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Thread: King Crimson 2017 U.S.A. tour

  1. #351
    Parrots Ripped My Flesh Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hobo Chang Ba View Post
    I see on setlist.fm one of the Seattle shows had a song called "CatalytiKc No.9". Any details on this?
    Setlist.fm is open source like Wikipedia. It could be that the person who edited that was just making shit up.

  2. #352
    Member Haruspex Carnage's Avatar
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    The mavens on the KC FB page had this to say, "I wasn't [there] that night, but I can confirm the title (CatalytiKc No. 9) was culled from Robert's personal setlist print out."

  3. #353
    Quote Originally Posted by bondegezou View Post
    Given how much attention what is basically a new incarnation of the 21st Century Schizoid Band is getting, I'm saddened how little they got the first time around.

    Henry
    There is no comparison!

    21st Century Schizoid Band was better than this version of KC. They had Ian McDonald and Michael Giles. Also Jakko was allowed to show some personality. I'm a huge KC fan, but the current version is a failure. The band died when Fripp fired Adrian Belew. Fripp's ego is almost as big as his talent.

  4. #354
    Parrots Ripped My Flesh Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
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  5. #355
    Member since March 2004 mozo-pg's Avatar
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  6. #356
    I don't think anyone has a problem with a fan preferring one version of Crimson over another or wishing that Belew could still work with Fripp or even disliking this version of Crim for whatever reason you choose.

    But to claim that Fripp's ego (narcissism might be a better word--we all do things to satisfy our egos) is somehow motivating the artistic direction of the band or that he is controlling how much Jakko is allowed to express himself seems wrong.

    By all accounts, this is the only time in Crimson's history where all band members actually enjoyed being in the band, enjoyed playing with each other, enjoyed being around Fripp. Joy beams from this band. That's the impression I got watching them in Chicago last week. Collins' many thumbs-ups in reaction to fans; Jakko's smile during Fripp's solo in "Lizard"; the playful interaction between the drummers in the "Indiscipline" intro; the whole band marveling during Harrison's solo in "Schizoid Man."

    I could be wrong, but this really feels like a band that enjoys what it is doing, not one that is under Fripp's thumb, bristling and seething.
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  7. #357
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Crimson King View Post
    There is no comparison!

    21st Century Schizoid Band was better than this version of KC. They had Ian McDonald and Michael Giles. Also Jakko was allowed to show some personality. I'm a huge KC fan, but the current version is a failure. The band died when Fripp fired Adrian Belew. Fripp's ego is almost as big as his talent.
    i'd hazard more that YOU died when "Fripp did etc.". Both entities are happy moving forward, are you?

  8. #358
    Quote Originally Posted by Haruspex Carnage View Post
    i'd hazard more that YOU died when "Fripp did etc.". Both entities are happy moving forward, are you?
    I was happy to see Adrian twice on his recent tour. The energy of him and his band blew away Fripp's stuffy old man orchestra.

  9. #359
    Estimated Prophet notallwhowander's Avatar
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    Trolls be trollin'.
    Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world.

  10. #360
    Quote Originally Posted by notallwhowander View Post
    Trolls be trollin'.
    Be careful with your accusations. I'm not a troll. Sorry not everyone shares your "correct" opinion. This version of KC turned off a lot of longtime fans. That's just the way it is.

  11. #361
    Quote Originally Posted by The Crimson King View Post
    Be careful with your accusations. I'm not a troll. Sorry not everyone shares your "correct" opinion. This version of KC turned off a lot of longtime fans. That's just the way it is.
    It turned off some fans. Including myself, as I also happen to be one of those who prefers the previous lineup. But most of us let it go, accepted things, and don't need to hammer the point home at every opportunity. And based on the strength of ticket sales across subsequent tours, the band hasn't seen any sort of mass exodus due to the change.

    I am glad KC exists and is actually operating in something resembling "happy" mode. IMHO that is genuinely wonderful. And I am happy to go back and revisit ElektriK / Power To Believe / Heavy ConstruKction to my heart's content. I've seen Belew since and he seems pretty happy too. So, as the phrase goes...be happy with what you have to be happy with
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  12. #362
    Quote Originally Posted by polmico View Post
    I don't think anyone has a problem with a fan preferring one version of Crimson over another or wishing that Belew could still work with Fripp or even disliking this version of Crim for whatever reason you choose.

    But to claim that Fripp's ego (narcissism might be a better word--we all do things to satisfy our egos) is somehow motivating the artistic direction of the band or that he is controlling how much Jakko is allowed to express himself seems wrong.

    By all accounts, this is the only time in Crimson's history where all band members actually enjoyed being in the band, enjoyed playing with each other, enjoyed being around Fripp. Joy beams from this band. That's the impression I got watching them in Chicago last week. Collins' many thumbs-ups in reaction to fans; Jakko's smile during Fripp's solo in "Lizard"; the playful interaction between the drummers in the "Indiscipline" intro; the whole band marveling during Harrison's solo in "Schizoid Man."

    I could be wrong, but this really feels like a band that enjoys what it is doing, not one that is under Fripp's thumb, bristling and seething.
    +1

    IMHO, Jakko is the MVP in this lineup. His singing was considerably more assured than it was in 2014 (I loved how he made Indiscipline his own), and I really felt his presence in the band.
    "Always ready with the ray of sunshine"

  13. #363
    Estimated Prophet notallwhowander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Crimson King View Post
    Be careful with your accusations. I'm not a troll. Sorry not everyone shares your "correct" opinion. This version of KC turned off a lot of longtime fans. That's just the way it is.
    It's not your opinion at question. It's the way you choose to express yourself, but really, you know this already.
    Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world.

  14. #364
    I'm here for the moosic NogbadTheBad's Avatar
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    The only part of this KC that can be deemed a failure is the lack of new music and the partly valid 'classics tour' criticism. The musicians are clearly enjoying themselves, the gigs are well attended and the performances are good. Personally I found Mel the highlight as I like the saxophone twist they've put on lots of pieces. Others have mentioned Jakko & Gavin so clearly lots of individuals are resonating. Live material that has been released has been very good. The only people who appear to have a problem with the line-up are those who think 3 or drummers is unnecessary (hard to disagree with that) and Belew fans. KC has turned over band members so frequently that its hardly a shock that Belew isn't in this line-up especially as Fripp wanted to revisit a bunch of those early albums where Adrian's voice doesn't really fit. Belew appears to have gotten over it and is happy with what he's doing.

    Everyone is allowed their own opinion, and there's nothing wrong with not liking this direction, but calling it a failure is a bit too much of a stretch.
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  15. #365
    Sad that fracture appears to have fallen out of rotation. Guess it wasn't cutting to whatever standard fripp had.

    The fact that they're doing islands, fallen angel, neurotica, and battle of glass tears though is a solid concession! Pleasant how they've gotten 4 new repertoire songs into consistent nightly playing!

  16. #366
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    Fracture is out of rotation only because RF needs to build up to playing it...that's how TL put it to me in person asking him back-stage.

    This line-up has about 10 pieces that are new...i don't see how this is a nostalgia act; to me this is now a KC big band playing and capable of doing any piece from any era...Jakko has also said they're constantly writing too and it's RF's choice about what to present when to present.

  17. #367
    Quote Originally Posted by Haruspex Carnage View Post

    This line-up has about 10 pieces that are new...i don't see how this is a nostalgia act; to me this is now a KC big band playing and capable of doing any piece from any era...Jakko has also said they're constantly writing too and it's RF's choice about what to present when to present.
    I guess it's just that - by KC standards - the music has an orchestrated feel (the word has been used a bunch of times already in this thread) - which is probably hard to avoid considering how the drum parts have been arranged - which is decidedly at odds with how much of the material that they're playing now has been played live over the years. I realize that you can't just dial up someone as technically proficient and creative as Bill Bruford, but I still do think that one awesome drummer (plus an additional percussionist, if deemed necessary) would be better for this music than how they're doing it now, even if it wouldn't look as pretty on-stage.

    The songs that work the best in this format, IMO, are anything from ITCOTCK and Wake of Poseidon + Letters. The other stuff - especially the Larks Tongues-through-Red material - was more interesting for multiple show attendances when the arrangements were messier and less predictable. IMO.

  18. #368
    Quote Originally Posted by Haruspex Carnage View Post
    Fracture is out of rotation only because RF needs to build up to playing it...that's how TL put it to me in person asking him back-stage.

    This line-up has about 10 pieces that are new...i don't see how this is a nostalgia act; to me this is now a KC big band playing and capable of doing any piece from any era...Jakko has also said they're constantly writing too and it's RF's choice about what to present when to present.
    Bollocks. They have four new pieces; Suitable Grounds, Radical 3, Meltdown and Radical 1 and 2 which are basically the same piece repeated.

  19. #369
    Member AncientChord's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Crimson King View Post
    There is no comparison!

    21st Century Schizoid Band was better than this version of KC. They had Ian McDonald and Michael Giles. Also Jakko was allowed to show some personality. I'm a huge KC fan, but the current version is a failure. The band died when Fripp fired Adrian Belew. Fripp's ego is almost as big as his talent.
    Seriously? I was at the last 21stCSB show in California, and I've seen the current version of KC and the 21st band pales by leaps and bounds IMO. Yes I was thrilled to see McDonald, Peter Giles, Mel, Jakko and Ian Wallace, Mike Giles was already out of the band. Even though Mike Giles is a true pioneer of prog-rock drumming, his chops were not what they were in his youth (the rumor I always heard was his alcoholism). And the absence of Fripp was quite noticeable. And after decades of praying to see the 60's and 70's Crim songs come back to life, it was great. I never appreciated how good the late Ian Wallace was too. However the KC since 2014 is simply amazing. Power, glory and jaw dropping beauty. The essence of KC is back with a vengeance, and I pray it continues for many more years. The Good Fairy has returned!
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  20. #370
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    Quote Originally Posted by popeyebonaparte View Post
    Bollocks. They have four new pieces; Suitable Grounds, Radical 3, Meltdown and Radical 1 and 2 which are basically the same piece repeated.
    You forgot Drumson Werning, Interlude/CatalytiKC No. 9, Hell Hounds of Krim, Devil Dogs of Tessellation Row, Banshee Bell Legs Hassle, Hoodoo, and Seperation...the latter two are works in progress i suppose but whatever...needless to say they're not NOT working...were Radios I & II, and Inner Garden not songs then either by that inevitable next bitch-session's token?

  21. #371
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    Quote Originally Posted by Facelift View Post
    I guess it's just that - by KC standards - the music has an orchestrated feel (the word has been used a bunch of times already in this thread) - which is probably hard to avoid considering how the drum parts have been arranged - which is decidedly at odds with how much of the material that they're playing now has been played live over the years. I realize that you can't just dial up someone as technically proficient and creative as Bill Bruford, but I still do think that one awesome drummer (plus an additional percussionist, if deemed necessary) would be better for this music than how they're doing it now, even if it wouldn't look as pretty on-stage.

    The songs that work the best in this format, IMO, are anything from ITCOTCK and Wake of Poseidon + Letters. The other stuff - especially the Larks Tongues-through-Red material - was more interesting for multiple show attendances when the arrangements were messier and less predictable. IMO.
    i don't agree with the Court stuff, but ITWOP stuff is good...Larks and Red seems tame to me at points. Indiscipline has been fun...i wish there were more of that.

  22. #372
    Quote Originally Posted by Haruspex Carnage View Post
    Fracture is out of rotation only because RF needs to build up to playing it...that's how TL put it to me in person asking him back-stage.

    This line-up has about 10 pieces that are new...i don't see how this is a nostalgia act; to me this is now a KC big band playing and capable of doing any piece from any era...Jakko has also said they're constantly writing too and it's RF's choice about what to present when to present.
    Figured it was such with fracture, fripp blogged last about all the work that goes into being ready to play it and how he has to feel properly amped up and prepared to play it to put it in the set. Suppose there's only been 4 shows this tour where he felt up to it - and that is 100% understandable given how difficult it is to do!

    As for the repertoire, I view it as cool so long as they continue to add old songs they haven't done before, like fallen angel and islands which are back and as long as they just keep adding new songs in, like how this tour added in radical 3, which is way different than radical 1 and 2. They keep slowly adding more new songs at a clip of 1-2 per tour as is.

    So keep on adding new songs and new old songs, just look at how different the set is comparing 2014 to 2017!

  23. #373
    Quote Originally Posted by Haruspex Carnage View Post
    Fracture is out of rotation only because RF needs to build up to playing it...that's how TL put it to me in person asking him back-stage.
    The recorded evidence also demonstrates that Jakko is unable to play the intro properly.

  24. #374
    Where is there a recorded version of this band doing "Fracture"? Thanks

  25. #375
    Highly Evolved Orangutan JKL2000's Avatar
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    We need a KC version of The Musical Box (the tribute band, that is).

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