Calyx (Canterbury Scene) - http://www.calyx-canterbury.fr
Legends In Their Own Lunchtime (blog) - https://canterburyscene.wordpress.com/
My latest books : "Yes" (2017) - https://lemotetlereste.com/musiques/yes/ + "L'Ecole de Canterbury" (2016) - http://lemotetlereste.com/musiques/lecoledecanterbury/ + "King Crimson" (2012/updated 2018) - http://lemotetlereste.com/musiques/kingcrimson/
Canterbury & prog interviews - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdf...IUPxUMA/videos
Steve F.
www.waysidemusic.com
www.cuneiformrecords.com
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
“Remember, if it doesn't say "Cuneiform," it's not prog!” - THE Jed Levin
Any time any one speaks to me about any musical project, the one absolute given is "it will not make big money". [tip of the hat to HK]
"Death to false 'support the scene' prog!"
please add 'imo' wherever you like, to avoid offending those easily offended.
Steve F.
www.waysidemusic.com
www.cuneiformrecords.com
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
“Remember, if it doesn't say "Cuneiform," it's not prog!” - THE Jed Levin
Any time any one speaks to me about any musical project, the one absolute given is "it will not make big money". [tip of the hat to HK]
"Death to false 'support the scene' prog!"
please add 'imo' wherever you like, to avoid offending those easily offended.
Ah well, skip the rare appearances with him guesting then. Shame nobody recorded the original quartet playing out in the field.Originally Posted by WikipediaI have both Assagai records; Gowen does not appear to be on either one of them. Must have joined before, or after, or between them.Originally Posted by Calyx
Sunship... Mmmm, if I could go back in time....
Last edited by rcarlberg; 01-13-2016 at 06:27 PM.
I would say "Arriving Twice" is pretty close to how they would have sounded in a live setting. BBC sessions were largely live, certainly for jazz-oriented bands, as is the 1973 demo I'm sure. Certainly, compared to the rather "produced" debut album, this is a more stripped-down affair, with just one layer of keyboards (just electric piano, mostly) and obviously none of the Northettes-style choral sections.
Calyx (Canterbury Scene) - http://www.calyx-canterbury.fr
Legends In Their Own Lunchtime (blog) - https://canterburyscene.wordpress.com/
My latest books : "Yes" (2017) - https://lemotetlereste.com/musiques/yes/ + "L'Ecole de Canterbury" (2016) - http://lemotetlereste.com/musiques/lecoledecanterbury/ + "King Crimson" (2012/updated 2018) - http://lemotetlereste.com/musiques/kingcrimson/
Canterbury & prog interviews - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdf...IUPxUMA/videos
Two questions:Originally Posted by Calyx
1. By "scores of unrecorded compositions" did you mean numbering in the 20s? Or did you mean sheet music, written scores?
2. Are there recordings of the 1983 National Health gigs in Edinburgh playing Alan's music? Oh wait, these would feature tone generator, wouldn't they? Nevermind.
I have very recently unearthed much more information about (1). It isn't exactly what I wrote. Alan had extensive archives of scores, but what was considered for "DS Al Coda" never really exceeded what is on the finished record. Initially it wasn't going to be a National Health album but would feature different line-ups. I have a provisional tracklist for the album which had side 1 devoted to tracks performed by National Health and Hatfield and the North (I'm speaking in terms of line-ups, not sure if they would have been credited as such, but basically Richard Sinclair would have played bass on one track rather than John Greaves), and side 2 performed by a variation of Gilgamesh with Peter Lemer replacing Gowen along with Lee, Hopper and Tomkins. It was later decided to do a 100% NH album because it was thought the album would sell more with that name on it. Kind of sad the Gilgamesh guys were out from that point.
It is now my understanding that Alan Gowen had no less than three projects in the works at the time of his death, of which only "Before A Word Is Said" was finished. One was a second duo album with Hugh Hopper, another was a third Gilgamesh album (line-up same as "Another Fine Tune...") and the last was a project called "Maze" performed by duos and trios. The scores for "Maze" are in Alan's archives, never performed.
As for 2, Phil Miller told me a recording existed of the Edinburgh concert, made - if I remember correctly - by the BBC although not broadcast (the recording equipment was set up for, again iirc, a performance by saxophonist George Coleman), but Phil no longer had it when we discussed it (he had lent it to someone who had yet to return it), so I've never heard it.
There may be more archival releases happening eventually. Not necessarily any of the above but involving some of the same musicians.
PS: I didn't immediately catch your bit about my use of the word "scores". I did mean "sheet music", not "countless" pieces, although there ARE many unrecorded pieces in Alan's archives, including the unplayed National Health composition "Bells" and an untitled, very long piece for a large line-up that had a certain "Robert" named as the vocalist on it... Make of that what you will, in any case it never saw the light of day.
Calyx (Canterbury Scene) - http://www.calyx-canterbury.fr
Legends In Their Own Lunchtime (blog) - https://canterburyscene.wordpress.com/
My latest books : "Yes" (2017) - https://lemotetlereste.com/musiques/yes/ + "L'Ecole de Canterbury" (2016) - http://lemotetlereste.com/musiques/lecoledecanterbury/ + "King Crimson" (2012/updated 2018) - http://lemotetlereste.com/musiques/kingcrimson/
Canterbury & prog interviews - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdf...IUPxUMA/videos
Who owns the archives? I wonder if anyone, like they did for Lindsay Cooper, will eventually pull them out and rehearse them?
Is there a setlist for the Gilgamesh/Hatfield collaboration? Surely it was all existing material, as I can't imagine them learning new stuff for a one-off.
An unplayed NH tune called "Bells," a 40-minute unrecorded piece, "Ramo and Other Boating Disasters," "Maze," an untitled long piece for Wyatt's vocals... The album "The Complete NH" is sounding more and more ironically titled.
Italy's Artchipel Orchestra were interested but in the end performed a previously known piece "Shining Water".
They only played the specially composed, 40-minute piece known only as "Double Quartet", of which "Extract" is... well, an exctract. So, a portion of that we do know. The score for that was NOT in Alan's archives, and neither was any of the Stewart or Campbell material for National Health. I'm not sure why - his scores were stolen during the February 1976 tour, but by the time he left a year later, he likely would have made replacements.Is there a setlist for the Gilgamesh/Hatfield collaboration? Surely it was all existing material, as I can't imagine them learning new stuff for a one-off.
"Jamo" is on the first Gilgamesh album.An unplayed NH tune called "Bells," a 40-minute unrecorded piece, "Jamo and Other Boating Disasters," "Maze," an untitled long piece for Wyatt's vocals... The album "The Complete NH" is sounding more and more ironically titled.
Of course there's also "Trident Asleep", the only NH piece (played live February through June 1976) performed but never released. ("Four Fold", played on the Spring 1979 European tour remains unreleased by NH but was recorded on the "Before A Word Is Said" album). This was considered for "Missing Pieces" but the existing recordings were deemed not good enough (musically as well as sonically).
"The Complete NH" was true to its name when released. The "Paracelsus" excerpt was previously unreleased, and the only thing that could be offered at this point of the early recordings since Bruford had vetoed the inclusion of more. Also, with two CDs clocking in at 79 minutes each there's not much room for more unless you make it a triple.
Calyx (Canterbury Scene) - http://www.calyx-canterbury.fr
Legends In Their Own Lunchtime (blog) - https://canterburyscene.wordpress.com/
My latest books : "Yes" (2017) - https://lemotetlereste.com/musiques/yes/ + "L'Ecole de Canterbury" (2016) - http://lemotetlereste.com/musiques/lecoledecanterbury/ + "King Crimson" (2012/updated 2018) - http://lemotetlereste.com/musiques/kingcrimson/
Canterbury & prog interviews - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdf...IUPxUMA/videos
Man, you're good.
Cleaning up and putting things away, I found the dat of this.
Hadn't heard it in 10-15 years. Glad the dat machine still works (hadn't turned that on for at LEAST 10)....
It is indeed Jamo and it is, indeed a studio outtake.
It is all of Jamo: it's not incomplete, but otherwise your memory was spot ON!
Steve F.
www.waysidemusic.com
www.cuneiformrecords.com
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
“Remember, if it doesn't say "Cuneiform," it's not prog!” - THE Jed Levin
Any time any one speaks to me about any musical project, the one absolute given is "it will not make big money". [tip of the hat to HK]
"Death to false 'support the scene' prog!"
please add 'imo' wherever you like, to avoid offending those easily offended.
Calyx (Canterbury Scene) - http://www.calyx-canterbury.fr
Legends In Their Own Lunchtime (blog) - https://canterburyscene.wordpress.com/
My latest books : "Yes" (2017) - https://lemotetlereste.com/musiques/yes/ + "L'Ecole de Canterbury" (2016) - http://lemotetlereste.com/musiques/lecoledecanterbury/ + "King Crimson" (2012/updated 2018) - http://lemotetlereste.com/musiques/kingcrimson/
Canterbury & prog interviews - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdf...IUPxUMA/videos
Originally Posted by rickawakeman View Post
(...) If you like this, you should check out Gowen/Sinclair/Tomkins/Pyle's "Before a Word is Said", the last recorded work by Gowen.
I bought it last year for about the price below, but it's worth any penny.
https://www.discogs.com/Alan-Gowen-P...elease/8479631
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