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Thread: YES - Topographic Drama released November 24

  1. #226
    Quote Originally Posted by Rajaz View Post
    Time for some free listening! Enjoy the whole albums folks, no CD, Vinyl or portability but this is free loader format:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwnViEHcyOw
    Maybe we could not post links to pirated rips of albums. Use a licensed streaming service or buy the CD.

    Henry
    Where Are They Now? Yes news: http://www.bondegezou.co.uk/wh_now.htm
    Blogdegezou, the accompanying blog: http://bondegezou.blogspot.com/

  2. #227
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    Quote Originally Posted by bondegezou View Post
    Maybe we could not post links to pirated rips of albums. Use a licensed streaming service or buy the CD.

    Henry
    Agreed.

    I've listened to the album on Spotify. I think it is pretty enjoyable, but it pales compared to the raw energy of the performances in the "Word is Live" boxset, for example. Apples and oranges, perhaps.

  3. #228
    Quote Originally Posted by bondegezou View Post
    Maybe we could not post links to pirated rips of albums. Use a licensed streaming service or buy the CD.

    Henry
    I can agree for the audio quality issues, but for the payment is OK. Youtube ID Content system pay all to the owners.

  4. #229
    Highly Evolved Orangutan JKL2000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bondegezou View Post
    Maybe we could not post links to pirated rips of albums. Use a licensed streaming service or buy the CD.

    Henry
    <Devil's Advocate mode ON>

    Larry Page, the CEO of Alphabet Inc., should do something about that.

    <Devil's Advocate mode OFF>

  5. #230
    Highly Evolved Orangutan JKL2000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bruno Sampaio Barbosa View Post
    I can agree for the audio quality issues, but for the payment is OK. Youtube ID Content system pay all to the owners.

  6. #231
    Besides the Drama set, I'm also really impressed with the Topographic set. It's a nice fresh perspective and has renewed my respect for Downes and Sherwood.

  7. #232
    Quote Originally Posted by bondegezou View Post
    Maybe we could not post links to pirated rips of albums. Use a licensed streaming service or buy the CD.

    Henry
    I'm with ya, Henry!

    And YouTube does not pay all artists if folks upload the music....and even if they do, we are back to the discussion about how streaming services are making it very hard for artists to recoup their investment in making an album, let alone actually make money.

    But, avoiding that touchy subject, a question, Rajax: did you upload it and know this is legit? Who is "southsideofthesky" (the uploader), and how do you know money flows from this particular stream to the artist and label?

    Edit: I just looked up YouTube's Content ID System. This is how it's described:

    Copyright owners can use a system called Content ID to easily identify and manage their content on YouTube.

    Videos uploaded to YouTube are scanned against a database of files that have been submitted to us by content owners. Copyright owners get to decide what happens when content in a video on YouTube matches a work they own. When this happens, the video gets a Content ID claim.
    So, this only works if content owners have submitted files. If they have not, it doesn't stop anyone from uploading entire albums for pirated listening.

    Unless you know for certain that Yes has done this, you cannot assume they are participating in this service.

    Sorry, but this looks to me like YouTube's way of skating. Hey, if the content owners don't submit their files to us, we can't be responsible for people uploading unauthorized copies of their work.

    That smells about as fishy as fishy can smell to me.
    Last edited by jkelman; 11-30-2017 at 10:08 PM.
    John Kelman
    Senior Contributor, All About Jazz since 2004
    Freelance writer/photographer

  8. #233
    Moreover, who would want to listen to music using YouTube? Legality issues aside, the audio quality is really not good for that sort of thing.

  9. #234
    Quote Originally Posted by aith01 View Post
    Moreover, who would want to listen to music using YouTube? Legality issues aside, the audio quality is really not good for that sort of thing.
    I don't think Henry gets the bigger picture as the music industry monopoly (techincally, an oligopoly) is in flames at last. Copywrite laws are a complete joke, so good riddance, but I still buy music.

    I listened to around 30 minutes of this on youtube before it was posted here because there were different opinions about the quality of sound , but it tipped me to ordering it a couple of days ago.

  10. #235
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    Quote Originally Posted by aith01 View Post
    Moreover, who would want to listen to music using YouTube? Legality issues aside, the audio quality is really not good for that sort of thing.
    The quality of YouTube audio can be very good, it depends what gear you're listening on. I have come to think of YouTube as the new 'radio'. Remember in in the old days when radio never (and still doesn't) play our kind of music? Well now you can hear everything before you buy it. I use YouTube and Spotify to seek out new music, then if I like it, I buy it. Of course many people listen but don't buy which is why the music industry is struggling.

  11. #236
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve983 View Post
    The quality of YouTube audio can be very good, it depends what gear you're listening on. I have come to think of YouTube as the new 'radio'. Remember in in the old days when radio never (and still doesn't) play our kind of music? Well now you can hear everything before you buy it. I use YouTube and Spotify to seek out new music, then if I like it, I buy it. Of course many people listen but don't buy which is why the music industry is struggling.
    Same here.. can't tell you how many times I've read about an band or artist here on PE and my next step is to search it out on Amazon then check out the tunes on Youtube prior to making the decision to buy.

  12. #237
    Quote Originally Posted by yamishogun View Post
    I don't think Henry gets the bigger picture as the music industry monopoly (techincally, an oligopoly) is in flames at last. Copywrite laws are a complete joke, so good riddance, but I still buy music.
    If someone said, "but I still buy groceries", that would look ridiculous. Of course you buy groceries: how else would you get them? But music has got to a place where it is notable if you pay for it! If?!

    Revenue from recorded music is massively down, which means less recorded music is released. That looks like a bad thing to me. Maybe we could change our culture to somewhere where it's the default that you buy music: it's not something you need to say.

    Henry
    Where Are They Now? Yes news: http://www.bondegezou.co.uk/wh_now.htm
    Blogdegezou, the accompanying blog: http://bondegezou.blogspot.com/

  13. #238
    Even in the advent of more affordable recording equipment, it still is quite expensive and time consuming to record an album. Mixing, mastering, artwork, graphics, manufacturing, etc. and a myriad other costs.
    It used to be artists got screwed by Record Labels and Management. Now the fan can screw the artist directly ;-)

  14. #239
    All-night hippo at diner Tom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bondegezou View Post
    Revenue from recorded music is massively down
    I agree this is almost surely true. But I haven't seen it well quantified.

    Here is a source I cannot verify suggesting a trough around 2010, followed by a slight increase:
    https://www.statista.com/statistics/...ide-by-source/

    Of course, this is a too-optimistic picture from the producing musician's POV, since the revenue in established markets (US, Europe, Japan) is probably still decreasing, and the increased revenue is in markets (China, India, Africa) which he cannot reach well, and which bring new competitors as well as new consumers.
    ... “there’s a million ways to learn” (which there are, by the way), but ironically, there’s a million things to eat, I’m just not sure I want to eat them all. -- Jeff Berlin

  15. #240
    Quote Originally Posted by bondegezou View Post
    If someone said, "but I still buy groceries", that would look ridiculous. Of course you buy groceries: how else would you get them? But music has got to a place where it is notable if you pay for it! If?!
    Yeah. But it's not just a generation-based trauma, but one concerning style and thus social habitus in listening culture. Some specific audiences of listeners still primarily define themselves as 'buyers', depedning on the extent of adherence. One of few reasons why certain "prog" artists can continue releasing the odd title, for instance, is the fact that many a fan still actually craves the whole product itself. The same goes for several other genres like 60s jazz, hardcore punk, 50s r&r and (much) extreme metal.

    I suspect it isn't simply down to merely 'physical ownership' but to the concept of listening as act and process. As such, if there's an oblivious rarity available only as a feature on YT, I'd personally be grateful for the opportunity to investigate before purchasing an expensive item.
    "Improvisation is not an excuse for musical laziness" - Fred Frith
    "[...] things that we never dreamed of doing in Crimson or in any band that I've been in," - Tony Levin speaking of SGM

  16. #241
    Quote Originally Posted by bondegezou View Post

    Revenue from recorded music is massively down,

    Henry

    "Second year of growth after recording 40% decline over previous 15 years, with streaming hailed as revitalising sector"


    https://www.theguardian.com/business...venues-of-15bn

  17. #242
    Quote Originally Posted by jkelman View Post
    I'm with ya, Henry!

    And YouTube does not pay all artists if folks upload the music....and even if they do, we are back to the discussion about how streaming services are making it very hard for artists to recoup their investment in making an album, let alone actually make money.

    But, avoiding that touchy subject, a question, Rajax: did you upload it and know this is legit? Who is "southsideofthesky" (the uploader), and how do you know money flows from this particular stream to the artist and label?

    Edit: I just looked up YouTube's Content ID System. This is how it's described:



    So, this only works if content owners have submitted files. If they have not, it doesn't stop anyone from uploading entire albums for pirated listening.

    Unless you know for certain that Yes has done this, you cannot assume they are participating in this service.

    Sorry, but this looks to me like YouTube's way of skating. Hey, if the content owners don't submit their files to us, we can't be responsible for people uploading unauthorized copies of their work.

    That smells about as fishy as fishy can smell to me.

    Do you believe that big companies don't uses ID Content and don't make money on Youtube? Sure, they make and the Yes catalog is included, indeed.


  18. #243
    Highly Evolved Orangutan JKL2000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bondegezou View Post
    Revenue from recorded music is massively down, which means less recorded music is released.
    Don't you hear frequently though that there's more music to choose from than ever? Isn't it more correct to say that revenue from recorded music for which revenue is reported is massively down?

  19. #244
    Highly Evolved Orangutan JKL2000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bruno Sampaio Barbosa View Post
    Do you believe that big companies don't uses ID Content and don't make money on Youtube? Sure, they make and the Yes catalog is included, indeed.

    ^Are you saying the above example is because someone simply posted a link to the full album on Progressive Ears? It wasn't embedded on PE, only the link to YouTube was posted. Or was this generated with someone embedding one track that had been submitted to YouTube by the artist/management, which is totally different?

  20. #245
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    Bruno and anyone else with knowledge of these practices,
    Am I interpreting this correctly? Joe Schmoe uploads a new Yes album without any permission from or agreement from anyone. YouTube identifies the album using their software (easy to do these days) and pays an agreed-upon royalty (probably a standard industry rate) to the record label, when people watch it. Correct?

  21. #246
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    Just wanted to say I bought the Topographic Drama set and really enjoy it.

    I've not caught any of the line ups in concert since Jon Anderson left so my only connection to any recent iterations is strictly through the live and studio releases. Is this my favorite Yes lineup? Not by a longshot but I still find enjoyment in the treatment these pieces have been given by this group of guys.

  22. #247
    Quote Originally Posted by arturs View Post
    Bruno and anyone else with knowledge of these practices,
    Am I interpreting this correctly? Joe Schmoe uploads a new Yes album without any permission from or agreement from anyone. YouTube identifies the album using their software (easy to do these days) and pays an agreed-upon royalty (probably a standard industry rate) to the record label, when people watch it. Correct?
    Exactly.

  23. #248
    Jazzbo manqué Mister Triscuits's Avatar
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    ^ Except that this leaves out the source of the payments, which is revenue from ads that YouTube slaps on the video. It's not like YouTube itself is doling out royalties.

  24. #249
    There is no such thing as a free lunch

  25. #250
    Highly Evolved Orangutan JKL2000's Avatar
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    If Yes has only uploaded a couple of individual songs from the album (or even all the songs individually), then someone uploads the entire album in one unbroken track, does YouTube's system detect this as being the album those songs are from?

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