Do you think things have gotten worse in the world

[spellbound]

Things overall are much, much worse for me and my family now than at any time in my 60+ years. These are very dark times brought upon us (those of us not born millionaires or billionaires) by very stupid and avaricious people. I educated myself through college and graduate school, worked smart and hard with integrity for years, and have nothing to show for it. I fear it will be worse for my child. I hope I'm wrong about that, but nothing I see now makes me hopeful. I leave you with the facts; to discuss this further would be to risk making political comments.

[yamishogun]

Things are far worse since the end of the Cold War. The Middle East is more unstable than ever.

1962 - 1970 Yemen Civil War 100,000 casualties
1979 Iranian Revolution 30,000 casualties
1980 - 1988 Iran-Iraq War 1,000,000 casualties (Nothing post 1990 beats this one)

The Kremlin is making a comeback (albeit with a tiny military, but huge influence).

Influence the same since 1990.

The US populace is woefully ignorant of the matters of the country and world.

They weren't aware in 1977, either, but many boomers could tell you every detail of Star Wars.

The environment is becoming more and more precarious as we cling to old fuel technologies.

The environment in industrial countries has gotten better every year sincce 1970. In China, it started to improve in 2000 with even cleaner air and water from 2014.

The gap between the wealthy and poor is growing while the middle class is shrinking.

This has been true in the US but not for the past 10 years. China's middle class is now huge where it didn't exist 30 years ago

[Buddhabreath]

The environment in industrial countries has gotten better every year sincce 1970. In China, it started to improve in 2000 with even cleaner air and water from 2014.

Not true in China and India at least - and that's over a third of the world population.

[yamishogun]

I'm not surprised that no one has mentioned abject global poverty since those surveyed in the US and the UK had no idea of the trend either:

In 1980, 40% of the world was in extreme poverty but now it is just over 10%. This is huge but almost never reported.

[yamishogun]

Both cleaner since 2000. The World Bank said in 2005 that that was a fact very few have understood.

[Buddhabreath]

^^^
I'm not so sure about that, but I'm open to changing my impression if you can provide the information.

"Ambient air pollution kills about 3 million people annually and is affecting all regions of the world, although Western Pacific and South East Asia are the most affected. About 90% of people breathe air that does not comply with the WHO Air Quality Guidelines.

More epidemiological studies of the long-term effects of exposure to air pollution in low-income settings, where air pollution reaches unacceptable levels, are urgently needed to better inform the exposure-response relationships. Additional evidence on health outcomes currently not assessed in the analysis, because of lack of knowledge, is also crucial."

- WHO Report 2016

http://apps.who.int/iris/bitstream/1...511353-eng.pdf

[ronmac]

1962 - 1970 Yemen Civil War 100,000 casualties
1979 Iranian Revolution 30,000 casualties
1980 - 1988 Iran-Iraq War 1,000,000 casualties (Nothing post 1990 beats this one)

I'm referring to global instability, not focusing on on specific regions.

[ronmac]

The whole world is a shit house.

[Rune Blackwings]

dunno about anyone else....been an awesome year for me

[yamishogun]

I'm referring to global instability, not focusing on on specific regions.

My reply was to what you wrote: "The Middle East is more unstable than ever."

[Yodelgoat]

Physics has taught me something truly amazing that I have trouble getting my head around - on an almost daily basis: The past still exists and future already exists. We just have either driven by it or havent gotten there yet. I hope one day to be able to get off whatever it is holding us to "now" and cruise around on my own, You may think that's nuts, but it's not. it's Einstein. When people argue about things as they are, I realize that I have no idea how things "really are". Once I get off the "Now train" and take a look around, I'll get a better feel for how things really are.

From my perspective, a photon leaving the surface of the sun, takes 9 minutes to reach me here on earth, but to the Photon, the trip is instantaneous. Which perspective is the correct one? I have my suspicion that it's not mine. Just like asking everyone else if the Earth is a better or worse place is entirely subjective. I only have my own observations, and those I subject myself to to base my opinion on. Just like music is subjective, so is happiness. What does it matter if everyone is cold, if I am the only one roasting? Do I have to bundle up more because everyone else is cold? Weird.

I write and listen to my own music. No one else hears it. from my perspective its damn fine stuff. Nobody else really matters.

[Dave (in MA)]

The whole world is a shit house.

The world is built like a brick shit house.

[Yodelgoat]

^^^ not true. The world exists only because the cosmological constant is set to 10 to the minus 120. If it were 10 to the minus 121 or minus 119, there would be no stars. The world sits on a knife edge finer than any other imaginable. Doesn't mean you have to panic, its not your knife.

OK maybe -121 and -119 would be OK, but you get the idea...

[yamishogun]

^^^
I'm not so sure about that, but I'm open to changing my impression if you can provide the information.

"Ambient air pollution kills about 3 million people annually and is affecting all regions of the world, although Western Pacific and South East Asia are the most affected. About 90% of people breathe air that does not comply with the WHO Air Quality Guidelines.

This says nothing about reductions in China and India.

I can't find the World Bank quote from 2005 that says China and India started reducing pollution from 2000 but there is a graph of three Chinese cities and Japan that shows emissions up to 2009: "The East is grey"

SO2 emissions

Japan: 1965 peak at 150 to 1985 at 25 (now at under 10)

Chongnqing: 1995 at 300 to 50 in 2009 (6 fold reduction)
Beijing: 1995 at 100 to 40 in 2009
Shanghai: 1995 at 60 to 40 in 2009

Another graph in "Sapiens" shows an average of 31 regional Chinese capitols' pollution emisssions:

PM10: 2001 was 120 and declined to 100 in 2008
SO2: 2001 was 60 and declined to 50 in 2008
NO2: 2001 to 2008 no change at 40

So after that above, I found a compehensive graph. Scroll down to the first comment:

https://www.thebeijinger.com/blog/20...year-6-percent

[yamishogun]

Just like asking everyone else if the Earth is a better or worse place is entirely subjective.

Except there is nearly universal agreement that 15% of people living in extreme poverty is better than 90% of people living in extreme poverty as they did in 1800.

Just like music is subjective, so is happiness.

You should read physicist David Deustch's essay "Why are flowers beautiful" where he argues some music is objectively better than others.

Here is his one hour talk with the same title:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gT7DFCF1Fn8

[Yodelgoat]

Here is his one hour talk with the same title:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gT7DFCF1Fn8

Thanks, when I get some time I will watch it. You can disagree (not even sure you are) without being disagreeable.

[Buddhabreath]

Thanks Yamishogun, I'm certainly no expert and this is a complicated issue. I may be mistaken regarding China since 2000 and you've given me food for thought, however I remain skeptical. I'm not sure of the veracity of information coming from Beijing’s Environmental Protection Bureau and the article quotes a 52 year old Beijing civil servant saying "When might we feel the real improvement, instead of the data?". Not entirely convincing.

You are correct that the WHO report does not provide trending data but it did conclude that we don't have good information on much of this and that further study is needed and is in fact "critical". Secondly the findings you reference are concerned with a class of particulate matter (PM) pollution which is only part of the picture.

[nycsteve]

Absolutally worse with more worseness on the horizon. Not withstanding the political crisis(es) of the moment which come and go, theres just to many of us. Everything , from global warming, to political instability is at its core caused or worsened by overpopulation. To many takers of to few slices of the pie. It will only get worse and we continue to f*ck with no thought to the consquences.

[Yodelgoat]

^^^ As a father of seven, who's children have all grown up to be tax paying, hard working, law abiding citizens, I have to defend myself by observing that I think its not the quantity, but the quality of humans the world is producing that is the problem.

[chalkpie]

The whole world is a shit house.

Shithouse or shithole?

[yamishogun]

Thanks Yamishogun, I'm certainly no expert and this is a complicated issue. I may be mistaken regarding China since 2000 and you've given me food for thought, however I remain skeptical. I'm not sure of the veracity of information coming from Beijing’s Environmental Protection Bureau and the article quotes a 52 year old Beijing civil servant saying "When might we feel the real improvement, instead of the data?". Not entirely convincing.

You are correct that the WHO report does not provide trending data but it did conclude that we don't have good information on much of this and that further study is needed and is in fact "critical". Secondly the findings you reference are concerned with a class of particulate matter (PM) pollution which is only part of the picture.

The government data looks like what I've seen from American sources that usually cover 2008 to 2016. I listed PM10, SO2 and NO2 - that is three, not just PM10. I just read that the U.S. embassy in China started recording PM2.5 where particle size under 2.5 microns is considered to be especially dangerous. The Chinese government called the readings illegal (hilarious!) but the embassy continued to record and release the information via tweets like in 2010 with the air being "crazy bad."

PM2.5 Chinese Cities 2011 - 2016

Beijing 100 to 75 down 25%
Chengdu 83 to 75 down 10%
Shanghai 70 to 50 down 30%
Guangzhou 75 to 35 down 40%

Scroll down to "How are other cities doing?" Particle Counting blog
http://particlecounting.tumblr.com/page/2

Wired
https://www.wired.com/2015/03/opinio...ted-clear-air/

[DocProgger]

Nobody else really matters.

And that pretty much sums it up. And we wonder why the world is a "nasty shithouse" in many ways. Greed, selfishness, "the gimme mine" mentality, now reflected in stark reality at the 'top' at 1600 Penn. We wonder why tigers and polar bears etc are about to go extinct outside of captivity. We wonder why the top 2% of this country control 90% of the wealth. We wonder why there are millions and millions in the world are living in Middle Ages level poverty. Too many people just "listening to their own music."
Couldn't have said it better myself.

[chalkpie]

I think the world (as in life itself) is beyond horrible for many, fine for some, and amazing for others. There are so many factors at play that it's impossible to even discuss something on this level. One's overall mindset and surroundings have a profound affect on how people view the world.

For me - as long as my loved ones (and I guess myself) are healthy and have some semblance of happiness, life is as good as it gets. Trying to enjoy life without letting daily stress rule your mind and psyche is a great challenge we all face, and it's not easy sometimes to overcome it.

Music is the one constant in life that gives me joy beyond (almost) all other things, and I am so lucky to have the gift of music play such a major role in my daily routine (I teach music for a living). But travelling is also such a profound experience, and I personally feel it is SO important to get out and experience other cultures, countries, food, music, nature, people, art, etc etc as much as possible. This summer my family went on an absolutely amazing 16-day vacation to Europe, and there was a moment when we were hiking in the Swiss Alps that I felt life was more beautiful than I could ever imagine it could ever be - a true moment of total bliss - and having my family share the experience was the icing on the cake.

Cardiacs also make me SO happy - I just love that music more than I can convey. I can have the absolute worst shit day imaginable, and throwing on "Big Ship" or "Odd Even" puts me in a happy place very quickly. Canterbury and Sibelius/Mahler also have the same affect on me.

I hate the politics in my country at the moment, but I refuse to let that B.S run my life. Religion also has absolutely no role in my life - I don't use it, or feel the need for it, and I am personally perfectly content with this decision. I don't really have any answers for the big questions of existence, but I try to do the best given the set of circumstances surrounding me.

What does all this mean? I really have no fuckin idea, but I guess overall I feel pretty damn lucky since things could be a LOT worse, and I am no way shape or form an optimist by any stretch.

[yamishogun]

But isn't everyone at least happy knowing that they will only live another 25 to 30 years or less?

[chalkpie]

Bull-fucking-shit.

The OP asks your OPINION about things that can be QUANTITATIVELY MEASURED and thus one's opinion can be backed up by FACTS. FACTS are not political.

.

Really dude? Is that really an appropriate response to Mozo? Would you talk like that to his face? WTF? Seriously? This response is uncalled for and doesn't shine a very positive light on you. Is this how you respond to people in real life? If so, stay the fuck away from me, thank you very much.