Tell me what you know about In The Cage

[Finch Platte]

Awesome. Thanks for the stories, guys. Keep 'em coming!

[Trane]

If you accept that the story is about a trip, in the cage is where he drops the acid "I've got sunshine in my stomach". Later "It" confirms "It is purple haze" "if you ear right through it you'll see everything alive"
There's a lot of duality and puns throughout of course
If you accept that Rael is his brother John, and the cage is his corpeal self he trapped within... Listen to the words in this context and see if you agree

My interpretation was always that Rael dies during the first song, and the reste of the album is his journey through the after life, perhaps some form of pergatory. He redeems himself by attempting to save Brother John, and it's only when he sees his own face when he pulls the body from the water that he realizes that he's died.
I never understood what Phil meant when he said it was "about a split personality", until I realized if he was using the phrase correctly (which most layman don't), he may have meant that the entire story is a delusion, and Rael may be a psych ward patient, or perhaps a "crazy homeless person", wandering the streets of NYC.
And I've also heard it interpreted as a dream.

mmmhh!!!... it's probably all three: dream, schizo and search/save the bro

Same with its distant cousin, Subterrania, another album I learned to listen to without regard to storyline.

I can't believe they got away with that cloning/plagiarism either.

The first disc of The Lamb is stellar but the second, well I'll let you make your mind up? It's mostly filler IMO and IT is probably the worst 'finale' song of any concept album I've heard. And don't try to make sense of the story as Banks et al are still trying to figure that one out!

The storyline and lyrics was entirely Gabe's
I'm not sure about "mostly filler", coz the two of the best songs of the album are on it... But yeah, there are some filler duds on the second disc

As for The Lamb album, it's not even remotely weak, except that it ends with a wimper. Not good when the only bad song on a 94-minute album is the closing track. Otherwise, it's absolutely amazing for the first 89 minutes, without a weak moment.

I changed your fanboy username, coz you gotta listen to the whole second disc: plenty of weak stuff, though I'll agree that It is their weakest on that album... it's freaking annoying too.

[SteveSly]

As others have mentioned you really need to hear it in context with the rest of The Lamb album for it to make sense, since it is part of the overall story. I also agree that the “Three Sides Live” version is outstanding. It was also one of the highlights of the last re-union tour.

[arabicadabra]

This.

Some good lyrical assessments in this thread of the song and the Lamb. The Lamb is a great album of course, but I admit I was a little disappointed when it first came out, being so strongly into 'Selling England'. Always felt there was too much vocals and not enough scenic instrumental music, such as in Firth of Fifth and The Cinema Show. But then it grew on me and I loved it for what it was, although tracks like 'Counting Out Time' and 'The Grand Parade...' I never found particularly strong. But 'In The Cage' was good. And the three songs in a row on side 3, 'Anyway' thru 'The Lamia' (my favorite song on the album) I always found brilliant. I kinda had to get thru the first 2 sides to get to the proggier sides 3 and 4. But I will always prefer 'Selling England', which is just more my thing.

[Trane]

Disc 1
1. The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway >> relatively weak, IMHO
2. Fly on a Windshield >> Awesome stuff
3. Broadway Melody of 1974 >> see my remark on the next post
4. Cuckoo Cocoon >> indispensible in the storyline, but not musically
5. In the Cage >> great stuff
6. The Grand Parade of Lifeless Packaging >> best track on the first disc

7. Back in N.Y.C. >> good stuff but second tier
8. Hairless Heart >> I could do without this one, but I don't dislike it
9. Counting Out Time >> really funny and that endears it to me
10. The Carpet Crawlers >> awesome stuff
11. The Chamber of 32 Doors >> awesome stuff

Disc 2
1. Lillywhite Lilith >> weak start to second disc
2. The Waiting Room >> awesome stuff
3. Anyway >> not bad but, neeeeext please
4. The Supernatural Anaesthetist >> yawn
5. The Lamia >> awesome stuff
6. Silent Sorrow in Empty Boats >> booooringest stuff evah... exists only to allow The Gabe to exit that weird Lamia suit

7. Colony of Slippermen >> Awesome stuff
8. Ravine >> yawn
9. The Light Dies Down on Broadway >> I like it better than the first song of the album, but maybe because I rarely heard it
10. Riding the Scree >> Yawn >> I don't care at all at this time in the album's running
11. In the Rapids >> yawn
12. It. >> worst song on album >> Annoying

the bolded tracks would've made the best Gensis album evah...

[Conti]

^^^Well, it *is* for me the best Genesis album, so to each its own.

[Trane]

One Q:

in the Windshield/Broadway thingie, where does everyone think Windshield ends and Broadway starts?

Personally, I always thought Windshield stopped at the word Freeway, and the awesome instrumental passage is part of Broadway Melody. The reason why I thought that, was that I definitely remember the spacing between tracks on my Canadian pressing being at that precise point (the singing of "Freeway" at 1:17), but the German pressing and most of the CDs I have seen seem to point differently,as would the CD versions... They/many seem to say that BM would start at "Echoes of"

However most of the track timing available found on the web would show different timings.
PA being the worst offender showing BM at 0:33...
I even have a CD (picture disc inside those small boxsets) that doesn't increment until Cuckoo Cocoon comes in, making that track the third one of the album...

Does it matter much??
Of coursenot, but this is PE, aster all !!

[Vic333]

One Q:

in the Windshield/Broadway thingie, where does everyone think Windshield ends and Broadway starts?

Personally, I always thought Windshield stopped at the word Freeway, and the awesome instrumental passage is part of Broadway Melody. The reason why I thought that, was that I definitely remember the spacing between tracks on my Canadian pressing being at that precise point (the singing of "Freeway" at 1:17), but the German pressing and most of the CDs I have seen seem to point differently,as would the CD versions... They/many seem to say that BM would start at "Echoes of"

However most of the track timing available found on the web would show different timings.
PA being the worst offender showing BM at 0:33...
I even have a CD (picture disc inside those small boxsets) that doesn't increment until Cuckoo Cocoon comes in, making that track the third one of the album...

Does it matter much??
Of course not, but this is PE, aster all !!

Mistakes were made ... in the track timings, that is.
The newest master has the correct timing
Broadway Melody begins with the lyrics "Echoes of the Broadway everglades"

If I recall, the first CD issues of Three Sides Live also had issues with correct track timing between One From the Vine and Fountain.

[Prog Lives]

One Q:

in the Windshield/Broadway thingie, where does everyone think Windshield ends and Broadway starts?

I think the first emphatic instrumental strike that ends he soft section is supposed to represent the fly hitting the windshield ending the song

[JJ88]

One Q:

in the Windshield/Broadway thingie, where does everyone think Windshield ends and Broadway starts?

The 90s Genesis CDs were very poorly indexed, all three of their doubles had problems! 'Broadway Melody Of 1974' begins with 'Echoes of...' as that's what the lyric sheet says. It's there in black and white for all to see. Why this has been so hard to understand I have no idea, as it's a plain fact.

https://www.discogs.com/Genesis-The-...y/master/29256

Whoever did the indexing on the old CDs decided that it began with that short instrumental coda before 'Cuckoo Cocoon'- this is totally wrong. Does it matter if you are playing it right through (as I always do), no, but it's still wrong!

There has been an undercurrent of 'that'll do' with Genesis' CD masterings, IMHO. I feel strongly that they should do their original mixes justice, with proper indexing and sensitive transfers.

[Prog Lives]

Disc 1
1. The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway >> relatively weak, IMHO -

This is one of my favorites because it introduced me to the cross hand piano technique
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2npgwo31uSM

Speaking about the album in its entirety, Some of the musical interludes were for costume changes, which can in spots come off like filler

[Prog Lives]

Here is a link to a super fan site that went through in depth analysis of the album

It looks like some of the videos are offline but there are some currently up. Quite interesting for a deep dive

http://www.lileighwhite.com/analysis...ay-series.html

[GuitarGeek]

Speaking about the album in its entirety, Some of the musical interludes were for costume changes, which can in spots come off like filler

Gabriel wore only three costumes for The Lamb... show. He spent most of the performance wearing blue jeans and a leather jacket. For Lamia, they had that large sort of tube thing that came down over him, with him in a green outfit, I think, all lit up with black light. Then of course, there's the infamous Slipperman costume, but then after Colony Of The Slipperman, he changes back into the jeans and leather jacket.

[JKL2000]

Mistakes were made ... in the track timings, that is.
The newest master has the correct timing
Broadway Melody begins with the lyrics "Echoes of the Broadway everglades"

I agree with that.

So Trane, do you like Broadway Melody...?

[Trane]

The 90s Genesis CDs were very poorly indexed, all three of their doubles had problems! 'Broadway Melody Of 1974' begins with 'Echoes of...' as that's what the lyric sheet says. It's there in black and white for all to see. Why this has been so hard to understand I have no idea, as it's a plain fact.!

It's also a plain fact that the very same lyrics sheet says that Fly On The Windshield ends with the word "Freeway"

It's totally up for discussion, because the instrumental passage could be either the end of Fly or the beginning of Broadway.

I agree with that.

So Trane, do you like Broadway Melody...?

Actually, I do, but not on the same level of those I bolded out... It reminds me of Willow Farm in Supper's Ready, but is not nearly as successfull

[JKL2000]

It's also a plain fact that the very same lyrics sheet says that Fly On The Windshield ends with the word "Freeway"

It's totally up for discussion, because the instrumental passage could be either the end of Fly or the beginning of Broadway.



Actually, I do, but not on the same level of those I bolded out... It reminds me of Willow Farm in Supper's Ready, but is not nearly as successfull

I can see how the "list of things" approach to the lyrics might remind you of Willow Farm, but the sort of evil, twisted intent of them and Gabriel's delivery couldn't be much more different.

[JJ88]

It's also a plain fact that the very same lyrics sheet says that Fly On The Windshield ends with the word "Freeway"

It's totally up for discussion, because the instrumental passage could be either the end of Fly or the beginning of Broadway.

You missed this bit which is what I was referring to.

Whoever did the indexing on the old CDs decided that it began with that short instrumental coda before 'Cuckoo Cocoon'- this is totally wrong. Does it matter if you are playing it right through (as I always do), no, but it's still wrong!

[Trane]

You missed this bit which is what I was referring to.

Nope, I didn't miss it, as two wrongs don't make a right

I was just responding to your "plain fact" of the lyrics sheet, which proves nothing at all

[JJ88]

In what way is it 'wrong'? It is a fact that the lyric sheet says that track starts at that point...whether or not you include the instrumental lead-up is up to you but I wouldn't.

For the record Allmusic agrees with me:

http://www.allmusic.com/song/fly-on-...d-mt0012974992

[Halmyre]

Disc 1
1. The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway >> relatively weak, IMHO
2. Fly on a Windshield >> Awesome stuff
3. Broadway Melody of 1974 >> see my remark on the next post
4. Cuckoo Cocoon >> indispensible in the storyline, but not musically
5. In the Cage >> great stuff
6. The Grand Parade of Lifeless Packaging >> best track on the first disc

7. Back in N.Y.C. >> good stuff but second tier
8. Hairless Heart >> I could do without this one, but I don't dislike it
9. Counting Out Time >> really funny and that endears it to me
10. The Carpet Crawlers >> awesome stuff
11. The Chamber of 32 Doors >> awesome stuff

Disc 2
1. Lillywhite Lilith >> weak start to second disc
2. The Waiting Room >> awesome stuff
3. Anyway >> not bad but, neeeeext please
4. The Supernatural Anaesthetist >> yawn
5. The Lamia >> awesome stuff
6. Silent Sorrow in Empty Boats >> booooringest stuff evah... exists only to allow The Gabe to exit that weird Lamia suit

7. Colony of Slippermen >> Awesome stuff
8. Ravine >> yawn
9. The Light Dies Down on Broadway >> I like it better than the first song of the album, but maybe because I rarely heard it
10. Riding the Scree >> Yawn >> I don't care at all at this time in the album's running
11. In the Rapids >> yawn
12. It. >> worst song on album >> Annoying

the bolded tracks would've made the best Gensis album evah...

'Counting Out Time' is WAAAAAY worse than 'It'...

[JKL2000]

The main theme of "It" just makes me think "'The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway' has been a Mark Goodson-Bill Todman production."

[Gladiator1634]

I love Lamb

If you accept that the story is about a trip, in the cage is where he drops the acid "I've got sunshine in my stomach". Later "It" confirms "It is purple haze" "if you ear right through it you'll see everything alive"

There's a lot of duality and puns throughout of course

If you accept that Rael is his brother John, and the cage is his corpeal self he trapped within... Listen to the words in this context and see if you agree

Just my opinion after 200 spins

As far as what "in the cage" is about I'm in agreement with this analysis. It's my favorite album and show and I listened to it incessantly after seeing the show.

As far as the rest of the album I believe some of the songs just come across much better live than on the album. One example is the waiting room which could be altered each night as heard on many of the boot leg recordings. Although I agree the song "it" doesn't come across all that strong on the album it was much more intense live building to an abrupt ending with a jaw dropping pyrotechnic explosion. Bringing the audience to a standing ovation the 2 shows I saw in NY. In the rapids was another song that was amazing live.

I guess my point is that if you saw the show live it may change your feelings about some of the songs. Some might say I saw the band the musical box recreate the experience and although they do an incredible job it's not as good as the rael thing in my opinion.

[GuitarGeek]

re: Fly On The WIndshield/Broadway Melody Of 1974,

I've wondered about where the tracks separate, myself. Personally, I've always thought of Hackett's guitar solo as being part of Fly On The Windshield, but I guess it makes sense that it could be thought of as being part of Broadway Melody Of 1974.

As I said before, for me, Hairless Heart and Supernatural Anaesthetist are two of my favorite tracks on the album, but of course, you would expect someone who calls himself "GuitarGeek" would say that about a couple of tracks that feature Hackett so prominently.

Funny thing was, I have the album on LP, but that's one album I never got on CD. At first it was because it was a double CD, in an era when I rarely had the money to buy double CD's. Then when I did have the money, the "Definitive Edition" version came out, which among other things, fades in the piano cadenza that kicks off the album (it's a cold start on the LP version).

But even in my days of listening to LP's regularly, I somehow just didn't listen to this one very often. Sides one and two, I committed to memory well enough, but most of sides three and four were a bit of a blank to me. Even when I got the ARchive box, it was still the same thing with the live version.

So when I saw The Musical Box perform THe Lamb... the first time (the time they played at the Allen Theater, which is where Genesis actually played in Cleveland, on both The Lamb... tour and I believe also the A Trick Of The Tail tour), they get to Supernatural Anesthetist, and I'm like, "Wait, what the hell is this?! I don't remember there being a really cool guitar solo in the middle of side three".

I don't know why, but at least initially, the second half of the album never made much of an impression on me, apart from the Colony Of The Slippermen synth solo (which I used to call March Of The Slippermen), which I knew from the Mama Tour video. There's a handful of things on there I could sing to you, but most of it was like a big blank for me for a long time.

[yesstiles]

As far as the rest of the album I believe some of the songs just come across much better live than on the album.

Absolutely. The live Spring 1975 European shows were the best Genesis ever got. Amazing stuff, with Hackett taking over and totally on fire.

[JKL2000]

<<I guess my point is that if you saw the show live it may change your feelings about some of the songs.>>

I don't doubt this for a second! I can imagine It having much more power live.