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Thread: Magma Zess

  1. #276
    Member The Czar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NogbadTheBad View Post
    I'm missing the guitar & bass, it's all vocals, keys, strings & quiet drums.
    I'll respond to Zappathustra but use this comment.
    I totally agree. The mix is horrible if you (like me) enjoy the Triton version.
    The guitars and bass are buried in the mix and the drums are quiet and kinda disappointing, because the drum beat (compared to the Triton version) hasn't really got that propulsive feel. It feels (to me) that he's not sure what or where the beat should be?
    The vocals and strings are really cool and if I want an energetic version, I'll listen to the DVD.
    I'm just disappointed that this is the studio version.
    I like it, but I wanted that visceral energy.

  2. #277
    Quote Originally Posted by The Czar View Post
    I like it, but I wanted that visceral energy.
    I completely understand, but you've already got that. It's clearly a different approach. I believe it is a very moving approach. If one wipes out expectations and listens to this with a clear mind, it is just a beautiful work of art. We can be so picky here in PE about the negative aspects of a record, but what has been accomplished here - and taken for granted - is really grand. That's how I see it at least. I do not know of any other of the big 70's bands that remotely keeps this high level of musicianship.

  3. #278
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zappathustra View Post
    I completely understand, but you've already got that. It's clearly a different approach. I believe it is a very moving approach. If one wipes out expectations and listens to this with a clear mind, it is just a beautiful work of art. We can be so picky here in PE about the negative aspects of a record, but what has been accomplished here - and taken for granted - is really grand. That's how I see it at least. I do not know of any other of the big 70's bands that remotely keeps this high level of musicianship.
    Yeah we do have a great energetic version. I just wanted a cleaner studio version with that same energy.
    Had they done it with that same DVD lineup, I think the studio version would be perfect.
    I like the new studio version, but for a Magma song that has had such great playing in previous versions, I feel that it's an abandonment of the bass,guitar and drums in favor of the strings.

    Just my opinion.

  4. #279
    We kind of get the classic intensity at the end, but just briefly. I like the album... after 50 years I think they have the right to interpret it how they wish.

  5. #280
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    Quote Originally Posted by smcfee View Post
    We kind of get the classic intensity at the end, but just briefly. I like the album... after 50 years I think they have the right to interpret it how they wish.
    I agree. They are so close to that song, it was inevitable that they would change it up.
    What classic or partial songs haven't they when finally doing the studio versions?
    I still find it odd when Rind-ë doesn't go into Liriïk Necronomicus Kant

  6. #281
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    I would also like to say that I LOVE the fact that we are discussing new Magma recordings in 2019!
    50 years of awesome!

  7. #282
    Quote Originally Posted by The Czar View Post
    I would also like to say that I LOVE the fact that we are discussing new Magma recordings in 2019!
    50 years of awesome!
    On this we can definitely agree.

  8. #283
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    I have never heared any of the live versions so this is *the* version for me. I am missing bass and guitar. Drums are way too low in the mix too.

    I will probably end up buying one of the live versions and shelve this one for eternity.

  9. #284
    ^ Your loss, man. *shrug*

  10. #285
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    The versions are just different, as with all iterations of Magma 'songs'. I like most of them, including this.
    Its really a great thing that there is room for so much variation in Magmas compositions.

    I find versions with 'instrumental' focus/stunts, more jamming, generally more magic/interesting, but there is plenty of room for everything.

  11. #286
    Unlike many true fans, Vander changed his mind. Zëss is no longer "the end of the world itself" (and incidentally, the end of Magma),
    it depicts a dream about the end of the world. Not even a nightmare. The aesthetic of the studio version is coherent with that intended meaning.
    How reprehensibly subtle ! Where's the beat ?
    So much for the expected cathartic freak out, that big ol' Crimson Armageddon - alarming clusters, inscrutable tuplets, myriad speed demons in Spandex, whizzing every known exotic scale all the way up and then poof.

  12. #287
    I'm here for the moosic NogbadTheBad's Avatar
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    So where is the best live version on CD?
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  13. #288
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    Quote Originally Posted by NogbadTheBad View Post
    So where is the best live version on CD?
    Its a taste thing, but I believe most votes goes to

    https://www.seventhrecords.com/video...ntsc-1047.html

  14. #289
    Quote Originally Posted by unclemeat View Post
    The aesthetic of the studio version is coherent with that intended meaning.
    How reprehensibly subtle ! Where's the beat ?
    So much for the expected cathartic freak out, that big ol' Crimson Armageddon - alarming clusters, inscrutable tuplets, myriad speed demons in Spandex, whizzing every known exotic scale all the way up and then poof.

  15. #290
    I also agree with unclemeat's comment. Of course, I went into the new studio version with expectations that were built upon my hearing of past versions, notably the live Epok version with its immense energy. But with Magma on disc, I know also that the disc is almost never a version similar to live versions. So, though this version of Zess is a bit more subdued than the live one, it represents a complete synthesis of 50 years of developing work, only now it is orchestral in scope, does not end in despair and holds promise for a brighter future- that is how I read the new added coda to the composition. This is composed music now; that explains the metronomic approach Morgen Agren uses here; he needs to keep time when time is ending. All of us know that Agren is capable of phenomenal technical ability, but this was not designed to be the place to show it. He is just a part of a larger whole. I stand in awe of this piece; this is so even if it does not carry the weight for me that Kohntarkosz does- that songs defines my life. But this one is a culmination.

    Here, enjoy it again, live in concert:

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  16. #291
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    ^ That's a lot of mouths to feed!

    I think it sounds good on CD but doesn't really convey the power of a live performance imo. Most Magma in the studio never really displays the true potential of the music to my ears - there are engineering, mixing, and mastering choices that I personally don't always agree with - However - the music is always phenomenal, magical, otherworldly, etc so that always takes precedent. This is no different than some vintage classical recording made in the 40's or 50's - the sound is not on par with 2019 standards but the composition can truly reveals itself in its full capacity. The EPOK DVDs usually contain what the music is capable of, and are the true gems in their catalog for me (plus its fun to watch these guys/gals do their thing).
    Last edited by chalkpie; 08-07-2019 at 08:57 AM.
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  17. #292
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    I don't know much about Magma but I know what I like and this record kicks ass!!!
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  18. #293
    I've never heard a live version of "Zess". I've only heard the studio version once, on YouTube.

    From that point of view - I think that this is a Magma masterpiece, as good as MDK or better. The piece drains you and then, with that coda, puts you back together, only changed, soothed after the catastrophic (in a good way) finish of the main piece.
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  19. #294
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    Quote Originally Posted by chalkpie View Post
    ^ That's a lot of mouths to feed!

    I think it sounds good on CD but doesn't really convey the power of a live performance imo. Most Magma in the studio never really displays the true potential of the music to my ears - there are engineering, mixing, and mastering choices that I personally don't always agree with - However - the music is always phenomenal, magical, otherworldly, etc so that always takes precedent. This is no different than some vintage classical recording made in the 40's or 50's - the sound is not on par with 2019 standards but the composition can truly reveals itself in its full capacity. The EPOK DVDs usually contain what the music is capable of, and are the true gems in their catalog for me (plus its fun to watch these guys/gals do their thing).
    We're on the same page.

  20. #295
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeuhlmate View Post
    Its a taste thing, but I believe most votes goes to

    https://www.seventhrecords.com/video...ntsc-1047.html
    Well, that's not a CD. Other than the Bobino live set (and this studio album) how many times has Zess been released on CD?
    Please don't ask questions, just use google.

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  21. #296
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    Quote Originally Posted by unclemeat View Post
    Unlike many true fans, Vander changed his mind. Zëss is no longer "the end of the world itself" (and incidentally, the end of Magma),
    it depicts a dream about the end of the world. Not even a nightmare. The aesthetic of the studio version is coherent with that intended meaning.
    How reprehensibly subtle ! Where's the beat ?
    So much for the expected cathartic freak out, that big ol' Crimson Armageddon - alarming clusters, inscrutable tuplets, myriad speed demons in Spandex, whizzing every known exotic scale all the way up and then poof.
    Ah! Well...thanks for this. It does make a bit more sense iin this context. Hopefully they will record a piece that is the endo f the world itself.
    Please don't ask questions, just use google.

    Never let good music get in the way of making a profit.

    I'm only here to reglaze my bathtub.

  22. #297
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hobo Chang Ba View Post
    Well, that's not a CD. Other than the Bobino live set (and this studio album) how many times has Zess been released on CD?
    Never.
    But you dont have to look at the TV while listening.

  23. #298
    Quote Originally Posted by Hobo Chang Ba View Post
    Well, that's not a CD. Other than the Bobino live set (and this studio album) how many times has Zess been released on CD?
    Well, there's also the acoustic verrsion on "Les Voix - Douarnenez 1992".
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  24. #299
    Quote Originally Posted by The Czar View Post
    I still find it odd when Rind-ë doesn't go into Liriïk Necronomicus Kant
    Oh me too, and especially because of how much I like Attahk.

  25. #300
    Aujourd'hui c'est le jour que nous allons mourir. Et je te dis : merci.

    I haven't yet listened to Zess and kept my eyes completely dry.

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