And the best Black and White movie ever is:

[Staun]

RIP Olivia de_Havilland/

104 is quite a ride.

It is funny, somehow you just think all the great ones have been gone a long time. Wonder who else might still be around?

[ronmac]

I never thought about a wig but now, in some scenes it was pretty telling, and bad.

The wig was a smart choice, according to Billy Wilder:

Billy Wilder on Barbara Stanwyck’s ‘Double Indemnity’ wig, her wonderful brain, casting Fred MacMurray

[nycsteve]

Nycsteve, are you kidding? Bette would have eaten that role alive.

Exactly. The over the top melodramtics Davis traded in would have altered and lessened the impact of DI. . Theres a reason for the universal high regard for Double Indemnity vs the
cult admiration for ,say , The Letter. I've always thought of Davis as the female Shattner of her era.

[ronmac]

Exactly. The over the top melodramtics Davis traded in would have altered and lessened the impact of DI. . Theres a reason for the universal high regard for Double Indemnity vs the
cult admiration for ,say , The Letter. I've always thought of Davis as the female Shattner of her era.

Shattner was a ham. Bette Davis had TEN Best Actress Oscar nominations.

[nycsteve]

Shattner was a ham. Bette Davis had TEN Best Actress Oscar nominations.

And Forrest Gump won Best Picture over The Shawshank Redemption. Davis was a powerhouse and on top of the pile in her prime. But movies she was in became Davis pictures by sheer force of personality.. Double Indemnity as a Davis picture would not be as good as the actual version. I always thought Davis was almost doing a parody of human emotions in her over the top performance style. Her pictures for the most part , for me , dont translate as well as the efforts of some other actresses of her time to modern viewers. Her picture appears next to the definition of Scenery Chewers. Of course what made her popular in her day , can still apply to todays audiances. It comes down to matters of taste I guess.

[Hal...]

I'm copying this from Wikipedia because I want to point something out that I've been saying for years which never seems to get any acknowledgement. I'll put that part in bold.

Overacting (also referred to as hamming or mugging) refers to acting that is exaggerated. Overacting can be viewed positively or negatively. It is sometimes known as "chewing the scenery".

Uses

Some roles require overly-exaggerated character acting, particularly those in comedy films. For example, the breakthrough roles for Jim Carrey (in Ace Ventura: Pet Detective and The Mask) saw him portray the lead characters in a very flamboyant fashion, as the script demanded. He has played several "straight" roles since.

Overacting may be used to portray an outlandish character, or to stress the evil characteristics of a villain. Academy Award winner Gary Oldman was almost typecast as an anti-social personality early in his screen career: the necessity to express villainous characters in an overtly physical manner led to the cultivation of a "big" acting style that incorporated projection skills acquired during his stage training. Oldman noted that he has given "over-the-top" performances, but argued, "If it's coming from a sincere place, then I think the screen can hold the epic, and it can hold the very, very small."

Oscar and Tony Award-winning actor Al Pacino, when asked if he overacts, said: "Well, all actors do, in a way. You know what they say: in the theater you have to reach the balcony." Pacino suggested that directors serve to rein in screen performances that are too large.

Reactions

In an article on overacting, Independent critic Leigh Singer wrote: "Unlike theatre's declamatory projecting to the back row, a 'stagey' performance onscreen isn't a compliment... ultimately, it really is a matter of personal taste." Jeff Labrecque of Entertainment Weekly argued that "there's a thin line between overacting (bad) and acting that you're overacting (bizarrely genius)"; the publication at one time gave year-end awards for "best" and "worst" overacting in film, with the aforementioned Oldman and Pacino winning the former for their work in Léon: The Professional (1994) and The Devil's Advocate (1997), respectively. Guardian journalist Chris Michael, a proponent of overacting, said: "From Hugo Weaving's Agent Smith to Heath Ledger's Joker to the entire oeuvre of William Shatner, mannered or stylized acting is an underrated skill."

This is my take on overacting: if it appears natural, then it's not overacting. The character simply has a big personality. Cases in point: Malcolm McDowell's performance in A Clockwork Orange or Marisa Tomei in My Cousin Vinny.

Conversely, there is also what I've identified as subtle acting and underacting. Subtle acting is what you get from a lot of actors in Ingmar Bergman's or Woody Allen's films (Woody's serious films, that is). Underacting is what you get from people like Gary Cooper or John Wayne.

As for whether Bette Davis overacts or not, I would say it depends. There are certainly roles she played that didn't require a big personality, where she came off as overacting, but Bette had a big, forceful personality herself. Also, she was a product of her time. Her performances in Petrified Forrest (1936) and A Pocketful of Miracles (1961) are very natural. And then you look at something like some of her soapers of the '40s or Whatever Happened to Baby Jane? and I would say she was over the top. But since that last one was campy, her performance actually kind of fit. But then look at something like The Whales of August. Starring Bette and Lillian Gish, both gave stellar performances. But, looking over their careers, was Bette as good as Lillian? I tend to think not. Lillian Gish was the Helen Hayes of cinema.

As for whether she would have worked in Double Indemnity, I would say it would depends. I think she could have, as long as Billy Wilder kept her reined in.

And as I've said numerous times, the director is as much - or more - responsible for the performance of the actors as the actors themselves. It is his/her job to spot when someone isn't doing a good job and to yell, "cut!"

[ronmac]

^^ Totally agree, Hal.

I think Davis could have played just about any role. I recall a local radio host making a good point, which I may have shared here before. The movie being discussed was "Rain Man." People rightly pointed out how great Tom Cruise was in that role. The radio host pointed out that the difference between Cruise and Dustin Hoffman was that Hoffman could have been great in either role.

And Forrest Gump won Best Picture over The Shawshank Redemption. Davis was a powerhouse and on top of the pile in her prime. But movies she was in became Davis pictures by sheer force of personality.. Double Indemnity as a Davis picture would not be as good as the actual version. I always thought Davis was almost doing a parody of human emotions in her over the top performance style. Her pictures for the most part , for me , dont translate as well as the efforts of some other actresses of her time to modern viewers. Her picture appears next to the definition of Scenery Chewers. Of course what made her popular in her day , can still apply to todays audiances. It comes down to matters of taste I guess.

I'm not disagreeing with you about Bette Davis being in DI. I'm pointing out that comparing her to Shattner is a bit too much, but I get your point. I think Stanwyck was perfect for the role. Case closed.

[nycsteve]

Top actresses of the 30s and 40s could almost deserve its own thread. So many over rated and under rated names.
At the moment I can't think of any Davis comedies other than The Man Who Came To Dinner. Are there others?

[ronmac]

I think "Now Voyager" proved that Davis could play more reserved characters. That should have won her an Oscar.

She made so many films, there are a number of other comedies.

[Jerjo]

Here's an interesting resource. Someone has made scans of old Hollywood glossy photos and they look amazing. But the site itself is so archaic I thought I stumbled back into 1999. Nonetheless, the images in the gallery are worth the archaic format.

https://www.doctormacro.com/index.html

[Staun]

Catch, The Train, at 4:30 cst on TCM. Have a good trip.

[Staun]

Here's an interesting resource. Someone has made scans of old Hollywood glossy photos and they look amazing. But the site itself is so archaic I thought I stumbled back into 1999. Nonetheless, the images in the gallery are worth the archaic format.

https://www.doctormacro.com/index.html

cool. Should be lots of legs.

[ronmac]

Chaplin ALL DAY LONG tomorrow on TCM

[Hal...]

I went to check out TCM's schedule and saw some promo with an absolutely great line I'd never heard before, from The Women:

"There's a name for you ladies but it isn't used in high society... outside of kennels."

[ronmac]

I went to check out TCM's schedule and saw some promo with an absolutely great line I'd never heard before, from The Women:

"There's a name for you ladies but it isn't used in high society... outside of kennels."

[ronmac]

John Barrymore movies on all day Thursday beginning with his awesome "Dr. Jekyl & Mr. Hyde" from 1920

[Hal...]

Did I ever mention the time I saw Drew Barrymore on a talk show? I know her heritage but I never thought she looked like a Barrymore. Until I saw her on that talk show, when I saw her in profile. I was struck by how much she looked like her grandfather.

[Staun]

I know it's in color but catch, Peyton Place on TCM at 7pm. There are good and bad prints of it but I have a soft spot for this film.

[Hal...]

For some reason, I always confuse that movie with A Summer Place. My mom loved both movies and I've never seen either. She also loved the theme song, "A Summer Place", which I have to admit is pretty excellent.

I was actually thinking of tuning in to Peyton Place until I saw the runtime: 2:37. Dude, that's a long fucking runtime for a melodrama!

Convince me it's worth it.

Incidentally, as far as I know, TCM only ever has the best and/or definitive prints for their movies.


OT, but this is black and white:

[ronmac]

I really don't want to move to the next page on this thread. Seeing Olivia deHavilland at the top really makes my day. GOD, is she luscious in that photo!

[Jerjo]

Just make sure the next page leads off with a nude Hedy Lamarr

[NogbadTheBad]

RIP Olivia de_Havilland/

104 is quite a ride.

There you go.

[nycsteve]

Just make sure the next page leads off with a nude Hedy Lamarr

Headly

[Staun]

For some reason, I always confuse that movie with A Summer Place. My mom loved both movies and I've never seen either. She also loved the theme song, "A Summer Place", which I have to admit is pretty excellent.

I was actually thinking of tuning in to Peyton Place until I saw the runtime: 2:37. Dude, that's a long fucking runtime for a melodrama!

Convince me it's worth it.

Incidentally, as far as I know, TCM only ever has the best and/or definitive prints for their movies.


OT, but this is black and white:

Besides being a good story and some nice acting......I'll work on it. Come on Hal, watch the thing.

[Staun]

For some reason, I always confuse that movie with A Summer Place. My mom loved both movies and I've never seen either. She also loved the theme song, "A Summer Place", which I have to admit is pretty excellent.

I was actually thinking of tuning in to Peyton Place until I saw the runtime: 2:37. Dude, that's a long fucking runtime for a melodrama!

Convince me it's worth it.

Incidentally, as far as I know, TCM only ever has the best and/or definitive prints for their movies.


OT, but this is black and white:

No women playing violin? Hmm.