropforge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scrotum Scissor View Post
    Long Live was never a very good album, IMO. And Blackmore was hardly more than a mediocre songwriter himself, as far as I'm concerned. While I'm no longer too crazy about his guitarplaying either, he was effective in some instances - and he had a 'mark' of his own there. But his attemptive forays into "more serious" musics was and is embarrassing, I think. I believe I must have attended some 8-900 concerts in my life, and that Blackmore's Night endeavour I was forced to see/hear all those many years ago was possibly among the 20-or-so most pitifully kitschy endeavours I've ever had to endure.

    Big breasts though, and that always counts for something.
    ^Thatsa right, and it's not like you had to listen to Hüsker Dü.

  8. #58
    Man of repute progmatist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trane View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by progmatist View Post
    He would occasionally break a real Strat for having the nerve to go out of tune. His anger issues are notorious to this day.
    Well, I think it was also pure showmanship as well.
    The Strats he played in those days weren't off the shelf. The fretboards had to be scalloped by hand, and the pickups rewired to eliminate the middle pup, making it a standard 2 pup configuration. He'd have to be good and pissed to break one.
    "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama

  9. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by dropforge View Post
    ^Thatsa right, and it's not like you had to listen to Hüsker Dü.
    "Improvisation is not an excuse for musical laziness" - Fred Frith
    "[...] things that we never dreamed of doing in Crimson or in any band that I've been in," - Tony Levin speaking of SGM

  10. #60
    Member since March 2004 mozo-pg's Avatar
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    Husker Du were Gods.
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  11. #61
    Don't really have a problem with any Post-Dio Rainbow up to Slaves And Masters or Planet P.

  12. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by JJ88 View Post
    I think that 2cd anthology Catch The Rainbow pretty much nails their best work. I played it again recently and it's very well compiled, a disc of Dio and another one with the Bonnet/JLT material. A few of the single tracks like 'Jealous Lover' and 'Weiss Heim' are on there too.
    id.
    That anthology is good, but there is also a 3CD anthology called "Since You've Been Gone" that covers a bit more ground for anyone looking for a good overview.

  13. #63
    Member dgtlman's Avatar
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    I had the opportunity to see all three Rainbow singers back in the day. Gotta admit, I liked them all at the time. Dio version was the best IMO

  14. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarGeek View Post
    They also pointed out that both guitarists favored Marshalls (well, Ritchie did before he switched in the 90's)
    The funny thing is that almost all of Ritchie's studio efforts up until the '90s or so were done on Vox amps, not Marshalls. The Marshall stacks were just for touring--initially because they were so loud (probably weren't being miked until Deep Purple graduated to arena shows). He used the 200-watt Marshall Majors for touring back then, which is partially why his live tones had that amazing 'clean bite' to them that you won't get out of a regular Marshall Plexi. Almost more like a Fender tone.

  15. #65
    [QUOTE=profusion;922183]
    The funny thing is that almost all of Ritchie's studio efforts up until the '90s or so were done on Vox amps, not Marshalls.
    Not surprising. Townshend regularly used a Fender Bandmaster (and a Gretsch Chet Atkins Hollowbody!) in the studio, while Frampton favored an Ampeg combo. Page frequently used a Supro amp.

  16. #66
    Man of repute progmatist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarGeek View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by profusion View Post
    The funny thing is that almost all of Ritchie's studio efforts up until the '90s or so were done on Vox amps, not Marshalls. The Marshall stacks were just for touring--initially because they were so loud (probably weren't being miked until Deep Purple graduated to arena shows). He used the 200-watt Marshall Majors for touring back then, which is partially why his live tones had that amazing 'clean bite' to them that you won't get out of a regular Marshall Plexi. Almost more like a Fender tone.
    Not surprising. Townshend regularly used a Fender Bandmaster (and a Gretsch Chet Atkins Hollowbody!) in the studio, while Frampton favored an Ampeg combo. Page frequently used a Supro amp.
    If you think about it, using a full sized Marshall Stack in the studio would be massive overkill. It would be very difficult to make a clean recording from one. Even at low volumes, the ambient noise that much power generates would be unacceptable.
    "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama

  17. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by progmatist View Post
    If you think about it, using a full sized Marshall Stack in the studio would be massive overkill. It would be very difficult to make a clean recording from one. Even at low volumes, the ambient noise that much power generates would be unacceptable.
    Everything you say is true. But...

    In theory, a lot of heavy metal bands actually do record with full stacks. I remember seeing an article on Slayer in Guitar Player, and they showed the rigs that King and Hanneman were using. Or at least what they said they were using. I forget what make and model they were using, but they each had big 2 4x12 stacks like they'd use onstage, with the mics pressed up right up against the speaker cabs.

    I also remember Vinnie Vincent claiming he used Laney stacks when he recorded the first Vinnie Vincent Invasion album. And so on.

    Of course, I'd never call any of those guys to be paragons of "great guitar tone". I think those guys were trying to prove they were oh so macho or whatever. You can just imagine producers and engineers warning them, "Uh, lads, it doesn't really work that way!", and the response being, "No! I need something manly!" And that's why their records suck (well, that plus the lack of songwriting, tasteful arrangements, etc).

    I know you sometimes hear people talk about how they were looking for acoustically "live" rooms (i.e. something with a lot of natural reverb) to record in. That's why Deep Purple were looking to record at the Montreux Casino, because they felt all the recording studios in England were too "dead", I think Ian Paice said "Good for folk music, not so much for rock n roll".

    But I've also heard it said you get the best guitar tone by recording in a "dead" room, like the ones that Paicey didn't think were very good for rock n roll. I remember reading an article on Billy Zoom, the guitarist from the band X. He said someone told him that he was at a Van Halen session, and they put Eddie's amp in the deadest corner of the room, and put a single SM-57 on it. He said he tried doing it that, and voila! It worked perfectly, adding that he always struggled to get a tone he liked when doing things the other way around.

  18. #68
    Modern hard rock & metal guitars are almost entirely close-miked. Traditionally with a single SM57 just off the center of the speaker and right up against the front grill, but now often paired with a Royer R121 (the first ribbon mic that can withstand loud guitars).

    You could record a full stack, but typically you'd separate the two cabinets and mic them separately. This can be useful for blending different mics or mic positions. Room mics on distorted guitars mostly add mud, in my opinion. Jimmy Page got away with it, but he didn't really use that much distortion.

  19. #69
    No Stranger In Us All? Not even a honorable mention or something?
    Carry On My Blood-Ejaculating Son - JKL2000

  20. #70
    Member dropforge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLoony View Post
    No Stranger In Us All? Not even a honorable mention or something?
    I do like it.

  21. #71
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    A while back I dug out Difficult To Cure again. I'd forgotten how ropey some of it was, especially 'Magic'. Russ Ballard's 'I Surrender' is at least a well written song in this style, IMHO.

  22. #72
    Member Jay.Dee's Avatar
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    Blackmore should have talked Joan Baez into filling Dio's shoes in Rainbow. She had the pipes powerful enough to fill the void and would have made the guitarist's transition to Blackmore's Night smoother.

  23. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay.Dee View Post
    Blackmore should have talked Joan Baez into filling Dio's shoes in Rainbow. She had the pipes powerful enough to fill the void and would have made the guitarist's transition to Blackmore's Night smoother.
    That is one of the more bizarre suggestions I have heard on PE.

  24. #74
    Member Jay.Dee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halmyre View Post
    That is one of the more bizarre suggestions I have heard on PE.
    Rob Halford would side with me on that one, even though I have to say that his lungs could not match Joan's on Judas Priest's tackle of "Diamonds & Rust".

  25. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by dropforge View Post
    I do like it.
    It's not a bad one for sure. Doogie works quite well for my ears but the drums are lacking that open hi-hat and that bugs me. They sound too sterile for me. It's hard rock, after all, why lose some of that sonic quality by stifling the sounds that can be used.

    Wonder if that was O'Reilly's choice or Blackmore's.

    Really like Ariel. Ritchie channels that gothic vibe well when he chooses to.

    Was a cool show. Temple of the King startled me. I wasn't expecting anything other than maybe Man on the Silver Mountain from the first album. I think I saw them with Chuck Burgi on drums but that was a long time ago and I didn't know that Ritchie would go through three drummers on the tour.
    Carry On My Blood-Ejaculating Son - JKL2000

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