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Thread: Cardiacs--where to start?

  1. #2251
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    ^^

    I also understood „good guy“. JP’s shenanigans remind me of an ex bandmate, who would occasionally lapse into a feigned stutter that could last up to five long minutes (just to say something like “Yeah, thanks mate” or “Really good grass, eh?”).

    @chalkpie:
    Close enough for me to get a good chuckle. Thanks!
    "Dem Glücklichen legt auch der Hahn ein Ei."

  2. #2252
    Is there a type of music you listen to that would surprise your audience?

    [...]

    Level 42, Nik Kershaw, Kajagoogoo, Thompson Twins…the list is endless!

  3. #2253
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    Quote Originally Posted by zombywoof View Post
    You know I have Mr and Mrs and love Cardiacs and Sea Nymphs, and for some reason I've never played it! Same story for Spratleys Japs. I think I bought them and subsequently got distracted by schoolwork.
    Clearly, you need to drop out, drop out! Live the dream, man.
    "Dem Glücklichen legt auch der Hahn ein Ei."

  4. #2254
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterG View Post
    I agree, however if you think Sea Nymphs is sublime wait till you hear Mr & Mrs Smith and Mr Drake.
    An indescribable amalgamation of pastoral chamber music and catchy tunesmithery. Hear it once and it’s stuck in your inner ear for Summer Sunday and a year.
    "Dem Glücklichen legt auch der Hahn ein Ei."

  5. #2255
    Does anybody know why this guy has decided to start reviewing all Cardiacs albums?

    http://only-solitaire.blogspot.com/s...label/Cardiacs

    The tunes do not prove much of anything, except that there's, you know, a reason why people do not usually combine ska, punk, jazz, and classical influences within the same track — just as there's a reason why you rarely put meat, fruit, vegetables, and chocolate in the same dish. It's curious and instructive to take a taste, but eventually you'll probably just have to accept that some things don't click too well when forcefully synthesized.

  6. #2256
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sterbus View Post
    Does anybody know why this guy has decided to start reviewing all Cardiacs albums?
    His assessment of Little House is much more positive, though.
    "Dem Glücklichen legt auch der Hahn ein Ei."

  7. #2257
    Quote Originally Posted by at least 100 dead View Post
    His assessment of Little House is much more positive, though.
    But it's a C after four D's... I don't think he's a fan... Unless he fell in love after Heaven Born and Ever Bright... Or maybe he just likes Sing to God?

  8. #2258
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sterbus View Post
    Or maybe he just likes Sing to God?
    That wouldn’t be a crime. As much as I love Cradiacs, it never upsets me when someone doesn’t get them, just surprised and a bit worried about the naysayer’s faculties.
    "Dem Glücklichen legt auch der Hahn ein Ei."

  9. #2259
    Quote Originally Posted by at least 100 dead View Post
    That wouldn’t be a crime. As much as I love Cradiacs, it never upsets me when someone doesn’t get them, just surprised and a bit worried about the naysayer’s faculties.
    I know that would'nt be a crime... If I meet a person and we talk about Cardiacs and then he tell me that Sing to God is it's favorite I can understand that... I just find strange to start a blog, and review a Cardiacs record a week starting from the very first one, and everyone is bad. I like to read good reviews of good albums, and then listen to that album, and feel unriched by that. What's the use of a bad review? Prevent someone to listen to an album you don't like?

  10. #2260
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    Who cares what he thinks? Its negative, and he comes off as arrogant and condescending. This music deserves respect whether you love it or not. He can have himself a squat on the cosmic utensil. There - that's my review of him.

  11. #2261
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    " Big Shipʼ, sounds like a cross between classic Queen and some big, brawny arena rock band with a penchant for stomping power chords. Loud, martial guitars, organ a-plenty, vocals that get in your face with a vengeance, and plenty of stops, starts, and tempo changes in between the oratorio-like choruses to ensure that this is Inventive Art. Unfortunately, the song itself just isn't very good: the bombastic sections are too simple and repetitive, relying on huge*ness of sound rather than a classy chord sequence. I wish I could get inspired by it, but neither the lyrics nor the melody lend themselves to coherent interpretation."

    This is one of the most majestic tunes these ears have ever had the pleasure of listening to, and he just dismisses it like...that....

  12. #2262
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    ^^

    Well, I understand where GS is coming from. “Big Ship” leaves me kind of cold too. Songs for Ships & Iron is problematic in general, IMO. It’s an in-between effort, but I’m not sure that’s even the issue. Put this way: Somehow everything tries to sound huge, but it often rings hollow, cold and distant. To me it’s the one album they made that lacks soul. Not that there aren’t any standouts: "Too Many Irons" and "Blind in Safety" are fucking amazing and Loosefish is a masterpiece (the live version, on S4S&I it’s too clinical). I prefer all other Cardiacs albums, except maybe Archive.

    *traitor dons hazmat*
    "Dem Glücklichen legt auch der Hahn ein Ei."

  13. #2263
    Despite being critical , at least he has an understanding of aspects of the music and the context in which it functions. I don't agree with a number of things he says, especially the shallowness, but it'll be interesting to see what he has to say about On the Land and In the Sea and beyond. Certainly a fairer listen than that other guy, Derek or whatever...
    He is aware that people find this work fascinating and engaging, and he has an understanding of why, which does not appear to be disparaging or condescending.

    Like many detractors of this band, he seems to be stuck in a notion of what is/is not "proper". One of the most exhilarating aspects of Cardiacs music to me, is that proper is not even taken into consideration. It's almost like it doesn't exist.

  14. #2264
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    I lost him when he is talking about "Big Ship" and says its lacking a so-called 'classy chord sequence'. That chord sequence during the chorus is CLASSIC Tim, downright beautiful, and inspires me to no end. Goosebump inducing. The 'A minor to D maj' is a simple cadence, but its what Tim does A LOT in his music, and maybe this guy needs to understand a bit more about these little ideas in music before he just blows them off. I blast this tune so loud in my car my tinnitus has tinnitus. I could only imagine how "uninspiring" playing this tune live must be in front of an entire room bouncing up and down and singing along. "The song itself isn't very good". Sorry, go duck off and write about music you actually like. Quack.

  15. #2265
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    Quote Originally Posted by arthurfrayn View Post
    Despite being critical , at least he has an understanding of aspects of the music
    I disagree.

  16. #2266
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    I'll say one more thing before I get off my soapbox and come off as an arrogant prick like this reviewer:

    Tim's music should be celebrated rather than publicly scrutinized and ripped apart by some so-called "music expert", whose own creations I have yet to hear. This music doesn't pretend to be perfect by any stretch, and while that definition doesn't exist anyway, you are hard-pressed to find a catalog of music that is as virtually unknown by the general public that is as unique, creative, beautiful, crazy, virtuosic, inspiring, etc etc as Tim's. Do I go around starting a thread on Gong trying to look hip and erudite by dismissing the quirkiness of the music, which undoubtedly is one of the aspects that makes it so amazing? Why spend all of this energy in a negative connotation, possibly turning off thousands of potential fans so you can get a "Right on BRO!" in the comments section? I don't personally know Tim, don't know how thick his skin, is, but I wouldn't want him to read this guys ramblings and dismissals of his entire life's blood, sweat, and tears. The beauty of this thread is we celebrate the music, hopefully turn on and inspire potential listeners, and have intelligent discussions on the music even if we don't agree 100% of the time. It seems to me the impetus of this guy is the complete opposite, and I am not interested.

    I'm now finished with this subject (hopefully).

  17. #2267
    All I'm saying is I can handle, someone not liking it because at least he listened -even though I definitely don't agree with his assessments. As opposed "ah dunno" and then mockouts. People seemed to be more tolerant of that -not sure why.

  18. #2268
    Quote Originally Posted by chalkpie View Post
    Tim's music should be celebrated rather than publicly scrutinized and ripped apart by some so-called "music expert", whose own creations I have yet to hear. This music doesn't pretend to be perfect by any stretch, and while that definition doesn't exist anyway, you are hard-pressed to find a catalog of music that is as virtually unknown by the general public that is as unique, creative, beautiful, crazy, virtuosic, inspiring, etc etc as Tim's. Do I go around starting a thread on Gong trying to look hip and erudite by dismissing the quirkiness of the music, which undoubtedly is one of the aspects that makes it so amazing? Why spend all of this energy in a negative connotation, possibly turning off thousands of potential fans so you can get a "Right on BRO!" in the comments section? I don't personally know Tim, don't know how thick his skin, is, but I wouldn't want him to read this guys ramblings and dismissals of his entire life's blood, sweat, and tears. The beauty of this thread is we celebrate the music, hopefully turn on and inspire potential listeners, and have intelligent discussions on the music even if we don't agree 100% of the time. It seems to me the impetus of this guy is the complete opposite, and I am not interested.
    This should be cut and pasted on the comment section of that blog...

  19. #2269
    Quote Originally Posted by arthurfrayn View Post
    Like many detractors of this band, he seems to be stuck in a notion of what is/is not "proper
    Yes, that's exactly what I found wrong. It's just like a wrestling commentator who dislikes tennis cause there's not enough body fight.

  20. #2270
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    Quote Originally Posted by arthurfrayn View Post
    Like many detractors of this band, he seems to be stuck in a notion of what is/is not "proper". One of the most exhilarating aspects of Cardiacs music to me, is that proper is not even taken into consideration. It's almost like it doesn't exist.
    QFT.

    Anyway, Cardiacs have weathered reviews far worse than the one mentioned above. Do bad reviews even have an effect? Sure, but in Cardiland everything’s upside down: The worse the reviews got, they better they became. Maybe the slandering scribes unwittingly spurred them on.

    The Seaside review was far more disappointing, IMO. The Sea’s such a коктейль Молотова of despair and ecstasy. If you can’t be thrilled by hearing a band of overachieving loonies really go for it in today’s marketplace, are you even alive? He didn't even mention that The Seaside’s original title was “Jim’s NOT going to fix it, ever.”

    But, yeah: Celebrate TS’s music. Celebrate life. Hope day’s forever coming near, or something.
    Last edited by at least 100 dead; 03-17-2016 at 02:52 PM.

  21. #2271
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    There’s always room for you in the mare’s nest. Everything turns out fine and cakey.

    "Dem Glücklichen legt auch der Hahn ein Ei."

  22. #2272
    Quote Originally Posted by chalkpie View Post
    I'll say one more thing before I get off my soapbox and come off as an arrogant prick like this reviewer:

    Tim's music should be celebrated rather than publicly scrutinized and ripped apart by some so-called "music expert", whose own creations I have yet to hear. This music doesn't pretend to be perfect by any stretch, and while that definition doesn't exist anyway, you are hard-pressed to find a catalog of music that is as virtually unknown by the general public that is as unique, creative, beautiful, crazy, virtuosic, inspiring, etc etc as Tim's. Do I go around starting a thread on Gong trying to look hip and erudite by dismissing the quirkiness of the music, which undoubtedly is one of the aspects that makes it so amazing? Why spend all of this energy in a negative connotation, possibly turning off thousands of potential fans so you can get a "Right on BRO!" in the comments section? I don't personally know Tim, don't know how thick his skin, is, but I wouldn't want him to read this guys ramblings and dismissals of his entire life's blood, sweat, and tears. The beauty of this thread is we celebrate the music, hopefully turn on and inspire potential listeners, and have intelligent discussions on the music even if we don't agree 100% of the time. It seems to me the impetus of this guy is the complete opposite, and I am not interested.

    I'm now finished with this subject (hopefully).
    ^ This.


  23. #2273
    HBaEB is really making a comeback for me. Lately it had been On Land And In The Sea and Guns in rotation mostly, but now I'm coming back around to this one and it's great!

    Seems like a single track by Cardiacs has enough hooks for at least half-a-dozen pop songs.

  24. #2274
    I think reading the history of the band, that Tim's skin is probably pretty thick. That this kind of music has detractors, is no surprise to me. What is much more exciting is how many people get it. I get a real charge out of that!!
    Listening to Sing To God yesterday on a walk, pretty much, but jumping around on the order. I find that helps me hear things I might have overlooked in prior listenings. Anyway, focused on Horse's Tail. That tune is absolutely batshit nuts -love it!!
    Last edited by arthurfrayn; 03-17-2016 at 05:27 PM.

  25. #2275
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    Quote Originally Posted by aith01 View Post
    ^ This.

    Cheers brother.

    Quote Originally Posted by aith01 View Post
    HBaEB is really making a comeback for me. Lately it had been On Land And In The Sea and Guns in rotation mostly, but now I'm coming back around to this one and it's great!

    Seems like a single track by Cardiacs has enough hooks for at least half-a-dozen pop songs.
    Glad to see it! My theory still is that the production is a bit razzled and therefore throws an immense curveball to even fairly hardcore fans. Also, the paring down of instrumentation and the focus on more standard "rock" tunes is probably seen as a hindrance rather than an improvement, although not for me personally. "On Land" might contain some of their greatest band 'orchestrations' and arrangements with Bill Drake, the reeds, the percussion, etc and then this album comes along, BADA-BING, warts and all. To me its apples and oranges, and I'm forever indebted this album was even made, and the disparity of styles and sonic textures from the previous album makes it a delicious secondo following an already fulfilling and equally deliocious primo. Ciao! It was time to move on musically anyway, so I think the departure of Sarah and Bill (especially) forced Tim (in a way) to shape and sculpt the artful Heaven Born while literally reinventing this fucking incredible band. Plus this might be one of the best Cardiacs albums to crank at a party IMO - no joke!

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