My thoughts on Robert Fripp

[klothos]

Because I am (im-) patiently waiting on a Chapman Stick to arrive, I decided to delve into some King Crimson……in the past, I have mentioned that I like KC but not a huge fan…My three favorite albums are Starless and Bible Black, Red, and Larks Tongue (of which I enjoy) and I liked Three of a Perfect Pair of their later output…..with my Chapman Stick in transit, I decided to hone in on Levin-era Discipline, Beat, and Three of a Perfect Pair for starters.

Ironically, I started paying less attention to the Stick and started concentrating more on what Fripp was doing……I had always looked at Fripp as kind of a noise-maker guitarist that surrounded himself with superior players to put his ideas across but it was during this last phase of listening to KC that I finally ‘got it’….If a guitar player plays an “E” note, most folks hear it and go “Hmm….a guitar note” and perfect-pitch folks will go “..and sounds like an “E”, but when Fripp hears a note, he is hearing this cacophony of events, like a fractal, that his ear is able to dissect, and that is what he is trying to accomplish in his playing.

For most guitarists, the guitar is merely a vehicle to communicate musical ideas but for Fripp it’s a huge tonal color palette, and he’s trying to paint with all these in-between colors……This discovery made me backtrack through their whole discography, and I realized what I had been missing in listening to his playing in KC now made sense – like a lightbulb going on…..In many ways, its kind of like Miles Davis: if you ‘get it’ its awe-inspiring but if you don’t ‘get it’, its “WTF?”

As a guitar player in the orthodox conventional sense, Fripp is “Meh” but as a guitar player in the unorthodox visionary sense, the guy is a genius....and its nice to listen to these albums, especially the three early 70s albums that I liked the best, with my ears in a different perspective.......Ive always respected Fripp but now that respect has grown immensely

[señormoment]

Yes.
It's the demands of the song at hand that he focuses on. He takes from the pallette whatever is deemed to serve the song best, in conjunction with the other musician's input.
Of all the hats Fripp dons, the guitar is first and foremost.
I'm prob'ly just stating the obvious. But thanks for sharing your thoughts.

[jkelman]

Ironically, I started paying less attention to the Stick and started concentrating more on what Fripp was doing……I had always looked at Fripp as kind of a noise-maker guitarist that surrounded himself with superior players to put his ideas across but it was during this last phase of listening to KC that I finally ‘got it’….

Seriously?

Fripp's playing on the first four albums, but especially Lizard & Islands, is complex harmonically, melodically, rhythmically...a player who clearly worked in the jazz sphere as well as in a rock context, largely simultaneously. That there are such strong elements of free playing on those albums and ItWoP, in particular that album's second side, were what made me realize just how accomplished a guitarist he was...already (heck... check out some of his playing on the Giles, Giles & Fripp album...). His playing on Crimson's debut was terrific too...but he grew in leaps and bounds on the next three albums.

His acoustic playing on "Cirkus," his warmer, clean-toned but at times beautifully oblique phrasing on "Cat Food," his remarkably technique and, at the same time, feel throughout "Sailor's Tale," and his sublime (again, acoustic) work on "Formantera Lady"...all signs of a marvellous player. And his solo over the ostinato on "Prince Rupert's Lament..." i still get goosebumps.

...not just NOT a "noise-maker," surrounding himself with better players than he; but already, in those early years, a distinctive guitarist who eschewed "look at me" pyrotechnics for playing that always served the music (most of which he also wrote, and if you cannot hear the sophistication of Lizard, start to finish, now that you've come around to the dark side (), revisit those early albums. Poseidon is often overlooked because, format-wise, side one resembled ItCotCK, but the three tunes are a development over those earlier songs, while side two points, very clearly, to Lizard - which is the closest Fripp came to a solo album, pre-Exposure.

Not trying to be difficult or disagreeable...but had to point out that, if anything, Fripp was hardly surrounded by "betters"; he was no less capable than most early Crimson members/session contributors - Michael/Peter Giles, Ian McDonald, Andy McCullough, Ian Wallace and, of course, the great Mel Collins (after all, what constitutes "better" anyway?). Greg Lake, Gordon Haskell and Boz Burrell were good singers, to be sure, but not particularly great bassists. And Fripp was unequivocally capable of holding his own beside free jazz guests like Keith Tippett, Marc Charig, etc.

When I heard Fripp in 1969, while as a young aspiring guitarist myself I always hoped for more guitar....I then realized instrumental greatness is often as defined by what you don't play as what you do.

As a guitar player in the orthodox conventional sense, Fripp is “Meh” but as a guitar player in the unorthodox visionary sense, the guy is a genius....and its nice to listen to these albums, especially the three early 70s albums that I liked the best, with my ears in a different perspective.......Ive always respected Fripp but now that respect has grown immensely

Not sure what you mean by conventional, but Fripp has never, to my ears, been "meh," just as he's never been a conventional guitarist, especially in a rock context. But I assure you, most guitarists hope to be visionaries...that said, of course, only a relatively small percentage actually are, and Fripp has been one since his very earliest days, I think.

Anyway, just had to throw in my two cents. Glad you came around, but when I read that first sentence I truly said WTF?

Cheers!
John

[klothos]

snip

its literally been decades since analyzing his playing.......i have a much more developed ear since then and, coupled with keeping KC in an "every so often in the rotation" pile over the years, I voluntarily and involuntarily missed a lot.....hearing it now for the first time again (that could almost be an album title lol)

[jcarr73729]

As a guitar player in the orthodox conventional sense, Fripp is “Meh” but as a guitar player in the unorthodox visionary sense, the guy is a genius....and its nice to listen to these albums, especially the three early 70s albums that I liked the best, with my ears in a different perspective.......Ive always respected Fripp but now that respect has grown immensely

I have a colleague at work who is a big Joe Satriani fan and of blues-based rock guitar music, and he just does not get Robert Fripp's playing style, and Fripp is "meh" to him. I came into KC around the release of 'Red' & 'USA', and I've never looked back these forty-odd years. I'm not a musician of any form, but I've always heard something unique and challenging in his playing and the musicians he chooses to work with. To enjoy Fripp and KC is to open you mind to any and all possibilities. KC had changed line-up and experimented with several forms of music even before I joined the party, and there have been lots of changes and challenges since. Some artists and bands exploit a winning formula and stay on those tracks throughout their career. Fripp, like Miles Davis, saw each day as a personal challenge, looking for new sounds, formats, expressions, etc., and challenged his partners and fans alike. I welcome the challenge.

[notallwhowander]

My entry into King Crimson was the '80s albums. What struck me was how much they sounded like pop, but clearly weren't pop, how the musicians clearly knew where the beat and melodies were, but freely played both in and around them with equal proficiency and effect. The guitar leads still shredded the place up, but didn't follow the well worn paths or chords. It was clearly synergistic with all of the musicians being word class and using their full abilities and creativity. It kind of cracked my head open.

[FrippWire]

I'm not a musician so I can't speak to what Fripp is up to on a technical, musical or structural level but I can say he is my second favorite guitarist right after Frank Zappa. I like him because he has a sound and style that's different from the rest of the pack and unique to him; he comes through when he plays. It's not a bunch of cliché crap. When Fripp plays, you know it's him.

[Scrotum Scissor]

Seriously?

...not just NOT a "noise-maker," surrounding himself with better players than he; but already, in those early years, a distinctive guitarist who eschewed "look at me" pyrotechnics for playing that always served the Music

But for the better or worse, we're on a "prog" board now - where many participants still apparently believe free improv to be an "excuse for laziness" (to quote Fred Frith's irony) and "noise" is portrayed as the negation of "real music" (no matter what Varése may have meant) and Henry Cow's "Amygdala" seemingly was made up as they went along. If "prog" people were to decide, the world of guitarism would never have allowed for a Sharrock or Ulmer or Fahey or Rypdal or Kaiser or Kottke or Cline or O'Rourke or Ribot to reach their rightful status in a million years.

[notallwhowander]

But for the better or worse, we're on a "prog" board now - where many participants still apparently believe free improv to be an "excuse for laziness" (to quote Fred Frith's irony) and "noise" is portrayed as the negation of "real music" (no matter what Varése may have meant) and Henry Cow's "Amygdala" seemingly was made up as they went along. If "prog" people were to decide, the world of guitarism would never have allowed for a Sharrock or Ulmer or Fahey or Rypdal or Kaiser or Kottke or Cline or O'Rourke or Ribot to reach their rightful status in a million years.

We workers do not understand your modern art.

[Scrotum Scissor]

We workers do not understand your modern art.

Tell that to Majakovsky or Tatlin!

[notallwhowander]

Tell that to Majakovsky or Tatlin!

(After a furious Google search to get up to speed...)

Good one comrade!

[JeffCarney]

I had always looked at Fripp as kind of a noise-maker guitarist that surrounded himself with superior players to put his ideas across

Signed,

Nobody Ever

[bill g]

Fripp is a true artist. I've always deeply admired what he accomplishes as a guitarist. And, particularly around Lizard and Islands, as a composer.

[eporter66]

I think what I've always appreciated about Fripp is his constant striving to create a unique voice or listening experience. When you think of all the different phases of KC and his solo work, wow, he has been such a individual. As a guitarist, he really has found a way to stand out amongst the sea of guitarists.

I can't say I'm a fan of everything he's done, but his , soundscapes, the 70's KC, and the first three albums of the 80's with Belew are so innovative. He's a true artist

[klothos]

But for the better or worse, we're on a "prog" board now - where many participants still apparently believe free improv to be an "excuse for laziness" (to quote Fred Frith's irony) and "noise" is portrayed as the negation of "real music" (no matter what Varése may have meant) and Henry Cow's "Amygdala" seemingly was made up as they went along. If "prog" people were to decide, the world of guitarism would never have allowed for a Sharrock or Ulmer or Fahey or Rypdal or Kaiser or Kottke or Cline or O'Rourke or Ribot to reach their rightful status in a million years.

all things being equal, what defines "art" is based on the response of the individual observing it or listening to it, doesn't it?....I could give a rat's ass what a bunch of pompous art critics decree what art is: If it does nothing for me emotionally or otherwise, then it sucks as far as I'm concerned -- highly respected art critics don't pay my bills so I really could care less what their opinion is in labeling art. You can chastise me for not "understanding" a segment of art all day long but don't forget to preclude the possibility that if the individual doesn't have a want or care to understand it then the critic's words mean nothing (No different than the "Greatest of All Time....." Rolling Stone magazine Lists that we collectively chastise here on the forum)......With this said, I (believe) I now "get it" with Fripp -- I (believe) I understand his vision in what he's trying to accomplish texturally...Its given me a whole new way to listen to KC and I have a whole new appreciation for him as an artist......None of this means I think he's a great overall guitarist

Signed,

Nobody Ever

Sarcasm duly noted.....thanks for such an enlightening contribution

[JeffCarney]

Sarcasm duly noted.....thanks for such an enlightening contribution

I could have said that is possibly the most ridiculous thing I've read on this board, but sometimes a little "joke" keeps things light.

Come on, dude. You're ordering a "stick," so presumably know a bit about guitar. You might be able to say what you said about Adrian Belew (I'd disagree but it wouldn't be completely bizarre), but like Fripp or not, his sophistication should be obvious to anybody with even an intermediate level understanding of the instrument. His vibrato technique alone is completely independent of the usual forms of rock guitar and precise as a whip.

I'm trying to even imagine someone listening to "Fracture" and saying; "Huh, interesting "noise" guitarist."

[AncientChord]

Meh? Sorry, but do you really listen to music? IMO Fripp is one of the most unique and gifted artists in all of Rock, not just Prog Rock. His approach to playing is like no one else. If you are the kind of person that thinks lots of fast shredding makes you a good guitarist, you don't get it. As other have said, it's the technique that he inflects into each song that matters. And when he does burst into a fast bit of shredding, it's jaw dropping. He went far beyond the teachings of his first guitar teacher (same teacher that Greg Lake had)prior to King Crimson, and has learned many different ways to perform on the instrument,and some almost unheard of anywhere else guitar tunings. No doubt in my mind a genius musician, and one of the most influential innovators in prog rock..

[Zeuhlmate]

And when you have played the guitar 30 years with the standard tuning try this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_standard_tuning

[Scrotum Scissor]

I could give a rat's ass what a bunch of pompous art critics decree what art is: If it does nothing for me emotionally or otherwise, then it sucks as far as I'm concerned -- highly respected art critics don't pay my bills so I really could care less what their opinion is in labeling art. You can chastise me for not "understanding" a segment of art all day long

I wasn't talking of what "[...] a bunch of pompous art critics" might have decreed about art (although it's certainly telling that you should immediately determine that I did), I was pointing to the general picture of things as far as status and stature in modern music is concerned - and more specifically to the fact that purveyors of the allegedly "thinking man's rock" which is "prog" almost always tend to miss out on it. "Highly respected art critics"? Who the hell mentioned or even insinuated their impact on this picture?

And neither did I "[...] chastise [you] for not 'understanding' a segment of art all day long", I was simply pointing to the fact that you so clearly made a derogatery mark out of alleged "noisemaking" - as if there was some golden standard far above denoting an objective ideal as to how and why such noise was a terrible thing. Because in modern music there isn't - precisely seeing how that hegemony of those very same "art critics" has long since been breached.

[señormoment]

Man, better be careful about what I used to think.

[musicislife]

Meh? Sorry, but do you really listen to music? IMO Fripp is one of the most unique and gifted artists in all of Rock, not just Prog Rock. His approach to playing is like no one else. If you are the kind of person that thinks lots of fast shredding makes you a good guitarist, you don't get it. As other have said, it's the technique that he inflects into each song that matters. And when he does burst into a fast bit of shredding, it's jaw dropping. He went far beyond the teachings of his first guitar teacher (same teacher that Greg Lake had)prior to King Crimson, and has learned many different ways to perform on the instrument,and some almost unheard of anywhere else guitar tunings. No doubt in my mind a genius musician, and one of the most influential innovators in prog rock..

As much as I think the ijits at Rolling Stones don't know anything about music, I am always stunned when Fripp ends up no higher than the 40s or 50s in their top 100 guitarist lists. He's top 5, easily.

[melanieshiffman]

I am not reading all the posts here but like the title. I love Robert Fripp!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

[Mike D]

I've seen Fripp perform 4 times. Once with the '90's double trio, once with the 2000 era quartet, once with ProjeKCt 4 and also on KC's recent North American tour.

Fripp seems most content as a support player. He's probably never looking to wow anyone. His main goal seems to be to contribute to the music by either playing or not playing. He's playing the parts that need to be there.

The ProjeKCt 4 gig was different than the others. It was in a small club and I was right up at the front. If there hadn't been a preview in the local entertainment paper the week before, I wouldn't have known that this was Crimson in a different form and I wouldn't have gone.That line-up was Fripp, Levin, Gunn and Mastelotto.

The latter three provided most of the interaction, with Fripp very much in the support role. The music was mostly improvised. There was one instance where Fripp unleashed a series of mind bending lines. It only happened once during the performance, but when it did, the place erupted. The man can play the guitar.

[JeffCarney]

As much as I think the ijits at Rolling Stones don't know anything about music, I am always stunned when Fripp ends up no higher than the 40s or 50s in their top 100 guitarist lists. He's top 5, easily.

Certainly Top 10 for me.

But, of course, he was never really a "rock star." At least by any stretch of what that has come to mean in the mainstream press. Hence, that he even places in a RS poll probably has to do with just how incredible he is as a guitarist.

[AncientChord]

Certainly Top 10 for me.

But, of course, he was never really a "rock star." At least by any stretch of what that has come to mean in the mainstream press. Hence, that he even places in a RS poll probably has to do with just how incredible he is as a guitarist.

But he was cool enough to play with the "Ladies of the Road!" Eno and Fripp had a reputation for being horn-dogs in their youth..."Here Come the Warm Jets!"