Anyone watching Armstrong's interview?

[enpdllp]

I read an interview about Andy Scleck, where they asked him about his chances to win a second tdF... took a minute to sink in, because I didn't remember AS winning one before... he answered saying that his next win will be on the road, not in the courtrooms

I think they should have left the first place from the 2010 TdF vacant as they did with the ones that Armstrong won. Schleck had too many close links to doping for him to be declared the winner of the 2010 TdF.

Schleck's team manager at the time, Bjarne Riis had been associated with doping and after many years of denials he admitted using banned substances while riding the TdF, including the year he won. After the 2010 tour, Schleck joined team RadioShack-Leopard where Bruyneel was the general manager. Bruyneel was dismissed from his general manager position this past fall after USADA's report was published. Andy's older brother and teammate during all his years as a professional rider, Frank, has been dodging doping allegations for quite some time. Frank tested positive and was removed from the 2012 TdF. Schleck's recent comment that he was confident that Armstrong ran clean during his TdF comeback in 2009 & 2010 sounded a too naive or a little bit supportive to a fellow doper. According to recent test results on Armstrong's blood from those years, Armstrong's chance of not having done blood transfusions during the 2009 and 2010 are less than one in a million.

[Trane]

I think they should have left the first place from the 2010 TdF vacant as they did with the ones that Armstrong won. Schleck had too many close links to doping for him to be declared the winner of the 2010 TdF.

Schleck's team manager at the time, Bjarne Riis had been associated with doping and after many years of denials he admitted using banned substances while riding the TdF, including the year he won. After the 2010 tour, Schleck joined team RadioShack-Leopard where Bruyneel was the general manager. Bruyneel was dismissed from his general manager position this past fall after USADA's report was published. Andy's older brother and teammate during all his years as a professional rider, Frank, has been dodging doping allegations for quite some time. Frank tested positive and was removed from the 2012 TdF. Schleck's recent comment that he was confident that Armstrong ran clean during his TdF comeback in 2009 & 2010 sounded a too naive or a little bit supportive to a fellow doper. According to recent test results on Armstrong's blood from those years, Armstrong's chance of not having done blood transfusions during the 2009 and 2010 are less than one in a million.

You do have a point about the doping thing with the Schleck bros (not to mention Cancellara).... But apparently, things didn't go smooth at all between them and ex-Armstrong/Discovery team manager Johan Bruyneel

Bruyneel criticized them as lazy... but probably meaning they wouldn't jump in in his doping system... They only worked six months together... and just after Bruyneel's exit (prior to the tdF), Frank gets caught...

[enpdllp]

They only worked six months together... and just after Bruyneel's exit (prior to the tdF), Frank gets caught...

FWIW, Bruyneel was the general manager when Frank tested positive while riding the TdF in July 2012. Bruyneel left or was let go from the team in October 2012, shorty after the USADA report was released.

Unlike Armstrong, Bruyneel will be going to an arbitration hearing with USADA to contest the charges.

I just found this article where the former president of the UCI confirms that Armstrong and other folks that had suspect test values were getting warnings and told to be careful instead of getting fined or punished. The same former UCI president justified the move as a way to protect clean riders. Freaking unbelievable. This is going to get messier than I ever expected.

[Trane]

I just found this article where the former president of the UCI confirms that Armstrong and other folks that had suspect test values were getting warnings and told to be careful instead of getting fined or punished. The same former UCI president justified the move as a way to protect clean riders. Freaking unbelievable. This is going to get messier than I ever expected.

Oh fuck yeah!!! If there is any substance to that rumour (and I suspect there is >> I have for years, for that matter), a lot of UCI heads are going to roll

[Progmatic]

Oh fuck yeah!!! If there is any substance to that rumour (and I suspect there is >> I have for years, for that matter), a lot of UCI heads are going to roll

I remember that so I have to give you credit for that . You were (un)believer

[Progmatic]

I can get that for $20 and a cheeseburger.

...wow and me stupid wasting my money on CDs when I could get laid with one of the Playboy girls for the price of one CD....

[Duncan Glenday]

...This is going to get messier than I ever expected.

QFT!

Oh fuck yeah!!! If there is any substance to that rumour (and I suspect there is >> I have for years, for that matter), a lot of UCI heads are going to roll

They ought to!

I remember that so I have to give you credit for that . You were (un)believer

When the PMs were first started on the old system, I was one of the more vociferous un-believers, and a strong Armstrong supporter.

The evidence quickly persuaded me otherwise, though, which is why I'm pretty f***ing bitter about the whole thing right now.

[Scott Bails]

QFT!
When the PMs were first started on the old system, I was one of the more vociferous un-believers, and a strong Armstrong supporter.

The evidence quickly persuaded me otherwise, though, which is why I'm pretty f***ing bitter about the whole thing right now.

I'm not bitter, as I'm really not enough of a cycling fan to feel that passionately about it, but I'm definitely another of those who refused to believe the allegations before and am now fully persuaded. I've lost all respect for the guy.

[Trane]

When the PMs were first started on the old system, I was one of the more vociferous un-believers, and a strong Armstrong supporter.

The evidence quickly persuaded me otherwise, though, which is why I'm pretty f***ing bitter about the whole thing right now.

I can understand that!! And it's one of the reasons why I'm also blaming others around Armstrong, not just him.... He certainly didn't do that on his own.... Bruyneel (a Belgian) is most likely the main engineer, and is twice as guilty as Lance is... So it was never anti-USA-ism from my part, because we (as a country) are just we as guilty

I've suspected for years that the UCI had looked the other way, but it's only recent (2 years), that rumours of being warned ahead of time) was also a possibility...

I'm still peeved about the LeMond-Fignon handlebar that bent the TdF in favour of Greg for 8 seconds (Greg admitted his time-gain with that artefact was around 3 minutes over the whole TdF 89)... When the UCI (a very French organisation) made the Frenchman Fignon loose by allowing that tri-athlete handlebar in the TdF to the US LeMond, I just knew that they were out to go for globalization at all costs...

[spellbound]

If these cyclists are so intent on doping before they race, why not just have a race open to all PED cyclists? We would hear about all the speed records they set, and a few years later, we would hear of their premature demises as a result of ingesting the very chemicals that allowed them to set the records in the first place. Tour de Dope.

Cool Mad Magazine cover, Duncan.

[enpdllp]

If these cyclists are so intent on doping before they race, why not just have a race open to all PED cyclists?

Just are there are rules for the type of bikes that could not be used on cycling events, there are rules for the for the type of substances you are not allowed to ingest. Also, not all riders have the means and/or access to get the same type of PEDs. The cycling competitions are to determine who is the best rider, not the one with the best medicine cabinet.

[Progmatic]

Just are there are rules for the type of bikes that could not be used on cycling events, there are rules for the for the type of substances you are not allowed to ingest. Also, not all riders have the means and/or access to get the same type of PEDs. The cycling competitions are to determine who is the best rider, not the one with the best medicine cabinet.

The answer is in this interesting article published by National Geographics

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...france-sports/

I just take one quote from it by legendary Jacques Anquetil

"Anquentil remarked that it was impossible "to ride the Tour on mineral water."
"You would have to be an imbecile or a crook to imagine that a professional cyclist who races for 235 days a year can hold the pace without stimulants," Anquetil said.
and he was racing till 1964

[enpdllp]

Oh fuck yeah!!! If there is any substance to that rumour (and I suspect there is >> I have for years, for that matter), a lot of UCI heads are going to roll

They ought to!

I hope so. With the admission from the former UCI president, this case appears to be heading into a very ugly place, but maybe this is what cycling as a sport needs to clean its tarnished image. A purging of the bad apples at all the levels that were part of the cover up. I wonder if Armstrong or any of the folks involved would be serving any prison time for their involvement. Marion Jones offenses were definitely small change compared to this whole saga.

When the PMs were first started on the old system, I was one of the more vociferous un-believers, and a strong Armstrong supporter.

The evidence quickly persuaded me otherwise, though, which is why I'm pretty f***ing bitter about the whole thing right now.

I have been a skeptic since Armstrong's first TdF win. After seeing Armstrong's stunt and overall performance at the Atlanta Olympics road race in 1996, I was not able to buy the fairy tale that a guy that had just recovered from a very serious case of cancer could have won the TdF a little over two years after his last cancer treatment without help. Being a cycling enthusiast since I was a teenager and a science guy for almost three decades, it was very hard for me to believe it was humanly possible. Armstrong's cocky attitude during his seven year TdF reign did not help to remove the 1996 Olympics image I already had.

[Trane]

I just take one quote from it by legendary Jacques Anquetil

"Anquentil remarked that it was impossible "to ride the Tour on mineral water."
"You would have to be an imbecile or a crook to imagine that a professional cyclist who races for 235 days a year can hold the pace without stimulants," Anquetil said.
and he was racing till 1964

Mmmhhh!!!... the average rider races on average 90 days since the early 90's, depending on his specialty (Armstrong raced something like 50/year, of which 40% was the TdF)... but trains the rest of the year very seriously

Anquetil's times were completely different... one day you could lose 15 minutes, but the next day, you could put your opponent 20 minutes behinsd.... That's why the press was dythirambic over Landis' unbelievable reversal in that famous TdF, after losing 8 minutes (and all illusion of the YJ) and the next day, he put everyone 10 minutes away... Sounded like old time legend and antics, that I viewed aa a then-kid...

[enpdllp]

Today is the last day that Armstrong could make a full confession to USADA and reduce his lifetime ban down to eight years. Some of Armstrong's comments on the following link makes me think his ban is not going to be reduced. The links below have some other interesting details:

http://espn.go.com/sports/endurance/...-attorney-says

http://abcnews.go.com/US/lance-armst...ry?id=18415386