FEATURED ALBUM: 5uu's - Hunger's Teeth

[Phlakaton]

from their 2nd Euro-tour, iirc [the 1st tour had Mark Smoot and Sanjay Kumar, again, iirc]

I watch these videos pretty often actually. Sound is decent enough and watching Dave is always a huge treat... like Chris Cutler in a small way. A visual thing I need sometimes.

[Scrotum Scissor]

definitely an argument for how much more progressive Yes could have actually been. IMHO.

But then again, Dimuzio/Drake/Kerman/Kumar were still relatively young back in '94-97 and updated on most developments in then-current rock; no wonder they were able to advance beyond earlier glories of much older bands whose members had apparently more or less ceased to navigate contemporary standards and conditions of recent evolution. The gusto, ambitions, attack and creative aspirations of the common guy around his 50s can hardly be expected to outdo that of one 15-20 years below. Besides, fellas like Kerman/Drake aren't exactly ordinary in their musical mentality; I mean, they still keep making stuff which is as tense and sparkling as that from 20 years ago.

[battema]

The gusto, ambitions, attack and creative aspirations of the common guy around his 50s can hardly be expected to outdo that of one 15-20 years below.

Scott Walker would like to have a word

Jesting aside, I do get your point

[bjoneill74]

Absolutely love this album...and now I know what's up next on the iPod when what I'm currently listening to (audience recording of Ephemeral Sun's set at ProgDay) ends.

Who/Where did it come from? I'm collecting audio and video to try and tie the best bits together.
Thanks!

[Poisoned Youth]

“Under the radar”?

It's just a relative expression, and didn't think it would spark a debate. Go figure.

[battema]

Who/Where did it come from? I'm collecting audio and video to try and tie the best bits together.
Thanks!

I'll send you the link shortly

[Scrotum Scissor]

Scott Walker would like to have a word

Ah, but although ol' Scott has truly made some of the most transcending music of modern 'rock', he never ever created anything even remotely as profoundly disturbing as the following:

(Remember that, John - and earn that memory.)

[battema]

Only one way to deal with this




(not actually me)
(I have slightly more hair)

[Zappathustra]

It's just a relative expression, and didn't think it would spark a debate. Go figure.

It's not like they achieved mass recognition, right? Being labeled as avant or prog doesn't help, right? Whereas bands like Tortoise or Gastr del Sol, demanding music as well, were getting press coverage and "normal" people knew them and listened to them and bought their records. But they were post-rock (whatever that means), not proggers or avant-weirdos, right?

[bill g]

Great musicianship and composition, and genuine innovation, what's not to love?

[Scrotum Scissor]

Amigos,
What would be my next step with their discography?

I'd get Regarding Purgatories from 2000 - IF it's even available/obtainable still. While it's a post-Drake and almost Kerman solo release and as such quite different from the previous two albums, it's also tremendously powerful and intricate - and, again, genuinely innovative. It's also much darker in tone, though. "To Fall On Deaf Ears" must be heard to be believed in that respect, featuring some of the most insane drumming this side of Maksymenko.

From the early stuff, the 5UU's paired with the Motor Totemist Guild for Elements back in '88, and while U Totem highlighted Grigsby's compositional approach, Elements displays the Kerman side of things with some ace melodic yet very peculiar writing and playing. It used to be available on a twofer with the debut (Ble Marduk & Tiamat) and an EP, but I dunno the status there. Presumably it's OOP either way.

[Zappathustra]

This is shockingly original, contemporary, beautiful. All these unexplored possibilities...

I am haunted by rickobacker bass of Chickenshite. And the violin in the middle...there's unanimous praise in this thread and yet it's still too little.

[Scrotum Scissor]

there's unanimous praise in this thread and yet it's still too little.

Well, in the crowd I knew around the time this came out (mid-90s), the music buffs weren't squarely "prog" or "punk" or "metal" or "reggae" or what may - they were interested in certain inherent virtues and qualities as token to vitality. As such, they had interests all over the place, but I managed to turn many of them on to 60s psychedelia, more radical 70s progressive and 80s art/post-punk. They'd laugh or chuckle at a modern-day vocalist dressed in flowermask and toting a Gabriel routine, just like they would at an upstart donning mohawk and acting angrily on stage while "Pretty Vacant" was playing backwards.

But stuff like 5UU's grabbed them immediately. It wasn't the apparent eccentricity or the "contrarian" nature itself which convinced them, it was the sheer force of being confronted by something fresh, new and different which still spoke their language - albeit in a somewhat foreign tongue. It's always about originality, personality and innovation - as well as craftsmanship.

[Phlakaton]

I'd get Regarding Purgatories from 2000 - IF it's even available/obtainable still. While it's a post-Drake and almost Kerman solo release and as such quite different from the previous two albums, it's also tremendously powerful and intricate - and, again, genuinely innovative. It's also much darker in tone, though. "To Fall On Deaf Ears" must be heard to be believed in that respect, featuring some of the most insane drumming this side of Maksymenko.

From the early stuff, the 5UU's paired with the Motor Totemist Guild for Elements back in '88, and while U Totem highlighted Grigsby's compositional approach, Elements displays the Kerman side of things with some ace melodic yet very peculiar writing and playing. It used to be available on a twofer with the debut (Ble Marduk & Tiamat) and an EP, but I dunno the status there. Presumably it's OOP either way.

Those Kerman's 5uus albums are so sick... loaded to the gills with so much great dark material. Another reason Dave is in my top 3 drummers ever - his compositions are amazing too.

[bill g]

Well, in the crowd I knew around the time this came out (mid-90s), the music buffs weren't squarely "prog" or "punk" or "metal" or "reggae" or what may - they were interested in certain inherent virtues and qualities as token to vitality. As such, they had interests all over the place, but I managed to turn many of them on to 60s psychedelia, more radical 70s progressive and 80s art/post-punk. They'd laugh or chuckle at a modern-day vocalist dressed in flowermask and toting a Gabriel routine, just like they would at an upstart donning mohawk and acting angrily on stage while "Pretty Vacant" was playing backwards.

But stuff like 5UU's grabbed them immediately. It wasn't the apparent eccentricity or the "contrarian" nature itself which convinced them, it was the sheer force of being confronted by something fresh, new and different which still spoke their language - albeit in a somewhat foreign tongue. It's always about originality, personality and innovation - as well as craftsmanship.

[Zappathustra]

Those Kerman's 5uus albums are so sick... loaded to the gills with so much great dark material. Another reason Dave is in my top 3 drummers ever - his compositions are amazing too.

I am not getting darkness from Hungry Teeth. Quiet the opposite actually. Which also goes to their credit. Darkness is a lot easier of a material to handle, and these avant-rock bands, especially the ones from Europe, seem to be obsessed with it. As pointed by others 5uu's remain accessible, melodic and even funny all throughout it. For example the banjo intro or the a capella track. I could be mistaken of course, I am new to this.

[TCC]

I'd get Regarding Purgatories from 2000 - IF it's even available/obtainable still. While it's a post-Drake and almost Kerman solo release and as such quite different from the previous two albums, it's also tremendously powerful and intricate - and, again, genuinely innovative. It's also much darker in tone, though. "To Fall On Deaf Ears" must be heard to be believed in that respect, featuring some of the most insane drumming this side of Maksymenko.

From the early stuff, the 5UU's paired with the Motor Totemist Guild for Elements back in '88, and while U Totem highlighted Grigsby's compositional approach, Elements displays the Kerman side of things with some ace melodic yet very peculiar writing and playing. It used to be available on a twofer with the debut (Ble Marduk & Tiamat) and an EP, but I dunno the status there. Presumably it's OOP either way.

Thanks SS!.

Well, Cuneiform (bandcamp) has:

- Regarding Purgatories.
https://cuneiformrecords.bandcamp.co...ng-purgatories

- Elements.
https://cuneiformrecords.bandcamp.co...point-of-views

- Abandonship.
https://cuneiformrecords.bandcamp.com/album/abandonship

Also, searching at Wayside for their music, these names/titles came up, any words about them:

- NIMBY - Songs For Adults.
- Hay, Emily/Brad Dutz/Wayne Peet - Hay/Dutz/Peet .
- Bob Drake - Little Black Train.


Thanks in advance my friends!.

[arturs]

I bought Hunger's Teeth somewhere around the turn of the new millennium. Probably read good things about it on the Wayside site... And, yeah, it's great. I still listen a lot, partly because it is great, and partly because the band name starts with a numeral. It is the 2nd band entry both on my iPod and on Windows music player. It's always there staring me in the face when I boot up. So I often think WTF! and let it rip.

[chalkpie]

Hungers Teeth, Daddy

[Sputnik]

I'll get lambasted for saying this, but I owned all the 5UUs albums and after trying for ages to dig them, I just gave up. Oddly, Hunger's Teeth, which seemed to get among the best reviews, was my least favorite of the bunch, my favorite being Crisis in Clay, which is the only one I occasionally regret letting go. I actually remember listening to Hunger's Teeth one time and feeling very disturbed and annoyed. I shut the music off, and a sense of great relief washed over me. That was the day I put all my 5UUs albums on sale.

I thought this was the next logical step after getting into Thinking Plague, but I just find this band too dense, and for me there's just not enough to get my head around to really enjoy. And some of it I guess I just find annoying. I remember liking Crisis in Clay better than the others, but I couldn't sing you a single note from that album, or any of the others. It's like a wash for me.

I'm certainly happy others find enjoyment here, I definitely respect the effort that went into these. It's just beyond my grasp and over some inner threshold I have of musical annoyance. No offense intended to any fans, just sharing my experience. I really did try.

Bill

[Zeuhlmate]

^^^
Funny, since I find Crisis in Clay the most dense of them all.
None of them are singable or hummable for ordinary people.

[chalkpie]

I'll get lambasted for saying this, but I owned all the 5UUs albums and after trying for ages to dig them, I just gave up. Oddly, Hunger's Teeth, which seemed to get among the best reviews, was my least favorite of the bunch, my favorite being Crisis in Clay, which is the only one I occasionally regret letting go. I actually remember listening to Hunger's Teeth one time and feeling very disturbed and annoyed. I shut the music off, and a sense of great relief washed over me. That was the day I put all my 5UUs albums on sale.

I thought this was the next logical step after getting into Thinking Plague, but I just find this band too dense, and for me there's just not enough to get my head around to really enjoy. And some of it I guess I just find annoying. I remember liking Crisis in Clay better than the others, but I couldn't sing you a single note from that album, or any of the others. It's like a wash for me.

I'm certainly happy others find enjoyment here, I definitely respect the effort that went into these. It's just beyond my grasp and over some inner threshold I have of musical annoyance. No offense intended to any fans, just sharing my experience. I really did try.

Bill

It's dense, ugly (at times), jarring, really really complex, contains advanced harmonies and melodies that are firmly embedded in 20th century composition, and does not compromise one single inch in their unique artistic vision. For me, that is the true definition of progressive music. But I can see that this music isn't for everybody, even amongst prog fans, but somehow I wouldn't think Dave, Bob, etc would mind very much because it seems to me that they created this music for their own enjoyment, and if there are others that share in that joy, then great. If not, no big deal. I personally think everything Bob Drake is/was involved in is worth my time (and Kermanator too for that matter), so I enjoy a spin of this every full eclipse or so. I wouldn't stress too much man, there is plenty of other music out there to enjoy if this stuff doesn't speak to you.

[Sputnik]

^^^
Funny, since I find Crisis in Clay the most dense of them all.
None of them are singable or hummable for ordinary people.

Well, it's nice to be "ordinary."

I always go back to the metaphor of "modern" visual art (I use "the term "modern" loosely, because much modern art is now getting be close to 100+ years old). I'm intrigued by this stuff, and usually visit modern art museums when I'm in various cities. I've come to the conclusion that for me, and I think for a lot of viewers, modern visual art is more interesting for its ideas than its actual visual appearance. I get far more out of modern art museums when there are good explanations of the artist's intent and that put the works into context, because frankly, looking at a lot of that stuff is not intrinsically pleasing, or particularly intersting. I guess it may be to some people, but I wouldn't want much of it hanging in my home. I know the artists are often fervently driven to do stuff that is "bold" and "new" and "original." But there's a point where even the reasonably well educated and open-minded viewer starts to lose their bearings, and their interest.

But then there's the exception to that rule, and I see something that I do respond to intrinsically, and sometimes my sense even matches what they say in the audio guide! That's what keeps me going back, because some of it does still "connect," and that is worth it, though I'm still not sure I'd want it hanging in my home. I know the out there, fringe stuff is important and keeps things alive for a lot of artists who draw inspiration from it. But I think I think it's a gift when an artist can be innovate and new, but still connect with a decent number of "ordinaries," like me.

I think that holds true with music as well, and while one can appreciate something like 5UUs for their "uncompromising vision" (and believe me, I do), there a lots of artists, who often draw from similar influences in different and often equally uncompromising ways, who connect with a broader audience. I think there's some lesson in that, but I'm not quite sure what it is.

It's dense, ugly (at times), jarring, really really complex, contains advanced harmonies and melodies that are firmly embedded in 20th century composition, and does not compromise one single inch in their unique artistic vision. For me, that is the true definition of progressive music. But I can see that this music isn't for everybody, even amongst prog fans, but somehow I wouldn't think Dave, Bob, etc would mind very much because it seems to me that they created this music for their own enjoyment, and if there are others that share in that joy, then great. If not, no big deal. I personally think everything Bob Drake is/was involved in is worth my time (and Kermanator too for that matter), so I enjoy a spin of this every full eclipse or so. I wouldn't stress too much man, there is plenty of other music out there to enjoy if this stuff doesn't speak to you.

Yeah, I basically agree. I don't think they had any illusions about this stuff being a "big seller" or what not. They followed their uncompromising vision and did what they wanted to do, and whoever was on board for that ride, great. Kudos to them for that.

I hear what you're saying about not compromising on the artistic vision being definitive of progressive music, and I think there's a lot of truth to that. But related to what I said above, I would just add that there are different artistic visions toward which an artist can be uncompromising, and that not all progressive music necessarily needs to sound dense and jarring, or be complex 20th century composition-influenced stuff. I'm sure that's not what you meant, but I think sometimes here that impression is created (perhaps unintentionally) when avant-Prog stuff is held up as some kind of bellwether of being "progressive," and what both artists and fans of should somehow be "striving for."

Bill

[chalkpie]

^ No Bill, I didn't mean to imply anything "jarring" or crazy is the only thing progressive, although they certainly can be!

[Scrotum Scissor]

^ Bill, your position on this is reasonable. The U-Think-Totem axis is not for everyone.











[But we'll never ever speak again, Bill. Not after this. How could you?]