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Thread: Is "Burn" Deep Purple's Best Album???

  1. #26
    Ding ding ding!

    Quote Originally Posted by spacefreak View Post
    No. That's Fireball for me.

  2. #27
    Member Guitarplyrjvb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zappathustra View Post
    Is Strange kind of woman in Fireball? I thought it was a single.
    . Yup! It was also released as a single.

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Supersonic Scientist View Post
    I might get top-level-shit for saying this....but here goes...

    To my ears, In Rock, Machine Head, Fireball & WDWTWA could have been recorded/performed better. They all lack a certain "polish" (not sure if that is the exact term I'm looking for) I really love the "sound" of the Burn album. Those other albums lack that to certain degrees...many of the songs on those studio albums sound somewhat "flat" to my ears. I would LOVE to hear a new Metal/Heavy band cover; Pictures From Home and a host of other DP tunes from that era to hear what these songs' potential really could be.

    For the record: I love DP & Blackmore was a pivotal guitar player for me in my early guitar-learning years. The MKII version of DP was untouchable as a LIVE unit back-in-the-day!!!!!!
    I think Martin Birch had a lot to do with the sound of Burn. Machine Head, IMHO, suffers from being too clean and polished. I like the Made in Japan versions of that albums songs better. Compare the two versions of Highway Star. That thing just growls on MIJ!

  4. #29
    Member Jerjo's Avatar
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    In terms of live, I prefer the BBC In Concert 70/72. The swagger as they tore into the new material on the '72 disc is impressive.
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  5. #30
    Man of repute progmatist's Avatar
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    I forgot to add myself to the s/t list. The song April is perhaps the proggiest thing DP has ever done.
    "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama

  6. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Guitarplyrjvb View Post
    . Yup! It was also released as a single.
    Well, we're bpth correct - not in Europe

  7. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Guitarplyrjvb View Post
    I always thought Rod Evans was trying too much to be Elvis, so I never bothered much with the first 3. That said, I love his work in Captain Beyond.
    Jon Lord had a great line about Rod, in a late 80's documentary on the band: "He was a little bit Tom Jones, a little bit, Englebert Humperdinck...but we beat him sufficiently into shape".
    I would LOVE to hear a new Metal/Heavy band cover; Pictures From Home and a host of other DP tunes from that era to hear what these songs' potential really could be.
    You mean with 300 bpm, continuous double bass drum 32nd notes all over everything, cookie monster vocals, and guitar solos that make Yngwie Malmsteen sound like BB King in comparison?!
    Quote Originally Posted by Zappathustra
    Is Strange kind of woman in Fireball? I thought it was a single.
    It was a single, and as such, was excluded from the original UK release of the album, but the Stateside version of the album does include it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Progmatist
    My favorite live album is Made in Europe, although it's more of a recompilation than a true live album. It features Mark III performances after Stormbringer, but before Richie left. It also contains the best performances of Burn and You Fool No One I've ever head.
    Made In Europe was culled from, I believe, the last but one show the MKII lineup ever played. I've forgotten exactly when it was that Ritchie made it known that he wasn't going to continue in the band, but management obviously knew, because they recorded the last three shows of the tour. I've often wondered if it would be possible to compile an expanded version of Made In Europe, giving us the full concert. I know the other two shows, from Graz and Paris have been released in a few different packages over the years.

    Oh, and if Ritchie seems to be "phoning it in" on Stormbringer, it was because he wasn't happy with the band's direction. He said the band had gotten "too funky...I like blues rock, and heavy rock, and medieval rock, but not that funky blues".

    (No, I don't know what medieval rock is either)

  8. #33
    Some great tracks from the Coverdale/Hughes version of the band but overall I feel their output is less than the sum of its parts.
    "Moustache stays right where it's at" - Clutch

  9. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Jerjo View Post
    In terms of live, I prefer the BBC In Concert 70/72. The swagger as they tore into the new material on the '72 disc is impressive.
    Yeah, the old double LP version was one of the first Deep Purple albums I owned. They had to swap the songs from the 1970 concert (where they only did four numbers) to fit it onto a single LP, that clocked in at over 50 minutes, and they had to leave Smoke On The Water and I think one other song, plus all the between song chatter off the second one.

  10. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Guitarplyrjvb View Post
    I have to give the self-titled one a listen. Have never heard it! I always thought Rod Evans was trying too much to be Elvis, so I never bothered much with the first 3. That said, I love his work in Captain Beyond.
    I have never been a fan of Evans' voice. I always thought he sounded like a self-trained lounge lizard. That being said (written), I think it's his high point as a member of the band. Some might scoff at the Donovan cover ("Lalena"), but he's quite good on it and I like the track. The opening track "Chasing Shadows" is my all-time favorite DP track. One of those great songs where the drumming stays the same throughout. "Tomorrow Never Knows" is another.

    Quote Originally Posted by progmatist View Post
    I forgot to add myself to the s/t list. The song April is perhaps the proggiest thing DP has ever done.
    +1
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  11. #36
    Progdog ThomasKDye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarGeek View Post
    (No, I don't know what medieval rock is either)
    Tull, probably.
    "Arf." -- Frank Zappa, "Beauty Knows No Pain" (live version)

  12. #37
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    Burn is pretty good. Not their best, I guess. Never been a huge fan of DP so not sure what their best album is.

  13. #38
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    I find the Mark I albums a little patchy- usually thanks to the more overblown, dated covers- but the highpoints are maybe higher than what is on the Mark III/IV albums. 'And The Address', 'Hush', 'Wring That Neck', 'Mandrake Root', 'Anthem', 'Shield', 'Bird Has Flown', 'Chasing Shadows' etc. are all excellent.

    RE; BBC 1970-2. I sometimes find these BBC live concerts to be historically fascinating and essential listening, but somewhat sterile compared to a 'normal' live show- maybe due to DJ chatter and the like. That's the case here for me. The 1972 show has debut live performances of some songs, but I'd never take this over Made In Japan. The energy is much higher on the latter IMHO, not least because they had played the songs more by then.

    RE; Mark IV with Tommy Bolin. I think 'This Time Around/Owed To G' is easily the best thing Hughes did in Deep Purple, and 'You Keep On Moving' is also a gem. 'Comin' Home' works in a sort of 'Speed King' meets 'Stormbringer'-type of way. 'Lady Luck' is a good Coverdale showcase. The rest of Come Taste The Band is just OK-to-average, I'd say. Hughes and Bolin were burning the candle at both ends so the live shows were apparently very patchy. The other three all agreed it was over by the end of the tour.
    Last edited by JJ88; 07-26-2019 at 05:23 AM.

  14. #39
    [QUOTE=JJ88;917154]
    Hughes and Bolin were burning the candle at both ends so the live shows were apparently very patchy.
    Glenn said once that he didn't realize he was out of control. I think his words was "Wasn't everyone snorting cocaine off strippers' bottoms?", as if to suggest he didn't at the time that he, apparently, was the only engaged in such activities. Supposedly, they had to carry a guitar case full of cocaine on tour, to keep Bolin and Hughes happy.

    As for the live shows, from what I gather, some shows were great, some not so great, and some, I gather were out and out awful. There was a show from, I think, the Long Beach Arena, that was recorded for a King Biscuit, which came out on CD back in the 90's, I have that but haven't listened to it in ages.

    I know a lot of people trash Last Concert In Japan, but I thikn the problems with that had a lot to do with the mix and editing. I've never actually heard the album in that form, but I recall reading that the record company listed Woman From Tokyo on the back cover of the album, making it seem like they actually played the full song, when it fact it was just a little tease that was taken out of context, from Lord's nightly keyboard solo, and placed somewhere else on the album. I have the double CD that came out of the full concert (I think it was called This Time Around), remixed and as I recall, sounding much better than Last Concert In Japan's reputation suggests. I haven't listened to it in a long long time though.

    There's a couple different versions of what happened to Tommy Bolin when the band got to Japan. Supposedly, the band had "handlers" or whatever you want to say, security people who were meant to keep the drug dealers away from Tommy, as it was known that he was a full blown addict when he joined the band (though I think it was either Jan Hammer or Joe Walsh who once suggested that Bolin only got that way after he joined Deep Purple and was surrounded by "yes men").

    Anyway, the story that's told in the THis Time Around liner notes, is that this worked out fine, until they got to Japan, and a couple dealers got through, Tommy scored, and then promptly OD'd, apparently causing one of his arms to be paralyzed. They had to postpone the shows, and when they finally did go onstage in Japan, Jon Lord to cover all the guitar solos, because Tommy was still in really bad shape. But as I recall, by the time they got to the last night of the run, he was in much better shape.

    Oh, the other story I heard was that he got wasted, and fell asleep, leaning against his arm, apparently, for something liek 18 hours. How that causes paralysis that lasts several days and is bad enough to affect a musician's ability to play, I don't know, but that's the version of what happened that I've heard.



    The other three all agreed it was over by the end of the tour.
    According to either Paice or Lord, I forget which, they came off the stage after the last night of the tour, and the two of them basically mutually decided "it's over". Then like 15-20 minutes later, David Coverdale comes into their dressing room and says "I'm quitting the band", and Lord told him "David, there's no band to quit!".

  15. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarGeek View Post
    I know a lot of people trash Last Concert In Japan, but I thikn the problems with that had a lot to do with the mix and editing. I've never actually heard the album in that form, but I recall reading that the record company listed Woman From Tokyo on the back cover of the album, making it seem like they actually played the full song, when it fact it was just a little tease that was taken out of context, from Lord's nightly keyboard solo, and placed somewhere else on the album. I have the double CD that came out of the full concert (I think it was called This Time Around), remixed and as I recall, sounding much better than Last Concert In Japan's reputation suggests. I haven't listened to it in a long long time though. .
    I got the original vinyl import when it came out and was snookered by the listing of "Woman from Tokyo" and a pretty cool cover photo.

    I hated the album and, believe me, it had nothing to do with the mix. It's awful. Granted, I have not heard the entire show, but I cannot imagine there's enough there to resurrect it in my mind.
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  16. #41
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    ^An album with a truly terrible reputation. There's footage of this show too. Hughes was really getting heavy on the strutting and posing and general showboating in this period. It was reported a few years ago that footage of an entire Mark III concert in the US had been discovered, a version of Bolin's 'Homeward Strut' was put up on YouTube but I'm sure that was all that appeared. Perhaps nothing could be done with the sound, which was very distorted.



    As for live albums by the Mark III band, I'm only familiar with that BBC Live In London set (covering much of Burn) and the original Live In Europe album.

  17. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by JJ88 View Post

    As for live albums by the Mark III band, I'm only familiar with that BBC Live In London set (covering much of Burn) and the original Live In Europe album.
    If you like Live In Europe, you might seek out the Paris and Graz shows, which were recorded on either side of the concert on Live In Europe. I first heard the material was on a mid 90's double CD called Deep Purple MKIII: The Final Concerts, which compiled material from both shows.

    And in the last few years, both shows were released in their entirety, as part of Deep Purple's series of official bootlegs or whatever you want to call it. There was a thread about the series a couple years ago, apparently, they had this long list of shows they were going to release, but they got like half or 3/4's of the way through releasing them when something went funky with the deal with whichever label it was, and the series was discontinued.

    Apparently, if you listen carefully to some bits in some of the songs, you can hear Blackmore playing stuff that turned up on the first Rainbow album, which Ritchie was apparently already planning even before the Stormbringer tour ended. There was a comment in the Final Concerts liner notes about how Ritchie kept confusing the hell out of everyone else onstage by lapsing into guitar riffs they didn't recognize.

  18. #43
    Member Jerjo's Avatar
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    There's a lot of tragic drug tragedies in rock but one that continually gets to me is Tommy Bolin. The guy had so much potential, so many directions he could have gone in.
    I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down.'- Bob Newhart

  19. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Jerjo View Post
    There's a lot of tragic drug tragedies in rock but one that continually gets to me is Tommy Bolin. The guy had so much potential, so many directions he could have gone in.
    Me too. A great guitarist and songwriter, a decent vocalist, and he could hang with the jazz guys (as heard on Billy Cobham's Spectrum) as easily as with the rock guys.

  20. #45
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    I forgot the other thing worth seeking out if you like Burn; the DVD of the California Jam performance. Worth having if only for Blackmore's total meltdown towards the end. Tensions were high over whether they or ELP were headlining. A great pity that, unlike Deep Purple, it appears nobody recorded ELP's full set.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerjo View Post
    There's a lot of tragic drug tragedies in rock but one that continually gets to me is Tommy Bolin. The guy had so much potential, so many directions he could have gone in.
    I don't know that Deep Purple was the best vehicle for his talents, especially when he was expected to play a set-list full of material another guitarist had made famous.

  21. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by JJ88 View Post
    I forgot the other thing worth seeking out if you like Burn; the DVD of the California Jam performance. Worth having if only for Blackmore's total meltdown towards the end. Tensions were high over whether they or ELP were headlining. A great pity that, unlike Deep Purple, it appears nobody recorded ELP's full set.
    The tantrum I think had less to do with ELP and more to do with Ritchie's opinion of cameramen and photographers invading his performance space. Supposedly, at some point before going on, some guy from ABC TV asked if Ritchie was gonna smash a guitar. Ritchie reportedly said he hadn't made up his mind yet, and the ABC guy said "Well, if you do, could you please favor the camera?", meaning do it so we can get a good video of it.

    As I said, I think Ritchie has an issue with people getting into his space. I saw one interview where he talked about photographers and cameramen obscuring the audience view. If you watch the Cal Jam footage, a lot of the shots of Ritchie seem to be from behind, or at best, from the side, because Ritchie decided to stand at the lip of the stage, or whatever you want to call it. As I recall, there's a couple levels to the stage, and he spends a lot of the show in an area, where the cameraman couldn't get to. I think he did that on purpose, you know how Ritchie is.

    But I guess the guy kept getting in his way. Jon Lord, I think it was, said that Ritchie kept asking the guy to back off, saying "I need my space here", and the guy kept getting in the way. Then, if we buy the liner notes of the Cal Jam DVD I have, during Space Truckin', Ritchie suddenly remembered the guy telling him to "favor the camera". And you have to admit, you can't favor the camera much more than Ritchie. I mean, talk about your POV shot! Supposedly, the band had to pay ABC 10 grand or something like that, to cover the damage to the camera, though I think Ritchie actually just bent the sun visor thing that was on the front of the camera. When he tried to shove what was left of the neck into the lens, he actually missed. He even admitted it a couple decades later.
    A great pity that, unlike Deep Purple, it appears nobody recorded ELP's full set.
    Oh, one would imagine ELP's set was almost certainly videotaped in it's entirety. But unlike Deep Purple, ELP apparently didn't buy the footage from ABC, and it was subsequently erased, except for what was broadcast at the time on In Concert. The only reason we have Deep Purple's full set is because their management at the time bought the footage and it was thus preserved.

    Unfortunately, the same wasn't done with MKII's earlier appearance ont he same show, where all that we have left are, I think, three songs: Strange Kind Of Woman, Smoke On The Water, and Space Truckin', all cut to ribbons. And that's the only footage of MKII, from their original existence, doing Smoke On The Water.

    I don't know that Deep Purple was the best vehicle for his talents, especially when he was expected to play a set-list full of material another guitarist had made famous.
    It wasn't. I've never really been sure why he was offered the job or asked to audition or whatever, but I imagine his manager probably thought it was a "great idea" to get Tommy extra PR by sticking him into Deep Purple (probably the same reason Tommy was in The James Gang). As I recall, part of the deal was Deep Purple had to play at least a song or two from Teaser in the setlist, which I think backs up the theory that it was done for publicity purposes, rather than musical ones.

    I think he could have done just fine without the burden of replacing Ritchie Blackmore (something that worked against him, in a lot of instances, as apparently a lot of fans turned their backs on the band when they soldiered on without Ritchie). As I said, he was a talented writer and musician, and he was an in demand session player (for want of a better way of describing it). He didn't need to play in someone else's band.

  22. #47
    Member Vic2012's Avatar
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    Listening to the self titled 3rd album on YT. I was familiar with Fault Line/The Painter but hearing the whole album for the first time. Love Ritchie's tone. Is that pre-Stratocaster?

    Guitar Geeeeeeeeeek....

  23. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Vic2012 View Post
    Listening to the self titled 3rd album on YT. I was familiar with Fault Line/The Painter but hearing the whole album for the first time. Love Ritchie's tone. Is that pre-Stratocaster?

    Guitar Geeeeeeeeeek....
    You rang, Mr Adams?

    I believe so, yes. Ritchie's main guitar during the MK-I era was an ES-335. I believe he started playing a Strat around the time of the Concerto For Group And Orchestra and/or In Rock. In fact, he was still playing the ES-335 onstage during the In Rock era, as seen in the Granada TV footage, where he alternates between a black Strat and a 335.

  24. #49
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    Yeah I thought it might've been a Strat but hearing Painter with headphones I could hear it was an overdriven hollowbody.

  25. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Vic2012 View Post
    Listening to the self titled 3rd album on YT. I was familiar with Fault Line/The Painter but hearing the whole album for the first time. Love Ritchie's tone. Is that pre-Stratocaster?

    Guitar Geeeeeeeeeek....
    I never tire of that album.

    I guess Ritchie wasn't happy that they were going even closer to symphonic rock, or whatever you want to call it. That's certainly evident with the impending changes.

    But, man, I cannot get enough of it.

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