Page 9 of 9 FirstFirst ... 56789
Results 201 to 216 of 216

Thread: Tool - Fear Inoculum - 8/30

  1. #201
    Despite selling quite well, Fear Inoculum is currently Tool's lowest rated album, lagging behind even Opiate. The differences in scores aren't staggering by any means (and it's worth rechecking the numbers later) but I think it's safe to say this is the band's most divisive album yet.

    Which... comes as no surprise to anyone.

    I swear to people that if they listen to the new Tool 57 times in a row it will grow on them and think it is actually a good album. 56 will not do. So keep listening.
    That's not 'growing on you!' That's Stockholm Syndrome!

  2. #202
    Quote Originally Posted by Guntrip View Post
    Despite selling quite well, Fear Inoculum is currently Tool's lowest rated album, lagging behind even Opiate. The differences in scores aren't staggering by any means (and it's worth rechecking the numbers later) but I think it's safe to say this is the band's most divisive album yet.

    Which... comes as no surprise to anyone.
    Yeah, not really surprising I guess. I think the 13 year wait did them no favors. Some fans' expectations were probably through the roof after such a long gap since 10,000 Days.

    Time will tell of course.

  3. #203
    Member dropforge's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    3,857
    So I hear there's a new band called Tool 57.

  4. #204
    Quote Originally Posted by aith01 View Post
    Some fans' expectations were probably through the roof after such a long gap since 10,000 Days.
    I think part of it is also the fact that a lot of fans grew up with the band. They themselves changed rapidly during the increasingly large gaps between these later albums. I think expectations were not only tremendously high, but tremendously warped in many respects. Those who expected Tool to evolve with them like they did in their teenage years are disappointed to find that Tool is... well, pretty much still Tool, only older and less energetic. Their own tastes have changed, so they naturally expect that this band that meant the world to them in their youth is going to be mind blowing again, just like the progression from Undertow to Aenima to Lateralus was in the 90s / early 00s. I've always felt that Tool lives their art, and they did a great job keeping up with the growth of their fans, speaking to them with each album that resonated with their own conflicts: disillusionment, angst, the desire for spirituality, the hypocrisy of culture, etc. But this wait was so long that they kind of fell out of sync with their main audience.

    Simply put, a lot of these guys have just... moved on. I want to like this album more than I do, but the reality is that my tastes have changed these past 13 years towards more obtuse and experimental music, and Tool just doesn't blow my mind anymore. As unreasonable as it sounds, my main source of disappointment is that they didn't change and grow with me, when it seemed (emphasis on seemed) like they used to. The difference between Undertow and Aenima was a massive evolution in sound, then Aenima to Lateralus was (and to my ears still remains) a great evolution that they've never matched since. Tool was, at one point, a band I was consistently surprised by, whereas now there's actually discussion about how "Tool sounds too much like Tool." It seems like such a strange talking point at first, but it makes sense. It's a point of contention for Tool fans who like the band because of their evolving sound, whereas it's a positive point for those who are satisfied with Tool's sound as it is and want more of the same. Neither camp is wrong, they're just coming at their expectations from very different angles.

    Meanwhile, the band itself is left wedged between a rock and a hard place. On the one hand, if they change too much, they suck. If they don't change enough, they suck. While Tool never changed so much that they could get away with drastic stuff a band like say, Ulver does, I think a sizable portion of the fanbase does (fairly) expect a distinct progression in their sound and philosophy. But compounding matters even more, even amongst the 'pro-evolution' fans, no one can agree on what direction the band should even evolve in anymore. I.E:

    -Should they become more spiritual, like on Lateralus? But if that concept has already been done, it would be a step back, so...
    -Should they focus on a raw sound? Well, they did that already, so...
    -More dick jokes?
    -Less dick jokes?
    -More electronic aspects?
    -Less electronic aspects?
    -Soundscapes, King Crimson style? How many soundscapes? Trippy pleasant soundscapes or overwhelming dark ones?
    -Different song writing structures? More jamming, less jamming, more over the top, less over the top, subdued, energetic, angry, sad? More screaming, less screaming?
    -Cynic style math rock?
    -More psychedelia?
    -Less psychedelia?
    -Full on Djent?
    -Rap rock?
    -Sudden Mekanik Destructiw Kommandoh?
    -Fuckin' dubstep?

    They can't win, and so, naturally, the fan base fractures into progressively smaller and smaller branches, each favoring a handful of elements, and each in opposition to the preferences of the rest. The evolvers or 'big picture' types don't want Tool to stay the same--they want them to deliver something beyond the beyond, something they can't even fathom that will blow their minds from one end of the universe to the other--while the satisfied types want them to stay exactly the same because they love their current sound and it's what they want and expect. Some are grappling with expectations that aren't even reasonable, others have so few expectations that they might as well not care either way. No wonder this album is driving Tool fans insane, myself included.

    But more than anything, I'm just sad. Sad that I no longer resonate with these guys in the same way, sad that the past is gone and they may never resonate with me again. But in a glass is half full sense, I think that's a testament to how much they once meant to me. Only lost love can inspire so much grief.

  5. #205
    Quote Originally Posted by Guntrip View Post
    I think part of it is also the fact that a lot of fans grew up with the band. They themselves changed rapidly during the increasingly large gaps between these later albums. I think expectations were not only tremendously high, but tremendously warped in many respects. Those who expected Tool to evolve with them like they did in their teenage years are disappointed to find that Tool is... well, pretty much still Tool, only older and less energetic. Their own tastes have changed, so they naturally expect that this band that meant the world to them in their youth is going to be mind blowing again, just like the progression from Undertow to Aenima to Lateralus was in the 90s / early 00s. I've always felt that Tool lives their art, and they did a great job keeping up with the growth of their fans, speaking to them with each album that resonated with their own conflicts: disillusionment, angst, the desire for spirituality, the hypocrisy of culture, etc. But this wait was so long that they kind of fell out of sync with their main audience.

    Simply put, a lot of these guys have just... moved on. I want to like this album more than I do, but the reality is that my tastes have changed these past 13 years towards more obtuse and experimental music, and Tool just doesn't blow my mind anymore. As unreasonable as it sounds, my main source of disappointment is that they didn't change and grow with me, when it seemed (emphasis on seemed) like they used to. The difference between Undertow and Aenima was a massive evolution in sound, then Aenima to Lateralus was (and to my ears still remains) a great evolution that they've never matched since. Tool was, at one point, a band I was consistently surprised by, whereas now there's actually discussion about how "Tool sounds too much like Tool." It seems like such a strange talking point at first, but it makes sense. It's a point of contention for Tool fans who like the band because of their evolving sound, whereas it's a positive point for those who are satisfied with Tool's sound as it is and want more of the same. Neither camp is wrong, they're just coming at their expectations from very different angles.

    Meanwhile, the band itself is left wedged between a rock and a hard place. On the one hand, if they change too much, they suck. If they don't change enough, they suck. While Tool never changed so much that they could get away with drastic stuff a band like say, Ulver does, I think a sizable portion of the fanbase does (fairly) expect a distinct progression in their sound and philosophy. But compounding matters even more, even amongst the 'pro-evolution' fans, no one can agree on what direction the band should even evolve in anymore. I.E:

    -Should they become more spiritual, like on Lateralus? But if that concept has already been done, it would be a step back, so...
    -Should they focus on a raw sound? Well, they did that already, so...
    -More dick jokes?
    -Less dick jokes?
    -More electronic aspects?
    -Less electronic aspects?
    -Soundscapes, King Crimson style? How many soundscapes? Trippy pleasant soundscapes or overwhelming dark ones?
    -Different song writing structures? More jamming, less jamming, more over the top, less over the top, subdued, energetic, angry, sad? More screaming, less screaming?
    -Cynic style math rock?
    -More psychedelia?
    -Less psychedelia?
    -Full on Djent?
    -Rap rock?
    -Sudden Mekanik Destructiw Kommandoh?
    -Fuckin' dubstep?

    They can't win, and so, naturally, the fan base fractures into progressively smaller and smaller branches, each favoring a handful of elements, and each in opposition to the preferences of the rest. The evolvers or 'big picture' types don't want Tool to stay the same--they want them to deliver something beyond the beyond, something they can't even fathom that will blow their minds from one end of the universe to the other--while the satisfied types want them to stay exactly the same because they love their current sound and it's what they want and expect. Some are grappling with expectations that aren't even reasonable, others have so few expectations that they might as well not care either way. No wonder this album is driving Tool fans insane, myself included.

    But more than anything, I'm just sad. Sad that I no longer resonate with these guys in the same way, sad that the past is gone and they may never resonate with me again. But in a glass is half full sense, I think that's a testament to how much they once meant to me. Only lost love can inspire so much grief.
    Those are some good points, and you may be onto something. For instance, since 10,000 Days came out, I’ve learned about Magma, Koenjihyakkei, Cardiacs, and a bunch of others who are arguably more “out there” than Tool. So hearing music that sounds like Tool isn’t the mind-expanding experience it once was for me. Through no real fault of their own of course.

    I experienced something similar with Nine Inch Nails. After Year Zero, which I loved at the time, I haven’t really liked much of what he’s done since. Even revisiting the old stuff just doesn’t get me the same way anymore, and I think it has to do with your point about growing. I’m older now, less angry, and I don’t really feel the desire for NIN’s music like I used to. If that makes any sense.

    Still, I’m sorry that you feel sad about it. Guess it happens to a lot of us, in one way or another. Some of the things from our youth that we were passionate about wane with time or as perspective changes. It still sucks though.

  6. #206
    cunning linguist 3LockBox's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    hiding out in treetops, shouting out rude names
    Posts
    3,657
    Quote Originally Posted by Guntrip View Post
    I think part of it is also the fact that a lot of fans grew up with the band. They themselves changed rapidly during the increasingly large gaps between these later albums. I think expectations were not only tremendously high, but tremendously warped in many respects. Those who expected Tool to evolve with them like they did in their teenage years are disappointed to find that Tool is... well, pretty much still Tool, only older and less energetic. Their own tastes have changed, so they naturally expect that this band that meant the world to them in their youth is going to be mind blowing again, just like the progression from Undertow to Aenima to Lateralus was in the 90s / early 00s. I've always felt that Tool lives their art, and they did a great job keeping up with the growth of their fans, speaking to them with each album that resonated with their own conflicts: disillusionment, angst, the desire for spirituality, the hypocrisy of culture, etc. But this wait was so long that they kind of fell out of sync with their main audience.

    Simply put, a lot of these guys have just... moved on. I want to like this album more than I do, but the reality is that my tastes have changed these past 13 years towards more obtuse and experimental music, and Tool just doesn't blow my mind anymore. As unreasonable as it sounds, my main source of disappointment is that they didn't change and grow with me, when it seemed (emphasis on seemed) like they used to. The difference between Undertow and Aenima was a massive evolution in sound, then Aenima to Lateralus was (and to my ears still remains) a great evolution that they've never matched since. Tool was, at one point, a band I was consistently surprised by, whereas now there's actually discussion about how "Tool sounds too much like Tool." It seems like such a strange talking point at first, but it makes sense. It's a point of contention for Tool fans who like the band because of their evolving sound, whereas it's a positive point for those who are satisfied with Tool's sound as it is and want more of the same. Neither camp is wrong, they're just coming at their expectations from very different angles.

    Meanwhile, the band itself is left wedged between a rock and a hard place. On the one hand, if they change too much, they suck. If they don't change enough, they suck. While Tool never changed so much that they could get away with drastic stuff a band like say, Ulver does, I think a sizable portion of the fanbase does (fairly) expect a distinct progression in their sound and philosophy. But compounding matters even more, even amongst the 'pro-evolution' fans, no one can agree on what direction the band should even evolve in anymore. I.E:

    -Should they become more spiritual, like on Lateralus? But if that concept has already been done, it would be a step back, so...
    -Should they focus on a raw sound? Well, they did that already, so...
    -More dick jokes?
    -Less dick jokes?
    -More electronic aspects?
    -Less electronic aspects?
    -Soundscapes, King Crimson style? How many soundscapes? Trippy pleasant soundscapes or overwhelming dark ones?
    -Different song writing structures? More jamming, less jamming, more over the top, less over the top, subdued, energetic, angry, sad? More screaming, less screaming?
    -Cynic style math rock?
    -More psychedelia?
    -Less psychedelia?
    -Full on Djent?
    -Rap rock?
    -Sudden Mekanik Destructiw Kommandoh?
    -Fuckin' dubstep?

    They can't win, and so, naturally, the fan base fractures into progressively smaller and smaller branches, each favoring a handful of elements, and each in opposition to the preferences of the rest. The evolvers or 'big picture' types don't want Tool to stay the same--they want them to deliver something beyond the beyond, something they can't even fathom that will blow their minds from one end of the universe to the other--while the satisfied types want them to stay exactly the same because they love their current sound and it's what they want and expect. Some are grappling with expectations that aren't even reasonable, others have so few expectations that they might as well not care either way. No wonder this album is driving Tool fans insane, myself included.

    But more than anything, I'm just sad. Sad that I no longer resonate with these guys in the same way, sad that the past is gone and they may never resonate with me again. But in a glass is half full sense, I think that's a testament to how much they once meant to me. Only lost love can inspire so much grief.
    I hate when my favorite bands make the same album over and over. I also hate it when they go in a different direction.

  7. #207
    Member The Czar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Twin Peaks
    Posts
    789
    "The song "Schism" has 47 time signature changes."

    Fates Warning "Part of the Machine" ... so much more I interesting

  8. #208
    Quote Originally Posted by The Czar View Post
    "The song "Schism" has 47 time signature changes."

    Fates Warning "Part of the Machine" ... so much more I interesting
    Hmm... Fates Warning is a bit more “metal”, though.

  9. #209
    Quote Originally Posted by Guntrip View Post
    Tool was, at one point, a band I was consistently surprised by, whereas now there's actually discussion about how "Tool sounds too much like Tool."
    That's the history of progressive rock you're describing there. There are two ways of sell-out: one is to go for easier to the ear music so as to please the masses, the other is to repeat the successful formula so as to please the base of fans. To me Fear Inoculum sounds incredibly mainstream - 47 changes of time signature or not - and that's the source of disappointment.


    Quote Originally Posted by aith01 View Post
    I dunno... even for the folks who only like Tool when they sound like someone else, not when they sound like Tool?
    Of course I am exaggerating, but all this blatant effort from people to like the album, to convince others to like the album is a bit irritating. I am not talking just about PE. It's not like we're talking about Henry Cow or Mahler that one needs multiple listens so as to appreciate. People can like the album as much as they want, but when it is presented like a work of unfathomable depth that's so hard to grasp it's getting a bit too much.

  10. #210
    Member Phlakaton's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Austin, TX
    Posts
    713
    Quote Originally Posted by dropforge View Post
    So I hear there's a new band called Tool 57.
    LMAO

  11. #211
    Quote Originally Posted by Zappathustra View Post
    Of course I am exaggerating, but all this blatant effort from people to like the album, to convince others to like the album is a bit irritating. I am not talking just about PE. It's not like we're talking about Henry Cow or Mahler that one needs multiple listens so as to appreciate. People can like the album as much as they want, but when it is presented like a work of unfathomable depth that's so hard to grasp it's getting a bit too much.
    I understand where you're coming from, and I was being facetious myself.

    For some people, this new album may just be difficult to grasp for them even though it's not especially deep or complicated compared to some of the really challenging stuff. It's a relative thing, I suppose.

    One thing I will say is that sometimes an album grows on someone over time not because it was too difficult to appreciate at first, but simply due to familiarity and associated memories.

  12. #212
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Iowa City IA
    Posts
    2,438
    I'm glad I'm not a huge Tool fan even though I own all the back catalogue. I never paid much attention to the new-album-soon prophecies and had no expectations regarding what FI would sound like, when and if it actually materialized. If I had not liked what I heard on Youtube I wouldn't have given it two further thoughts. But it clicked with me from listen #1 and I've been playing the hell out of it since.

    But I can see that people who are actively waiting for an album to come out (for 13 years lol...) build up expectations and any deviation from those expectations could be disappointing. Too similar! Too different!

  13. #213
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Kalamazoo Michigan
    Posts
    9,579
    Quote Originally Posted by 3LockBox View Post
    I hate when my favorite bands make the same album over and over. I also hate it when they go in a different direction.
    Quote of the day!

  14. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by arturs View Post
    I'm glad I'm not a huge Tool fan even though I own all the back catalogue. I never paid much attention to the new-album-soon prophecies and had no expectations regarding what FI would sound like, when and if it actually materialized. If I had not liked what I heard on Youtube I wouldn't have given it two further thoughts. But it clicked with me from listen #1 and I've been playing the hell out of it since.

    But I can see that people who are actively waiting for an album to come out (for 13 years lol...) build up expectations and any deviation from those expectations could be disappointing. Too similar! Too different!
    This ^

  15. #215
    Member Rajaz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    New Scotland, Canada
    Posts
    1,033
    This album is mystifying, innovative, heavy at times and vocally a pleasure to listen to. It may sound odd, but for me this is music is relaxing and will awaken any dormant senses.
    Love the guitar intro to Invincible, flows right through like a soft and gently wave. Bass is metallic and clear, everything is in its rightful place.
    My rating 8.5/10

  16. #216
    Member Kcrimso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Espoo, Finland
    Posts
    2,381
    My Fear Inoculum review (only four years late!): https://pienemmatpurot.com/review-to...inoculum-2019/
    My progressive music site: https://pienemmatpurot.com/ Reviews in English: https://pienemmatpurot.com/in-english/

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •