New Bay Area Prog Venue!

[Tributary Records]

I wonder how many people go to something like a Journey tribute band show? I have an old childhood friend who is doing that now. Maybe it could be mixed up since classic rock and prog aren't too far away in some people's minds. Like have a prog band open for the bigger draw.

It's easy to understand why tribute bands get booked so often. It's like picking the ripe low hanging fruit. You'll get the many of the fans of that artist.

However, I think there is a greater need for a venue that supports the original music scene. There is a lot of interesting music out there that is being overlooked... I want to support them.... and at the same time they need to support us. It's a give and take situation.

From my observation, the live music scene in general is weakening. Venues are closing. The youth culture seems more interested in electronica, DJ's and hip hop. They like the scene. People attract people. Pretty girls everywhere etc. Flashy marketing.

Generally there is more embracing of the digital arts. It's like comparing a painter to a piece done in photoshop. It it what it is.

The majority of live bands are going the indie rock route. It's mostly very predictable. Simple beats with distorted guitars avoiding melody. The only melody is in the vocal line with the music trading off between light and heavy.

Personally I am much more "moved" by a quality live band that is working as a unit to serve the music and also understand that being on stage should also be visual entertainment. You can have both. I see a lot of acts who are technically brilliant but give the visual no attention. Then of course the opposite.

The great prog bands I saw growing up did both. Yes and Nektar had great light shows and costumes. Certainly Genesis. Tull was very theatrical. ELP had great showmanship. Floyd of course had lights and props and extravagant sound systems.

A lot of jazz fails with too much self indulgent soloing that is not serving the music. People do want to be entertained.
Elvis and James Brown understood that. The R and B bands back in the day had great costumes and movement choreography.

If people are not going to be dancing, then you need to give them something else. I liked that about the ManifestiV show.
They were very visually entertaining. It would have been much better with a good bassist and drummer on board... even to add to that.

[Sputnik]

However, I think there is a greater need for a venue that supports the original music scene.

I don't have much to add to all of this, as we've on the east coast. But I'll just say props to you for having this attitude and taking this approach. You're definitely swimming against the current on this one in almost uncountable ways. But I wish you every success and hope that people in the Bay area support the venture.

It was hard to virtually impossible to keep a ~35 seat venue vibrant in the Boston area, and that eventually closed (though not strictly due to low attendance). The scene is just so fragmented, it's hard to get any kind of critical mass but for the biggest name artists. So best of luck to you, and if we're in SF I'll definitely try to stop by and check it out!

Bill

[Tributary Records]

I don't have much to add to all of this, as we've on the east coast. But I'll just say props to you for having this attitude and taking this approach. You're definitely swimming against the current on this one in almost uncountable ways. But I wish you every success and hope that people in the Bay area support the venture.

It was hard to virtually impossible to keep a ~35 seat venue vibrant in the Boston area, and that eventually closed (though not strictly due to low attendance). The scene is just so fragmented, it's hard to get any kind of critical mass but for the biggest name artists. So best of luck to you, and if we're in SF I'll definitely try to stop by and check it out!

Bill

Thanks Bill,

I'm aware of the improbable nature of such a task!

Hunting down Prog bands and trying to get them out of their bedrooms or garages won't be easy. One artist (keys, and very good) I talked to was extremely excited but he can't find a drummer who is competent enough to play odd meters and dedicated enough to engage the effort needed for his sophisticated compositions.
It does seem that drumming often is the limiting factor... as to bring it into rock. Most of the guys who could walk into such a gig are playing jazz, or metal.
I've always said the jazz guys can do it, but won't because it's not jazz! The rock guys often want to, but can't or don't have the technical ability. In the classic sense, a true Prog rock drummer is a rare breed. A lot of metal drummers can play complex stuff driving the downbeat etc... but lack the ability to articulate a more dynamic approach and play into melody while maintaining the ability to finesse their way through both the up beat, downbeat and swing the music in places like the great Prog drummers of the past did so effortlessly. A lot of those guys of course went into fusion as well.

I know I am of the unusual opinion that classic Prog actually created a new genre of music just as classical, jazz, blues, reggae, folk, metal etc... did. The problematic situation was in the labeling of it "progressive" which most took to and felt that it was necessary for it to progress in a way that it actually left itself behind.

I like going to a traditional jazz gig, and see what is going on, feeling the music and enjoying the players working through both standards and original pieces based upon a "jazz" approach to the music. It doesn't need to be "ever changing or progressive" to be enjoyable for what it is anymore than it does buying a ticket to the Opera or the Symphony. I don't need a laptop on stage acting as a Karaoke sideman making it seem "modern, hip, or trendy".

I have a guy from SF I am going to book in the fall who is doing electronica, but is using all analog synths, oscillators etc who will be performing everything in real time. Those analog feeds into the house system will sound fantastic. Trying to take a feed off a laptop into the mains sounds dreadful unless you have thousands of watts of power to drive huge subs etc which is the "modern" trend of extreme inefficiency IMHO. We'll get a huge sound running analog feeds through the six 15" woofers that are on the stage right now.

[Sputnik]

I know I am of the unusual opinion that classic Prog actually created a new genre of music just as classical, jazz, blues, reggae, folk, metal etc... did. The problematic situation was in the labeling of it "progressive" which most took to and felt that it was necessary for it to progress in a way that it actually left itself behind.

I could not agree with you more, and I think this is the root of many of our troubles. At this stage, I don't think the problem is solvable, so you kind of have to work around it as best you can. As I said, good luck, it's an uphill battle.

Bill

[stickman393]

.. Trying to take a feed off a laptop into the mains sounds dreadful unless you have thousands of watts of power to drive huge subs etc which is the "modern" trend of extreme inefficiency IMHO.

That's got to be dependent on the style/production of the music, and not something specific to laptop or computer audio interfaces, surely?
If not, then I expect some kind of frequency range limiter on the way into the PA is required for protection if nothing else. I might also be talking out my sub-woofer.

[Tributary Records]

That's got to be dependent on the style/production of the music, and not something specific to laptop or computer audio interfaces, surely?
If not, then I expect some kind of frequency range limiter on the way into the PA is required for protection if nothing else. I might also be talking out my sub-woofer.

The ManifestiV show was to me, basically an electronica act. Our club does have these giant subs each with a pair of 20" cones. Just takes a ton of juice to drive those things to get that mammoth bassy thump the kids love. The guy who owns those things is basically just storing them there, but didn't leave his 4000 watt amp to drive them. Our 400 watt amp drives the existing set up fine for PA purposes and that room which isn't huge. We also didn't have a speakon cable handy.
I didn't book the ManifestiV show as it was handed to me from the former guy who booked them last March.

Point being that when I ran the laptop into the board and then into the mains, it sounded pretty flat compared to what an actual bassist and drummer would have been able to fill the room with. We jacked it up the best we could with as much low end as the system could handle and it sounded decent, but the vocals were running through that same setting and sounded dreadful to me. But that is what they wanted.. the band wanted that.

We also have an all analog studio in a 1000 square foot space with tape reels, tube amps etc, and anytime I run a digital signal path through the board there it's the same truncated sound compared to either vinyl or reel to reel. The same sound coming off the laptop at the club..... just sounds awful even running through solid state amp. But a vocal, or acoustic guitar, or even an electric bass sounds fantastic running the same signal path.

Not looking to diverge this into a digital vs analog debate. Just sayin....

[stickman393]

>> Not looking to diverge this into a digital vs analog debate

Agreed. Thanks for explaining the background, Trib.

[Tributary Records]

Tonight,
Bindi's Wild Adventure
CD Release Volume 1 (April 2nd 2016 show)



Will be recording tonight on a 16 track Reel to Reel tape machine. Will be mixed down Monday and played on radio by this weekend! (OZCAT 89.5)

Anyone in the Bay Area wanting to come up. "The Hub" in Vallejo.

[Tributary Records]

I could not agree with you more, and I think this is the root of many of our troubles. At this stage, I don't think the problem is solvable, so you kind of have to work around it as best you can. As I said, good luck, it's an uphill battle.

Bill

We actually drew 3 times the crowd as the Hip Hop show did the night before. We also drew better than the last couple alternative rock crowds. The guys in the band were pretty shocked to be handed a nice envelop of cash at the end of the night. Sold a stack of CD's also that were of the last show played there back in April. So the plan is to record each show, then release that recording at the following show. A lot of good feedback on that idea.

So with the new record shop, the radio station and the venue all within walking distance from one another. The stage is set for the next great Bay Area music scene to emerge. Come join us!

[rapidfirerob]

I sincerely hope this flies. I live in Richmond and would come to see interesting music. I hope more fusion shows happen in the future.
I just liked The Hub's Facebook page. I hope you post on the page. Here it is: https://www.facebook.com/TheHubVallejo/

[Tributary Records]

stagesmall.jpg

Had a really cool old school band playing original western music Friday night. The guitarist actually used to play in a well known Bay Area Prog band. It was very refreshing to hear lap steel guitar, Chet Atkins style playing along with those traditional western grooves behind her beautiful voice. There was no country twang in there, more like Annie Haslam singing western music.

It reminded me how much influence guitarists like Atkins and Travis had on players like Howe, Barre and even Gilmore. It's those kind of diverse influences that made earlier Prog more interesting to my ears than a lot of the more single focused derivative metal playing that goes on today. There are a lot of great chops players around now, but it feels like many of them have been studying the same scales and fingering patterns.

It's good news I have no more prior commitments to fulfill from former booking agents to honor. The guy who booked the pop rock cover band Sat night and refused to let me add on a national touring prog band is now gone. His band didn't even draw well, so that gives me more clearance to book the so called "unpopular" music genres like art rock and prog, avant etc.

[Esoteric]

whats the tech spec on desk/PA and monitors etc-- can it be seated at all? and size of stage.(important for some Prog bands) Is it an easy load in/load out-- that kind of stuff is really useful to know--website doesnt have any of that and really relevant for a lot of Prog bands who arent simple show up and plug in.