LTIA
Starless
Discipline
Lizard
LTIA
Starless
Discipline
Lizard
Why is it whenever someone mentions an artist that was clearly progressive (yet not the Symph weenie definition of Prog) do certain people feel compelled to snort "thats not Prog" like a whiny 5th grader?
What's not to like
One thing I noticed is that virtually every review of Lizard I've ever read, including the most positive ones, make absolutely no mention of Indoor Games and Happy Family. It's as if no one had anything to say about these 2 songs, even those who consider the album a masterpiece. For me they are the difficult songs on the album and the most difficult to enjoy, especially the free jazz of Happy Family: it's a bit hard to see what they were aiming for with this one.
I always thought "Happy Family" usually was singled out for comment, since it's obligatory to point out the Beatley subject matter.
Hurtleturtled Out of Heaven - an electronic music composition, on CD and vinyl
https://michaelpdawson.bandcamp.com
http://www.waysidemusic.com/Music-Pr...MCD-spc-7.aspx
Well, without wanting to sound self-congratulatory, my review did:
Admittedly, i didn't get much into the music with that quote, but I was aiming more for big picture with the review, when it came to much of the music, as these kinds of assessments I think applied across the board..and I'd yet to begin making longer form writing my norm, so my review of Lizard, while typical All About Jazz review length, would likely be a completely different beast were I to review it today. That said, for example:Gordon Haskell's voice was always considered somewhat weak, yet there's no other Crim alum who could bring the kind of near-insanity he does when delivering lyricist Peter Sinfield's absurdist "Indoor Games," his allegory to The Beatles on "Happy Family," or frightening madness of "Cirkus."
Crimson was always an improvising group despite the often strict confines of structure, but here the group, despite its fractured personnel, was heading into uncharted territory.andLizard was, ultimately, the culmination of Fripp's jazzier proclivities, with Tippett back alongside other jazzers including cornetist Mark Charig and trombonist Nick Evans, both alums of Soft Machine's Fourth (Sony, 1971). Saxophonist/flautist Mel Collins, who'd become an official Crim on the strength of his Poseidon work, and who'd continue on with the Islands band, managed to traverse the dissolving boundaries between Tippett's more jagged spontaneity and the requisite lyricism of "Lady of the Dancing Waters."
Drummer Andy McCulloch was, in some ways, cut from the same cloth as departed Crimson co-founder Michael Giles, capable of navigating Fripp's most oblique writing to date on the side-long, epic and episodic title track. Symphonic concerns mesh with unfettered liberation throughout the record, as Fripp remains almost entirely avoidant of standard rock guitar posturing. That said, his silky, sustaining solo on "Lizard"'s hypnotic coda, and his masterful layering of electric and acoustic guitars throughout the album make clear that Fripp—responsible for writing all of Lizard's music alongside lyricist Sinfield—was already one of the most inventive guitarists operating in the rock sphere. Wilson's lucent remix reveals Fripp's brilliant but often dramatically understated playing, as in his lead-in to "Cirkus"' final verse. Compositionally, this is unequivocally Fripp's most advanced work to date, not to mention penning the five scariest mellotron chords in rock history on "Cirkus."
For me, side 1 is brilliant from start to finish, and I have felt that way ever since the needle first hit vinyl around '82 or so. Side 2 has been a grower. I actually wish we had Haskell on the first part of the suite instead of, or maybe in addition to, Anderson. The Anderson part is too airy fairy for me. A dissonant Haskell harmony vocal might have improved it.
One thing, though: I have never ever gotten a friend interested in this album. Hanging out with my high school friends who liked Tull and Floyd and the like, and who would tolerate Court and even Discipline, the only response I ever got about Lizard as "turn that shit off!"
Well, I did WTF heavily when I bought it at first, but it became quickly a fave of mine
Well, I'm not big on Lady Of Dancing Water, but still like it enough... However that closing Big Top thingie was definitely not a good idea... It kind of ruins the Lizard suite (as it's thankfully not part of it)
AFAIAC, this is the first real Fripp album (well excluding GG&F)... ITCOTCK was mainly a Lake & McDonald album (Fripp didn't write much on it)... and Poseidon's A -sde is more or less a repeat of the debut... As for the flipside, Cat Food is a McD/Lake track (if memory serves) and the Holtz piecve is a adaptation... Soooo, the first Fripp album for Crimlson is Lizard ... and what a splendid job it is... too bad Fripp doesn't like it... and prefer the mediocre Ismlands to it.
During Battle of the Glass Tears, I remember feeling the hot winds of the cannon balls whizzing out of my speakers and landing on the back wall of my bedroom.
TBH, I only really like Prelude, but it's a UFO for them.
my music collection increased tenfolds when I switched from drug-addicts to complete nutcases.
And here's a side of Robert Fripp that you didn't expect:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=64VGyoIyBgc
For me, "Big Top" is the perfect closer...taking an album that began as a nightmare ("Cirkus") and conclude it in an equally nightmarish fashion. I remember that hearing "Big Top," every time, caused my skin to crawl....
AFAIAC, this is the first real Fripp album (well excluding GG&F)... ITCOTCK was mainly a Lake & McDonald album (Fripp didn't write much on it)... and Poseidon's A -sde is more or less a repeat of the debut... As for the flipside, Cat Food is a McD/Lake track (if memory serves) and the Holtz piecve is a adaptation... Soooo, the first Fripp album for Crimlson is Lizard ... and what a splendid job it is... too bad Fripp doesn't like it... and prefer the mediocre Ismlands to it.
During Battle of the Glass Tears, I remember feeling the hot winds of the cannon balls whizzing out of my speakers and landing on the back wall of my bedroom.
TBH, I only really like Prelude, but it's a UFO for them.[/QUOTE]
I can't get into any pre-Larks era Crimson. Tried, but failed.
Compact Disk brought high fidelity to the masses and audiophiles will never forgive it for that
ITCOTCK is mainly a Sinfield/McDonald album. Not Lake.
I want to dynamite your mind with love tonight.
Ian
Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on progrock.com
https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-a...re-happy-hour/
Gordon Haskell - "You've got to keep the groove in your head and play a load of bollocks instead"
I blame Wynton, what was the question?
There are only 10 types of people in the World, those who understand binary and those that don't.
Slightly off-topic, I'm always wondering that the people who are declared themselves as the hardcore fans of avant, thus they prefer more that "avant", instrumental side of King Crimson than the KC' songs and who will always put LTiA and Red above Lizard at their lists, that they never or rarely put THRAK on a list.
Last edited by Svetonio; 10-10-2016 at 02:33 AM.
Well, I was planning to rewrite (and had started to actually) all my Crimson reviews (like the one quoted in the first post) when I got my laptop stolen in the trunk of my car and I had no back-up (I did find a skeleton structure of all my PA reviews in a USB stick, though). the theft did kind of stop me dead in my tracks, as I haven't posted anything since.
I was planning to indeed talk a lot more of those two tracks, especially about the madness of Indoor Games (that laugh is absolutely wonderful too)
TBH, I really love Haskell's voice on what he did for Lizard and Poseidon (though TBH, I don't appreciate his voive in his solo career much)... I think it's perfect for the zaniness of the A-side tracks (bar maybe Dancing Waters)... but I'm really into Anderson's vocals in Rupert, and though I might have liked to hear a Haskell scruffy-vocal version, but am not convinced it would've worked as good.
Thrak owes everything to LTIA, IMHO
I like that too.
Well, if I understand why Fripp kind of ignored this album in touring during the 70's (no tour after its release and a very different line-up for Islands), I don't really get why he still does in recent years (especially admitting he really likes it much mire since hearing Wilson's working on it), given that Islands is a fairly weak album.
Well with Fripp shying away from it(and Haskell hating it), it doesn't stand much chance to be featured heavily anytime soon
Eloquently put, though Dancing Waters' beauty does escape me a bit, eclipsed by the other three tracks on that side of the album.
Werd hing is that I don't like Haskell's voice in his solo career... And the only thing I do like at all is Earworm, which BTW is soooooo much better done by Stackridge on Extravaganza (maybe my fave Stackridge moment).
Last edited by Trane; 10-10-2016 at 04:46 AM.
my music collection increased tenfolds when I switched from drug-addicts to complete nutcases.
Well of course that Mr Fripp started with slightly "avant" instrumentals on Larks' Tongues in Aspic. Nobody deny that. And LTiA is a great album of its time.
However, that lack of THRAK on the numerous lists created by people who more or less recently started to celebrate avant, that's pretty strange, isn't? I mean, these KC' instrumentals from LTiA the orginal LP from 1973, are now, let's say, "naive" in comparision with the instrumentals on THRAK. But hey, since avant is something fashionable in prog community, a number of avant imposters appeared at the forums!
in my case, Thrak would find itself above the three 80's album, Scarcity and TCOL but +/- tied with TPTB, S&BB and Islands (I tend to almost prefer Vrooom, BTW)
So in a top 5 (mine anyways), it has little chance of appearing, but could appear in a top 10, if live albums are not included
So you may have a slight point at Thrak being more mature or more perfect than LTIA, but in terms of history, it has 20 years less of endearement with crimheads and has a déjà-entendu feel
I'm not sure how to read your last comment avant prog being "fashionable" (as it is a fairly small share of progheads, though they might be somewhat over-represented here in PE) and how those who like it being impostors (I supose you mean poseur, in this case)
my music collection increased tenfolds when I switched from drug-addicts to complete nutcases.
Yup, Fripp only wrote part of the t/t in that first album
My take is that on Court, McD is 60%, Lake 30% and Fripp 10% for the music and 100% sinfield for lyrics
On Poseidon, Fripp only wrote the Peace interludes, if memory serves, the rest is McD and Lake
However on Lizard, he wrote 100%, but still had to share 50% of royalties with Sinfield (lyrics)
my music collection increased tenfolds when I switched from drug-addicts to complete nutcases.
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