Page 5 of 5 FirstFirst 12345
Results 101 to 112 of 112

Thread: Prog in 2029...

  1. #101
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Divided Snakes of America
    Posts
    1,981
    Quote Originally Posted by Mascodagama View Post
    Does it really matter whether someone can read music? The list of musicians who have unarguably done great things without being able to is fairly extensive.
    It all depends on what you're trying to do. If you're a session musician or working in a larger ensemble with arrangements or you're in an axe-for-hire situation and expected to quickly be able to learn and play a set on short notice, then unless you're some kind of savant you'd better be able to read music.

  2. #102
    Quote Originally Posted by Mascodagama View Post
    Does it really matter whether someone can read music? The list of musicians who have unarguably done great things without being able to is fairly extensive.
    Nearly all so-called well-known musicians in 70s "prog", for instance.

    Whose music tended to attain a sense of uniqueness precisely due to the fact that it was indeed not written but constructed to sound "as if" by youngsters who went out of their way in a giant enactment of cultural self-deceit. And results were often as wonderful as they were escapist.
    "Improvisation is not an excuse for musical laziness" - Fred Frith
    "[...] things that we never dreamed of doing in Crimson or in any band that I've been in," - Tony Levin speaking of SGM

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrotum Scissor View Post
    Nearly all so-called well-known musicians in 70s "prog", for instance.

    Whose music tended to attain a sense of uniqueness precisely due to the fact that it was indeed not written but constructed to sound "as if" by youngsters who went out of their way in a giant enactment of cultural self-deceit. And results were often as wonderful as they were escapist.
    Paul McCartney,the greatest all around musician/ songwriter who ever got anywhere near "rock" recently admitted to his embarrassment of not being able to read a note of music.

    "I don't see music written on a page or a piece of paper. It's something I hear in my head"

  4. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by Phlakaton View Post
    I only had a tiny bit of that as I was born in 73 - but things change - tech changes - people change - that was in the past - staying buried in the past is a recipe for sadness and loneliness if you ask me. Its gone. Not coming back any time soon either.
    So you had a taste of it..
    Do you think the music scene is better now? Yes or No? (different is not an answer)

  5. #105
    Quote Originally Posted by wiz_d_kidd View Post
    But those keyboardist were playing violin, cello, oboe, etc. using Mellotron fakery. They were't playing a violin or cello! And the sounds they produced had a certain amount of wow and flutter, and limited duration, and became off-tuned after playing. Oh, the horrors! Your '70s analog masters were faking it, and screwing up the sound in the process. FAKERS!
    Wiz, for your further education:


  6. #106
    Quote Originally Posted by Skullhead View Post
    Paul McCartney,the greatest all around musician/ songwriter who ever got anywhere near "rock" recently admitted to his embarrassment of not being able to read a note of music.

    "I don't see music written on a page or a piece of paper. It's something I hear in my head"
    Well, then I agree with absolutely everything you say!
    "Improvisation is not an excuse for musical laziness" - Fred Frith
    "[...] things that we never dreamed of doing in Crimson or in any band that I've been in," - Tony Levin speaking of SGM

  7. #107
    Member Phlakaton's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Austin, TX
    Posts
    713
    Quote Originally Posted by Skullhead View Post
    So you had a taste of it..
    Do you think the music scene is better now? Yes or No? (different is not an answer)
    In some ways yes I think it's better - as long as the sound of the music isnt some hideous 80s synth sound or electric drums ala - 84 Zappa tours - I find a lot more music today - yes because of the obvious internet thing - but because more access to affordable equipment is available - and you can make it sound good - Frankly - I have no clue why anyone would want to deal with that mess of tape and slicing and rollback and all those pain in the arse old methods - I did enough tape to tape video and film editing to know it sucked until non-linear editing came in. The face of music is lost at this point though - unless you consider that "product" shit on the radio -

  8. #108
    cunning linguist 3LockBox's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    hiding out in treetops, shouting out rude names
    Posts
    3,655
    Blue Vino, having finally figured out how to play the music in his head, will lead a new renaissance of prog.

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by Phlakaton View Post
    In some ways yes I think it's better - as long as the sound of the music isnt some hideous 80s synth sound or electric drums ala - 84 Zappa tours - I find a lot more music today - yes because of the obvious internet thing - but because more access to affordable equipment is available - and you can make it sound good - Frankly - I have no clue why anyone would want to deal with that mess of tape and slicing and rollback and all those pain in the arse old methods - I did enough tape to tape video and film editing to know it sucked until non-linear editing came in. The face of music is lost at this point though - unless you consider that "product" shit on the radio -
    Thanks for the thoughtful and articulate reply!

  10. #110
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Portland, OR, USA
    Posts
    1,865
    Quote Originally Posted by Skullhead View Post
    Digital technology...... trivialized the better musicians and opened the door to anyone with a laptop and hard drive filled with plugins and samples to make music and then claim to be a musician.
    So did the inexpensive acoustic guitar. Any idiot could buy one, learn three chords, write bad poetry set to bad music, and think of himself as the next Dylan or Johnny Cash. Only the tools have changed.

    There are two big differences, though:
    • Distribution: Today, you can handle your own distribution for free or very inexpensively, so music made by amateurs gets out there and it formerly didn't.
    • Serendipity: It turns out that the ability to create a hit has little to do with musicianship or even talent, and far more to do with being able to give the public exactly what they want right now.
      And hearing music the way the public hears it, as opposed to the way musicians hear it - which amateurs are more likely to do because they are the public - actually gives the untrained an advantage when it comes to making hits.

    All of which means that appallingly amateurish music gets on the radio these days, rather than staying in peoples' basements and bedrooms. And while you can talk about untrained musicians being more creative because they haven't learned the formulas the professionals use, in practice most of them stumble into rediscovering the same cliches. (A musical acquaintance one told me of a guy he knew who thought he'd invented the I - IV - V progression. He apparently had no idea that it was the basis for every folk song, every country song, most garage-rock, and underlies much of Western music.)

  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by Baribrotzer View Post
    So did the inexpensive acoustic guitar. Any idiot could buy one, learn three chords, write bad poetry set to bad music, and think of himself as the next Dylan or Johnny Cash. Only the tools have changed.

    There are two big differences, though:
    • Distribution: Today, you can handle your own distribution for free or very inexpensively, so music made by amateurs gets out there and it formerly didn't.
    • Serendipity: It turns out that the ability to create a hit has little to do with musicianship or even talent, and far more to do with being able to give the public exactly what they want right now.
      And hearing music the way the public hears it, as opposed to the way musicians hear it - which amateurs are more likely to do because they are the public - actually gives the untrained an advantage when it comes to making hits.

    All of which means that appallingly amateurish music gets on the radio these days, rather than staying in peoples' basements and bedrooms. And while you can talk about untrained musicians being more creative because they haven't learned the formulas the professionals use, in practice most of them stumble into rediscovering the same cliches.
    Very insightful post, IMO.


    Quote Originally Posted by Baribrotzer View Post
    (A musical acquaintance one told me of a guy he knew who thought he'd invented the I - IV - V progression. He apparently had no idea that it was the basis for every folk song, every country song, most garage-rock, and underlies much of Western music.)
    Now this is one of the scariest things I've ever read on this forum.

  12. #112
    Man of repute progmatist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Mesa, Arizona
    Posts
    3,806
    Quote Originally Posted by Baribrotzer View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Skullhead View Post
    Digital technology...... trivialized the better musicians and opened the door to anyone with a laptop and hard drive filled with plugins and samples to make music and then claim to be a musician.
    So did the inexpensive acoustic guitar. Any idiot could buy one, learn three chords, write bad poetry set to bad music, and think of himself as the next Dylan or Johnny Cash. Only the tools have changed.

    There are two big differences, though:
    • Distribution: Today, you can handle your own distribution for free or very inexpensively, so music made by amateurs gets out there and it formerly didn't.
    • Serendipity: It turns out that the ability to create a hit has little to do with musicianship or even talent, and far more to do with being able to give the public exactly what they want right now.
      And hearing music the way the public hears it, as opposed to the way musicians hear it - which amateurs are more likely to do because they are the public - actually gives the untrained an advantage when it comes to making hits.

    All of which means that appallingly amateurish music gets on the radio these days, rather than staying in peoples' basements and bedrooms. And while you can talk about untrained musicians being more creative because they haven't learned the formulas the professionals use, in practice most of them stumble into rediscovering the same cliches. (A musical acquaintance one told me of a guy he knew who thought he'd invented the I - IV - V progression. He apparently had no idea that it was the basis for every folk song, every country song, most garage-rock, and underlies much of Western music.)
    Nobody even has to know how to sing anymore............thanks to Autotune.
    "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •