Bands that are only considered "prog" by "prog" fans on "prog" forums.

[Rune Blackwings]

I think maybe Knight Area would be a better example for your sig. Nightwish are more of a prog metal band.

SILENCE! Or I'll go Tarja on your ass!

[Sputnik]

I'd say that Dream Theater is considered prog by everybody else but prog fans on prog forums.

ROFLMAO!

The term "Progressive" is a Zen koan.

The only bands who were truly "progressive" were the early ones who progressed the state of rock & roll by doing things nobody else had ever done before.

All the bands who came later, who sought to be "progressive" by sounding like these early bands, were -- by definition -- not progressive. They were at best "perfective" rather than "progressive" and at worst simply imitative.

in other words, you cannot be progressive by trying to sound like a progressive band.

I hear what you're saying, but I think that's an overstatement. I think there are modern bands that fit nicely into the mold of what the commonly referenced 70s Prog bands (Symph Prog, whatever) were doing, but bring something fresh and innovative (progressive?) to the table. I also think there are many who don't, but I believe there is room for innovative approaches and quality music within the basic framework of what the Yes/Genesis/ELP/KC bands were doing.

I also don't think the apple falls so far from the tree with bands like Thinking Plague, 5UUs, UTotem, and a host of other bands of this ilk, who intentionally or not borrow heavily from the Henry Cow/RIO vocabulary developed earlier. And I think many of these modern bands are quite progressive, though perhaps not as "ground-breaking" as the earlier stuff. It's a matter of degree and what you're looking for.

If you really define "progressive" as "doing things nobody else had ever done before," you're going to quickly hit a brick wall, which in some sense is exactly what has happened. The rate of change when something is new cannot possible be sustained and expecting that kind of continued expansion within rock music is unrealistic. If you need that to maintain your interest, I guess that's fine, but you'll quickly expand beyond the frontiers of what most recognize as rock music, let alone "Progressive Rock" as it is somewhat commonly understood. And in the process, I think one will overlook a lot of enjoyable music which in its own way is progressive, even if it borrows heavily from a basic template established earlier.

Bill

[Digital_Man]

SILENCE! Or I'll go Tarja on your ass!

Yeah, whatever that means.

[2steves]

The term "Progressive" is a Zen koan.

The only bands who were truly "progressive" were the early ones who progressed the state of rock & roll by doing things nobody else had ever done before.

All the bands who came later, who sought to be "progressive" by sounding like these early bands, were -- by definition -- not progressive. They were at best "perfective" rather than "progressive" and at worst simply imitative.

in other words, you cannot be progressive by trying to sound like a progressive band.

I tend to agree with you---as i loath any band that "sounds just like Yes"----Steven Wilson is the only guy who sort of gets away with it---the other thing is the early prog musicians were very influenced by music that didn't fit into the rock and roll genre---which brought a lot to the table sound wise---later generations didn't have this musical curiosity which is why so many of them sound like other prog groups---

[Magic Mountain]

the other thing is the early prog musicians were very influenced by music that didn't fit into the rock and roll genre---which brought a lot to the table sound wise---later generations didn't have this musical curiosity which is why so many of them sound like other prog groups---

I disagree with this last statement, as I think many modern bands sound like earlier progressive rock groups on purpose because over the years many sub-genres of "progressive rock" have develop into musical styles, just like any other musical style such as, blues, post bop jazz, etc. The problem with the "progressive rock" style is that it has the adjective progressive which is oxymoronic to a established defined style.

[PeterG]

Schpelin me steak, should have been greebo not grebbo. Greebo was another slang word for Greasers, aka Rockers, who were the MC riding enemies of the Mods.

[trurl]

It really doesn't get more progressive than that.

[Trane]

Progarchives' subgenres seem more something created purely for organizational use on that particular site, rather actual naming conventions used by music fans.

there is some of that....

I suspect the people on Prog Archives alphabetize the cereals in their pantry too.

.... and some of that too!!!

[gryphs also]

What Bob said ( or asked).

[Scott Bails]

The only bands on that list that are prog are the bands that I like because if I don't like them, how could they possibly be prog?

[rcarlberg]

Schpelin me steak, should have been greebo not grebbo. Greebo was another slang word for Greasers, aka Rockers, who were the MC riding enemies of the Mods.

All I know is that Jeremy Clarkson was described by his co-hosts on Top Gear as a "yobbo" and I had to look that one up. Turns out it fits him perfectly.

[JKL2000]

5. Renaissance (whores and slatterns)
6. Klaus Schulze (atheists)

[bob_32_116]

Schpelin me steak, should have been greebo not grebbo. Greebo was another slang word for Greasers, aka Rockers, who were the MC riding enemies of the Mods.

I never heard this slang, therefore I assume it's an English thing. I did however encounter the word in a Terry Pratchett novel, in which Greebo is the name of a cat.

[rcarlberg]

It really doesn't get more progressive than that.

Progress is only progress if it moves the genre forward, if it opens up new territories other people want to explore.

Going backward into pre-literate, pre-language times -- or going backward to pre-adolescent children's vocalizations -- is not pro-, it's regressive.

[Scrotum Scissor]

When Yoko sings, she always sounds precisely like my mom - and my mom's dead.




[I'd still rather take Yoko's voice over Roineal's. though]

[PeterG]

I'd say that Dream Theater is considered prog by everybody else but prog fans on prog forums.

You must be joking. The opposite is true in my experience, i have never met anyone in real world at dozens of metal gigs and festivals who considered DT to be anything other than a metal band. PE and other prog forums on the other hand see them as a prog band first, metal second.

[Sputnik]

Progress is only progress if it moves the genre forward, if it opens up new territories other people want to explore.

Going backward into pre-literate, pre-language times -- or going backward to pre-adolescent children's vocalizations -- is not pro-, it's regressive.

Are you serious? Exploring "primitavist" or ancient art forms and incorporating them into new creations has been a huge source of artistic progression in music and visual arts. I'm not arguing that Yoko Ono is the greatest example of that, but often going backwards is exactly the way to go forward and there are countless examples of this.

Bill

[Lopez]

Are you serious? Exploring "primitavist" or ancient art forms and incorporating them into new creations has been a huge source of artistic progression in music and visual arts. I'm not arguing that Yoko Ono is the greatest example of that, but often going backwards is exactly the way to go forward and there are countless examples of this.

Precisely! All art is additive.

[Rune Blackwings]

Yeah, whatever that means.

I'm not sure myself, but I have always thought Tarja and now Floor looked like they could tear your jaw off if they got pissed. In fact, I secretly suspect Floor is an amazon.

If I said I would go Annette on your ass, it would mean I am wandering off to bitch and moan and cry...

[moecurlythanu]

If I said I would go Annette on your ass, it would mean I am wandering off to bitch and moan and cry...

That's ok. Annette could really stuff a wild bikini.

[Jerjo]

There are also a handful of the supposedly "classic" rock acts that get posts on the main page and rarely get screams to move them to OT: Beatles, Sabbath, the Who, Zeppelin, Steely Dan...

[Staun]

Again, man's attempt to define prog. I watch Kung Fu but wasn't there an episode when Cain asked what prog was and almost run from the order?

[miamiscot]

I really like Supertramp but I never considered them Prog until I started checking out the various "prog" sites and apparently they are. Who knew?

See above for my thoughts on Miles Davis.

And Wishbone Ash.

[JKL2000]

Every band's first album was prog.

[Zeuhlmate]

It really doesn't get more progressive than that.

Thank you !