Cardiacs--where to start?

[Sterbus]

New Rehearsal video, new amazingness !!!



Cardiacs rehearsing early material in preparation for the secret Bull & Gate shows In London. This track and others from the same session can be found on The Special Garage Concerts: Volumes I and II: Double CD available from the cardiacs on-line shop.
https://abc-mary.myshopify.com/colle...lumes-i-and-ii

[chalkpie]

^ saw this last night......YES! Thanks for posting man. I hope they keep 'em coming.

Hey Kavus - you don't suck.

[Phlakaton]

I think you have a non-convert here. I just cant get past the things I mentioned. Not my thing. Sometimes it doesn't work out... like the hot chicks in college I knew I would like and didn't after a week.

[zombywoof]

I think you have a non-convert here. I just cant get past the things I mentioned. Not my thing. Sometimes it doesn't work out... like the hot chicks in college I knew I would like and didn't after a week.

Put it away for a few months and try again.

[chalkpie]

Put it away for a few months and try again.

Yeah, you could try that. I guess don't force it, but I do hope you come back. Fripp just rattled off an amazing solo on "Exiles" from Great Deceiver disc 1....full Krimson mode right now. Show last night was insanely wonderful....one of my favorite shows ever. Try this tune man before you go:

[Phlakaton]

I had a similar experience with Lizard... hated it. Didn't want to hear it. Then years later it slammed me in the head and I loved it. I will indeed give it a go later. A Voyage to the Center of the Cosmos... oh ya. That is the gem on disc 1 for me.

[zombywoof]

I pause this great Cardiacs discussion to inform you that I'm extremely jealous of you for getting to see King Crimson.

Now back to the program.

[PeterG]

Cardiacs are shite, they are horrible little maggots, filth and dirt abound in evry corner of their suburban hovels, and I haaate them all, because they make music that moves something in my pants, it makes me so mad, it makes me want to do things with my hands to my dingeling!....and that fat bastrd Jim gets on my fcking tits.....'im' i'm 'im 'im 'im' 'im...what's the first fcking letter you fcvking fishy pondy shark kissing morons ? They are fcking orrible people & crap musicians.......aah that feels much better......I need my daily dose of chanelling Tim's anger

Meanwhile, in the other half of my brain....

[chalkpie]

^ Yeah, what he said. On reflection you're better off not listening to them. They actually fucking suck.

[chalkpie]

I pause this great Cardiacs discussion to inform you that I'm extremely jealous of you for getting to see King Crimson.

Now back to the program.

Sorry man. I didn't want it to be as good as it was - it's just the way things worked out.

[Adrian]

I had a similar experience with Lizard... hated it. Didn't want to hear it. Then years later it slammed me in the head and I loved it.

The same happened to me with Van Der Graaf Generator. Bought Pawn Hearts, couldn't understand what the fuss was about, tried my best, and finally gave up. One day several years later, I pulled out the same album, and it suddenly all fell into place like an epiphany.

You just never know.

[PeterG]

The same happened to me with Van Der Graaf Generator. Bought Pawn Hearts, couldn't understand what the fuss was about, tried my best, and finally gave up. One day several years later, I pulled out the same album, and it suddenly all fell into place like an epiphany.

I still don't "get" VDGG. In the 80s a mate gave me an original vinyl copy of H to He, I just didn't get it, even after several listens over many years. So, I assumed it must just have been that album, being an early one, that was not that good & that it wasn't my ears orm usical taste. So, I did a bit of research & bought what is considered one of their best albums on CD, Pawn Hearts, same thing though, after many years & occasional listens I still don't like them.

[Adrian]

It's true that sometimes an artist just won't "click," no matter how hard you try. That's been the case for me to this day with Captain Beefheart. I've given up trying to understand what's so special about Trout Mask Replica.

[zombywoof]

It's true that sometimes an artist just won't "click," no matter how hard you try. That's been the case for me to this day with Captain Beefheart. I've given up trying to understand what's so special about Trout Mask Replica.

Love VdGG, love Cardiacs, love Beefheart. However, I can't get into Yes to save my life.

[PeterG]

It's true that sometimes an artist just won't "click," no matter how hard you try. That's been the case for me to this day with Captain Beefheart. I've given up trying to understand what's so special about Trout Mask Replica.

I gave up on Beefheart in the 80s. Gimmicky, which might have appealed in the 60s & 70s. But I never saw the appeal.

[PeterG]

However, I can't get into Yes to save my life.

I'm with you on that one. Close to the Edge & Fragile I can listen to, I just don't get the rest.

[Steve F.]

I gave up on Beefheart in the 80s. Gimmicky, which might have appealed in the 60s & 70s. But I never saw the appeal.

Appeal is a question of taste. Taste can never be qualified.

But:

"Gimmicky" has to be the wrong word. I don't know what you are trying to express, but 'gimmicky' shouldn't be it.

[PeterG]

Gimmicky is exactly it. His voice, his lyrics, his look, his music were all new "gimmicks" to be different, to be eccentri, to stand out from the crowd.

[Kavus Torabi]

That same criticism has been levelled at Cardiacs countless times over the years and could apply to any number of 'unique' musical collectives or artists; Devo, The Residents, John Lydon, Sun Ra, Magma etc

[thedunno]

I'm not a native english speaker so i had to look "gimmick' up on wiki:
In marketing language, a gimmick is a unique or quirky special feature that makes something "stand out" from its contemporaries. However, the special feature is typically thought to be of little relevance or use. Thus, a gimmick is a special feature for the sake of having a special feature

Beefheart used voice, instruments and rythms differently for the sake of creating a sound that is completely unique even untill today. VERY relevant i'd say so not a gimmick. Same applies to Cardiacs.

[Kavus Torabi]

...Or to put it more succinctly, try watching the Tarred And Feathered video and imagining it from the point of view of someone who *doesn't* think Tim is a genius!

[PeterG]

That same criticism has been levelled at Cardiacs countless times over the years and could apply to any number of 'unique' musical collectives or artists; Devo, The Residents, John Lydon, Sun Ra, Magma etc

However, unlike all of those, who I have never considered the slightest bit gimmicky, I always felt with Beefheart it was just gimmicks to create something unique due to a lack of real talent, and I'm sorry, but IMO without his gimmicks Beefheart had nothing!

[Mr. Logical]

I always felt with Beefheart it was just gimmicks to create something unique due to a lack of real talent, and I'm sorry, but IMO without his gimmicks Beefheart had nothing!

He had a great voice and an amazing way with words - check out the lyrics on the Trout Mask Replica album. The original musical style evolved by The Magic Band in 1969 has been hugely influential, I doubt that would have been the case if it was all based on gimmicks. That said, a couple of later albums and tours failed to live up to the artistic standard of TMR.

But back to Cardiacs - all good wishes to Tim Smith, another talented maverick.

[PeterG]

check out the lyrics on the Trout Mask Replica album.

Really??? Do you think I'd have such strong opinions if I hadn't already listened to TMR & other albums back in the 80s in an attempt to understand what all the fuss was about amongst my freinds who liked Zappa?
Also, don't write "he had a great voice" as if it is a fact. IMO he had a bloody awful voice. He had a unique voice in the same way that Moondog, Tiny Tim, Neil Young, Rod Stewart, Tom Waits and Bob Dylan have unique voices, that doesn't mean they are good voices or that everyone will like them.

[Steve F.]

...Or to put it more succinctly, try watching the Tarred And Feathered video and imagining it from the point of view of someone who *doesn't* think Tim is a genius!

That made me laugh out loud.