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Thread: Set the Controls for the Heart of the Sun

  1. #26
    Estimated Prophet notallwhowander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ronmac View Post
    So, what do true Pink Floyd fans prefer?
    You know that stuff you really like? Well, it's not that...
    Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world.

  2. #27
    Dammit. Now I find out I'm not a True Rush Fan, a True Genesis Fan, or a True Pink Floyd Fan!
    Mein Fuehrer, show us the way to Truth!

  3. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Triscuits View Post
    Call it "classic rock" if you prefer.
    So not the AOR of bands like Boston, Journey and Foreigner?

  4. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Good advice, and pretty much my rule. Oh, parts of WYWH are pretty good, and truth be told I enjoyed most of DSOTM when it first came out. But it was (and continues to be...) wayyyy overplayed on the radio!!!

    Which is why I wish it had never come out. If Floyd had continued down the path they were blazing on Meddle, Saucerful, Pompeii, Massed Gadgets and The Man and the Journey, just think where they'd be today! Think where popular music might be today! By playing to the lowest common denominator with DSOTM Floyd set back musical progress by twenty years, IMO.
    This all sounds vaguely familiar - have we had this line of thought before?

    Any album that starts with heartbeats, screaming and voices saying "I've been mad for fucking years", and goes on to sing songs about ageing, death and madness, is hardly playing to the lowest common denominator.

  5. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Good advice, and pretty much my rule. Oh, parts of WYWH are pretty good, and truth be told I enjoyed most of DSOTM when it first came out. But it was (and continues to be...) wayyyy overplayed on the radio!!!

    Which is why I wish it had never come out. If Floyd had continued down the path they were blazing on Meddle, Saucerful, Pompeii, Massed Gadgets and The Man and the Journey, just think where they'd be today! Think where popular music might be today! By playing to the lowest common denominator with DSOTM Floyd set back musical progress by twenty years, IMO.
    You have Roger to thank for that.. With that said I've read / heard Gilmour say when they had finished DSOTM he realized they had something "pretty special" even going on to say "the best thing we've done".. Personally I can find love for DSOTM as well as WYWH..without beating a dead horse.. When Waters thrust himself to the forefront with his overbearing lyrics / themes etc.. that's where they lost me.. I cut my teeth on the Saucer / More / Ummagumma /AHM / Meddle era thus those albums will always remain top shelf for me..

  6. #31
    Member Since: 3/27/2002 MYSTERIOUS TRAVELLER's Avatar
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    you guys are silly

    the Psych jams of the pre-Meddle years were cool BUT

    why would you trash the masterpieces that are DSOTM and WYWH?!
    Why is it whenever someone mentions an artist that was clearly progressive (yet not the Symph weenie definition of Prog) do certain people feel compelled to snort "thats not Prog" like a whiny 5th grader?

  7. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Halmyre View Post
    Any album that starts with heartbeats, screaming and voices saying "I've been mad for fucking years", and goes on to sing songs about ageing, death and madness, is hardly playing to the lowest common denominator.
    +1. What I find amazing in DSOTM is the fact that it is ambitious, dark and yet quite accessible in a good way. A kind of perfect balance between artistic ambition and wide commercial appeal. I guess that this commercial aspect doesn't have a good reputation among prog lovers, but I can't blame the album for being successful and being played on radio. It has a strong identity that goes way beyond the "well produced, well written clean album" reputation.

  8. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Skullhead View Post
    No Waters, no Floyd.

    I'm sure he was difficult to work with, and a total control freak, but he brought an edge to the band that was needed to keep the listener fully invested.
    Post Waters sounds like David Gilmore solo albums. Good albums, but it's not really Pink Floyd is it?

    The PF concerts I saw with just Gilmore felt like a solo artist who just hired everyone to go on tour for a huge show. I mean how many people were on stage?
    The music got bigger than their ability to pull it off. It was just entertainment.

    Live, they were best when it was just the four of them on stage getting it on with the great chemistry they had.
    Go away.
    "The White Zone is for loading and unloading only. If you got to load or unload go to the White Zone!"

  9. #34
    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halmyre View Post
    This all sounds vaguely familiar - have we had this line of thought before?
    Yes, I'm a curmugeon, I admit it. DSOTM became IMMENSELY popular, even among fans who didn't know PF from The Rolling Stones or CTA. It consists of "songs about ageing, death and madness" and it includes "heartbeats, screaming, and voices" as you say -- but at the heart of it, it still "consists of songs" which was a somewhat of a return to their Barrett-era pop-band roots. What they were trying with "Echoes" and "Saucerful" and all the others I mentioned were definitively not POP SONGS.

    DSOTM is a masterpiece of combining pop songs with funny noises and sound effects, but it's still at the heart of it an accessible album of pop songs.

  10. #35
    I opened this expecting another 8 CD box set announcement.

  11. #36
    Member chalkpie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Yes, I'm a curmugeon, I admit it. DSOTM became IMMENSELY popular, even among fans who didn't know PF from The Rolling Stones or CTA. It consists of "songs about ageing, death and madness" and it includes "heartbeats, screaming, and voices" as you say -- but at the heart of it, it still "consists of songs" which was a somewhat of a return to their Barrett-era pop-band roots. What they were trying with "Echoes" and "Saucerful" and all the others I mentioned were definitively not POP SONGS.

    DSOTM is a masterpiece of combining pop songs with funny noises and sound effects, but it's still at the heart of it an accessible album of pop songs.
    Fat Old Sun?

  12. #37
    That's Mr. to you, Sir!! Trane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Triscuits View Post
    This is where the real Pink Floyd starts for me. The psych-pop Syd Barrett band and the Waters-dominated AOR phase are fine, but this in-between era is where all the magic happened.
    AOR??

    Quote Originally Posted by ronmac View Post
    Album-oriented rock
    Yeah, maybe that way

    Quote Originally Posted by Paulrus View Post
    IMO this song and "Careful with that Axe, Eugene" are what gave PF the lifeline to survive in the immediate post-Syd period. To me they are the band's thumbprint in the 1968-1970 era. Not to mention providing inspiration to hundreds of bands since.
    Let There Be More light, Embryo and Cymbalene as well, until AHM... and even until Meddle for the first two



    Quote Originally Posted by MYSTERIOUS TRAVELLER View Post
    you guys are silly

    the Psych jams of the pre-Meddle years were cool BUT

    why would you trash the masterpieces that are DSOTM and WYWH?!
    well; this IS PE, after all

    Yeah, it's cool for some to diss anything post Piper and for others, anything after Meddle.
    my music collection increased tenfolds when I switched from drug-addicts to complete nutcases.

  13. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Halmyre View Post
    This all sounds vaguely familiar - have we had this line of thought before?

    Any album that starts with heartbeats, screaming and voices saying "I've been mad for fucking years", and goes on to sing songs about ageing, death and madness, is hardly playing to the lowest common denominator.
    Exactly. Just because a few songs (notably Money) got a lot of radio play is no reason to wish the album was never made. It's an iconic masterpiece and there are valid reasons it stayed on the album charts for 20+ years. For once a prog album hit that rare intersection of high level art combined with widespread acclaim. It raised the common denominator instead of pandering to the lowest. I think it's because it was so popular that some people want to be the rebels and naysayers and diss it.

  14. #39
    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DocProgger View Post
    It raised the common denominator instead of pandering to the lowest. I think it's because it was so popular that some people want to be the rebels and naysayers and diss it.
    I'd agree to that.

  15. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Yes, I'm a curmugeon, I admit it.

    DSOTM is a masterpiece of combining pop songs with funny noises and sound effects, but it's still at the heart of it an accessible album of pop songs.
    Kind of like those sell out bastards known as The Beatles, right? Sgt Pepper my arse!

  16. #41
    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Beatles never went through a period of writing non-hummable art music. With SPLHCB they CLIMBED UP to being progressive, to being innovative.

    With DSOTM Floyd climbed down to mass appeal, in my opinion. Feel free to disagree with me -- I'm a curmugeon.

  17. #42
    Highly Evolved Orangutan JKL2000's Avatar
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    For your listening enjoyment (why the pig? Not sure!). This is the Rainbow Theatre show from before the album was recorded.:


  18. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by DocProgger View Post
    Exactly. Just because a few songs (notably Money) got a lot of radio play is no reason to wish the album was never made. It's an iconic masterpiece and there are valid reasons it stayed on the album charts for 20+ years. For once a prog album hit that rare intersection of high level art combined with widespread acclaim. It raised the common denominator instead of pandering to the lowest. I think it's because it was so popular that some people want to be the rebels and naysayers and diss it.
    +1
    "The White Zone is for loading and unloading only. If you got to load or unload go to the White Zone!"

  19. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by DocProgger
    Exactly. Just because a few songs (notably Money) got a lot of radio play is no reason to wish the album was never made. It's an iconic masterpiece and there are valid reasons it stayed on the album charts for 20+ years. For once a prog album hit that rare intersection of high level art combined with widespread acclaim. It raised the common denominator instead of pandering to the lowest. I think it's because it was so popular that some people want to be the rebels and naysayers and diss it.
    Quote Originally Posted by ronmac View Post
    +1
    One would think that with the release of DSotM and WYWH Floyd reached their highest level of artistic expression. Nothing against their previous releases, but there is a level of consistent brilliance on these albums that simply isn't present on earlier albums. Meddle is a favorite of mine, but for every "One of These Days" or "Echoes" there is a "San Tropez" and "Seamus".
    "And your little sister's immaculate virginity wings away on the bony shoulders of a young horse named George who stole surreptitiously into her geography revision."

    Occasional musical musings on https://darkelffile.blogspot.com/

  20. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Beatles never went through a period of writing non-hummable art music. With SPLHCB they CLIMBED UP to being progressive, to being innovative.

    With DSOTM Floyd climbed down to mass appeal, in my opinion. Feel free to disagree with me -- I'm a curmugeon.
    Well I would argue that the Beatles started doing "progressive" or artsy stuff with Rubber Soul and Revolver, and with Sgt Pepper put together a full blown "art rock" masterpiece that was revolutionary yet simultaneously still appealed to the masses because the songs were so good. In that sense, in many ways, DSOTM was the true progressive rock followup masterpiece to Sgt Pepper(taking that linked and theme idea to another level).
    Last edited by DocProgger; 01-30-2018 at 12:54 PM.

  21. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by The Dark Elf View Post
    One would think that with the release of DSotM and WYWH Floyd reached their highest level of artistic expression. Nothing against their previous releases, but there is a level of consistent brilliance on these albums that simply isn't present on earlier albums. Meddle is a favorite of mine, but for every "One of These Days" or "Echoes" there is a "San Tropez" and "Seamus".
    "Meddle" is also my favorite. (My favorite period is 1969-71.) But, I do consider WYWH their only perfect album from beginning to end. Even DSOTM has one filler track, IMO. That being "Any Colour You Like," as great as it is.

    Quote Originally Posted by DocProgger View Post
    Well I would argue that the Beatles started doing "progressive" or artsy stuff with Rubber Soul and Revolver, and with Sgt Pepper put together a full blown "art rock" masterpiece that was revolutionary yet simultaneously still appealed to the masses because the songs were so good. In that sense, in many ways, DSOTM was the true progressive rock followup masterpiece to Sgt Pepper(taking that linked and theme idea to another level).
    Well, DSOTM has been called the "Sgt. Pepper" of the 70s.
    "The White Zone is for loading and unloading only. If you got to load or unload go to the White Zone!"

  22. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by ronmac View Post
    "Meddle" is also my favorite. (My favorite period is 1969-71.) But, I do consider WYWH their only perfect album from beginning to end. Even DSOTM has one filler track, IMO. That being "Any Colour You Like," as great as it is.



    Well, DSOTM has been called the "Sgt. Pepper" of the 70s.
    Yep, I love Meddle because Echoes is so mind blowing, but I probably pull out and listen to WYWH most often. Dark Side feels complete after you finish listening. WYWH is so good that I always yearn for it to go on longer.

  23. #48
    Member chalkpie's Avatar
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    I've come to the conclusion that I can't peg down a fav album with these cats. Same with Tull. But I will say that The Wall and The Final Cut are my least favs, but I still dig The Wall for the most part. I loved the Floyd binge I did back in '17.
    If it isn't Krautrock, it's krap.

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  24. #49
    Member Casey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DocProgger View Post
    Exactly. Just because a few songs (notably Money) got a lot of radio play is no reason to wish the album was never made. It's an iconic masterpiece and there are valid reasons it stayed on the album charts for 20+ years. For once a prog album hit that rare intersection of high level art combined with widespread acclaim. It raised the common denominator instead of pandering to the lowest. I think it's because it was so popular that some people want to be the rebels and naysayers and diss it.
    Oh, and don't forget the free posters and stickers!

    I truly enjoy a smattering of songs from each album. My first was "Set the controls...", but I first heard it live. On Ummagumma. After DSOTM came out I was in college and began collecting bootlegs. All of the long, reverb-laden, slow to crescendo then decrescendo then cresendo/decrescendo again I still enjoy listening to. DSOTM I consider one song. WYWH and Animals are two great albums but, once again, I fell in love with the original versions of the major songs: Raving and Drooling, You gotta be crazy, and Shine on... Long and "interstellar"!
    I've got a bike you can ride it if you like

  25. #50
    Proud Member since 2/2002 UnderAGlassMoon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skullhead View Post
    No Waters, no Floyd.

    I'm sure he was difficult to work with, and a total control freak, but he brought an edge to the band that was needed to keep the listener fully invested.
    Post Waters sounds like David Gilmore solo albums. Good albums, but it's not really Pink Floyd is it?

    The PF concerts I saw with just Gilmore felt like a solo artist who just hired everyone to go on tour for a huge show. I mean how many people were on stage?
    The music got bigger than their ability to pull it off. It was just entertainment.

    Live, they were best when it was just the four of them on stage getting it on with the great chemistry they had.
    You must not be a "True Pink Floyd fan" then. How could a true fan in their right mind ever go to a Pink Floyd concert that didn't involve Roger Waters?

    Shame on you, true Pink Floyd fans shun you! You are not allowed to listen to or comment about Pink Floyd anymore.
    Eric: "What the hell Hutch, it's all Rush, what if we wanted a little variety?"

    Hutch: "Rush is variety, Bitch! Rule number one: in my van, its Rush! All Rush, all the time...no exceptions."

    From "Fanboys" 2009.

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