Yeesh. Okay, now, I feel like I have to stand up for them. I don't feel like every post-Neal album's the same. In fact, I rather think the notion is ludicrous. I certainly don't feel like there's a "Submerged," or a "From the Darkness," or a "I Know Your Secret" on any of the Neal-era albums.
Man, if you got rid of every band because they had a "sound" that carried over from album to album, your CD collection would be pretty thin.
"Arf." -- Frank Zappa, "Beauty Knows No Pain" (live version)
A lot of bands just keep nailing it from album to album, which keeps my interest. SB is just not one of them.
Their last release is my fave of all of them.
Regards,
Jon
^^^^^Yeah, he is but you are spot on..Zappa is not a good example to give of an artist who changed himself from an artistic view point. Quantity was more important than quality with old uncle Frank. I think I kept about four vinyls but never replaced them on CD! Consistency is more important than quantity.and nobody can accuse The Beard of failing in that department, ditto Iron Maiden. Same couldn't be said of 80's Genesis and 80's/ 90"s Rush!
Last edited by Rufus; 07-05-2015 at 04:41 AM.
I'd be interested to know what Zappa albums we are talking about here. Is 'Freak Out' like 'Lumpy Gravy' from two years later? Is the doo-wop throwback 'Cruising With Ruben And The Jets' like 'Hot Rats'? These are a few albums from his first three years as an album artist alone.
I think the reason these bands stick to their sound is made all too clear by some comments here. I'm not talking about those who see it as 'comfort', which I understand the appeal of, but those others who would probably be angry if they deviated.
The last SB album I heard was the eponymous one. I didn't really like it, nor 'Octane'. I was also concurrently checking out some of the Neal Morse ones at that time and felt they were stronger.
I like Neal's style (for the most part), but it is very formulaic at this point. Similar melodies and hooks. Similar structure to songs. Always that hint that with a little tweaking, it would be on Broadway. I find very little different from one Neal Morse record to the next.
Mongrel dog soils actor's feet
^I was talking about Neal Morse-era Spock's Beard rather than his solo work (although that wasn't clear), which I haven't bothered with. Religious lyrics aren't my thing as a rule.
Examples? I ask because you have now dedicated like 5 posts or more to this thread exclaiming that Spock's is formulaic and that you are over them. It would be interesting to know what bands you feel don't fall into this supposed rut. I ask this question on here time and time again to people who slam on Neal Morse and others about this issue and to date I have never received a single answer to the question. I am not trying to be a smart aleck, but seriously, if you are going to post so much about how Spock's Beard is now so uninteresting and other bands "keep nailing it", please give some examples. I get the Zappa comment as that seems to be the standard go to from the past, but who are the current artists or bands that could show bands like Spock's how it is done?
Though it might not. be intended this way, you and others who make these constant negative comments about bands like Spock's formula and the fact that you have moved on tend to sound a lbit arrogant. It's like you are saying, sorry but I am just a bit more musically sofisticated than the people who still like this band. That's fair and may be the case, but if so, it would be great to get some examples of the "lots of bands" that you reference. Help us to move beyond this formula that you speak of.
Last edited by Patelena396; 07-05-2015 at 01:24 PM.
Sure. I am really not being arrogant...it is just my humble opinion. Bands that i consider just keep getting better are as follows (in alphabetical order):
Accordo Dei contrari
Aquaserge
Big Big Train
Deus Ex Machina
Echolyn
Haken
Kaipa
Kenso
Matts/Morgan
Opeth
Steven Wilson
The Tangent
I am sure there are more, just cant think of them all at the moment.
But I think all these artists are maturing like fine wine, from album to album!
Current bands, no idea, so I'd like to know this as well. I see the 'same again' trend also with Muse, one of the biggest rock bands in the world. Heard them playing quite a bit of their latest on TV a few weeks ago. Same bombastic sound, same 'conspiracy theory' lyrical conceits. Nothing new there IMHO.
Last edited by JJ88; 07-05-2015 at 02:25 PM.
I would say SB were getting formulaic around Day for Night/V (while still producing really good material), and musically Neal leaving was the best thing that could happen to them. As he was almost the sole songwriter before their sound simply had to change when completely different people took over the writing starting with Feel Euphoria. Then one of those guys (NDV) left as well, and now they have Ted Leonard contributing quite a bit. They're definitely not re-inventing the wheel but the songs are strong, and when these guys repeat themselves I think it's still more interesting than when AC/DC do it.
The first 2 Transatlantic albums are actually my favorite SB albums. Ok, I'm kidding sorta, but those 2 albums pretty much summed it all up. By then I'd had enough. I still have those albums but can't sit through them anymore. It's not a big deal. I will revisit them one of these years when I'm in a different space.
Well at the "end of the day" (pun intended) its all subjective!
I blame the Beatles. It's their fault. They set the bar so high, and spoiled us, that everything is formulaic.
For myself, I wasn't saying formulaic music is a bad thing. Sometimes the formula is used to good effect and other times not...and that's probably pretty subjective. Sometimes subconsciously being aware of what's coming next is comforting, other times it can just seem contrived or cliche. Again, probably a lot of subjectivity involved in whether certain things "work" or not.
Overall I'd have to say Zappa changed quite a bit more over his career (yes, even if we exclude the synclavier stuff) than did SB. But there's no particular reason I can think of to say one approach is inherently better or more enjoyable than the other. It's personal tastes.
<sig out of order>
Your comment is pretty truthful actually. As I mentioned in my original comment, mostly everything is formulation in the current music world and I am OK with that. I still hear a lot of albums that I like. I can't remember the last time that I heard an album by a band that truly struck me as sounding unlike anything I had heard before. There are very few stones left unturned. That said, a well written, well performed song is still pretty awesome regardless.
Kaipa, who I do enjoy, is more samey/formulaic than SB to my hears. It always amazes me how people can really hear things differently.
I would agree about Big Big Train, Steve Wilson and Echolyn. Don't know the others that well. BBT has completely transformed itself with five new members which may explain the change in sound from earlier albums. Likewise Steve has jettisoned his old Porcupine Tree band for a new line-up. Echolyn just takes its time and so perhaps they are still refining that 'sound'. Of course, five years from now we could be complaining about all of their formulaic music if they, too, don't seek new musical vistas from where they are now.
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