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Thread: Borrowing or Coincidence?

  1. #1
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    Borrowing or Coincidence?

    Please listen to this, folks

    Then try this since 6:13

    What do you think?

  2. #2
    Member No Pride's Avatar
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    Yep; even in the same key! Could be a coincidence, but I wouldn't place a bet on it.

    Not quite as blatant, but do you think Extreme heard this:


    ... before coming up with this?

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    Member davis's Avatar
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    I can't speak for Hannibal, but that song Manfred Mann recorded was written by Bob Dylan. it's completely reworked and a lot longer than the original. I like it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by No Pride View Post
    Yep; even in the same key! Could be a coincidence, but I wouldn't place a bet on it.

    Not quite as blatant, but do you think Extreme heard this:


    ... before coming up with this?
    Yea of course I do believe people from Extreme have heard LLDOB, and their song was heavily inspired by Genesis song, it's quite obvious for me.

  5. #5
    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Musical borrowing goes on all the time, there are only eight notes in the scale and the last original tune was written in 1974. Everything since then is either a cover or a revision.

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    Quote Originally Posted by davis View Post
    I can't speak for Hannibal, but that song Manfred Mann recorded was written by Bob Dylan. it's completely reworked and a lot longer than the original. I like it.
    I believe Hannibal did their own thing, - hadn't heard that theme from anyone but them. And this comes from a 1970 record, Hannibal's only album. Solar Fire, if I'm not mistaken, was released in '73, - so we can hear the Dylan's song consists not only of Dylan's music I do not blame Mann, but I suspect he borrowed that riff from Hannibal - nothing unusual, except no cries for justice from Hannibal's heirs after all these years))

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    Member No Pride's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    there are only eight notes in the scale
    There are 8 notes in the diminished scale (otherwise known as the half step/whole step scale); the more commonly used scales have 7 (or less). Sorry to pick your nits.
    Last edited by No Pride; 01-28-2015 at 03:26 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Musical borrowing goes on all the time, there are only eight notes in the scale and the last original tune was written in 1974. Everything since then is either a cover or a revision.
    Agree, goes all the time, but not just because of eight notes in the scale - there must be some deeper reasons)
    What was the last original tune, enlighten me please. I would not tell nobody.

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    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grego View Post
    What was the last original tune, enlighten me please.
    I forget which title the scientific paper I read determined was the last original tune, but I seem to recall it was something by Sparks.

  10. #10
    Oh No! Bass Solo! klothos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Musical borrowing goes on all the time, there are only eight notes in the scale and the last original tune was written in 1974. Everything since then is either a cover or a revision.
    Quote Originally Posted by No Pride View Post
    There are 8 notes in the diminished scale (otherwise known as the half step/whole step scale); the more commonly used scales have 7 (or less). Sorry to pick your nits.
    Sorry to pick both your nits: There are 12 Total Notes to use within Western Music's spectrum....My goodness, music would be SO boring if we just stuck with the 7 notes for the sake of Diatonic perfection - Modes like Harmonic Minor would never exist if we decided to stick with just the 7 Diatonic notes within the Major scale and Classical Music would never have Pagnini.........

    Still, at 12 notes, there are bound to be redundancies .............

    I also attribute the subconscience: Having heard a piece of music with a "hook" firmly imbedded into the listener, that listener evolves into a musician and recalls that "hook" and crafts it as his/her own, even if the source had long been forgotten
    Last edited by klothos; 01-30-2015 at 10:40 AM.

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    Member No Pride's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by klothos View Post
    My goodness, music would be SO boring if we just stuck with the 7 notes for the sake of Diatonic perfection......
    That's your opinion... and it's mine too. But there's a whole lot of people out there that disagree, because the overwhelming majority of contemporary pop music IS diatonic.

  12. #12
    Oh No! Bass Solo! klothos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by No Pride View Post
    That's your opinion... and it's mine too. But there's a whole lot of people out there that disagree, because the overwhelming majority of contemporary pop music IS diatonic.
    Im not debating personal taste - Im just stating that there are 12 Notes, not 7, to use in songwriting as a statement of fact....Weather or not the songwriter's chooses to use all those notes is their choice but doesnt take away the fact that there are 12 notes, not 7, at their disposal

    ....besides, if they didnt use just those 7 notes, modern songwriters would all have to throw away their beloved Auto-Tunes

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