Thread: The Audiophile Thread

  1. #1951
    Member Firth's Avatar
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    As far as those ELACs are concerned, a very good value, however to get the sound quality they can deliver as a 4 ohm speaker, a powered subwoofer and possibly a very good amp with power MOSFET outputs or maybe tubes are necessary.
    “[They] agreed that it was neither possible nor necessary to educate people who never questioned anything.”

  2. #1952
    Quote Originally Posted by Firth View Post
    Have you heard the ELAC Uni-Fi UF5 Floorstanding Speakers? https://hometheaterreview.com/elac-u...kers-reviewed/
    I've heard them about half a dozen times!

    For $1000 the pair, saying they are a steal, is an understatement.

    All the ELAC's are a bargain, in any price range. Andrew Jones is great speaker designer, for sure.
    And if there were a god, I think it very unlikely that he would have such an uneasy vanity as to be offended by those who doubt His existence - Russell

  3. #1953
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    Quote Originally Posted by simon moon View Post
    While 6 figure cables do tend to make the audiophile hobby look a bit silly, understand, that those kinds of products are the exception, not the norm.

    The vast majority of audiophile products, while arguably more expensive than they have to be, are based on solid technology. People tend to find companies making 'magic' wood blocks, or 'magic' stones, and then paint the entire audiophile industry with the same 'woo' broad brush.

    As a member of the Los Angeles and Orange County Audio Society, with several thousand members, I have had pretty extensive experience hearing systems from moderate price ranges, up through the extreme high end/high priced. And I can tell you, the kind of detail, dynamics, scale, harmonic accuracy, imaging and soundstaging that some of those extreme high end systems are capable of, is pretty astonishing.

    I've heard systems playing classical at full fortissimo, without strain or dynamic compression, where a triangle at the back of the orchestra can be heard as clear as day, with proper attach and decay, despite the volume of the rest of the orchestra, and it sounds like it is coming from behind the orchestra, 30' behind the speakers, just where it should. With all the instruments in their correct places in the soundstage, from front to back, and side to side. I've heard the same system reproducing a 3d image of a singer/guitarist, sitting on a stool between the speakers, with accurate size, with details like, the sound of their fingers touching the strings, not just the sound of the notes produced by the guitar, as most systems do.

    Did the multi-thousand dollar cables connecting these systems make any difference over cables costing many times less? Probably not. But that says nothing about the actual quality of the rest of the components (amps, preamps, speakers, DAC, etc) that do make a difference.

    But here's the thing, if someone can afford products of these prices, why begrudge them their enjoyment of buying them? If they can afford ridiculously priced cables, it's not like they are going to be skimping on other aspects of their lives.

    I hardly ever see people being ridiculed for spending $200K for a car. I mean surely a $60K Corvette will be almost as much fun to drive as a $200K Ferrari, and still get one to their destination in the same amount of time. And I'll bet that many of those people here, ridiculing audiophiles for their extravagances, will be the first to ooh and ah if they see a Ferrari parked on the street.

    I can't help but think that a certain amount of this ridiculing audiophiles comes from the place of "sour grapes".
    No complaints from me...I'd have both a 500k system AND a Ferrari 488 GTB faster than I could blink.

  4. #1954
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    Out here in the sticks the compensation for a micro peen is a big pickup truck with jacked up suspension (or duals).
    I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down.'- Bob Newhart

  5. #1955
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    ^ That's what I usually think of when I think of guys covering for their teenie peenie.

  6. #1956
    Member Emeritus (A.M.P.) rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firth View Post
    Have you heard the ELAC Uni-Fi UF5 Floorstanding Speakers? https://hometheaterreview.com/elac-u...kers-reviewed/
    Quote Originally Posted by Brent Butterworth/Home Theater Review, in the above review,
    ...after hearing all of usual test tracks during Jones's visit, I was dying to put on The Red Norvo Trio featuring Tal Farlow and Charles Mingus, a classic side from the early 1950s that I found in pristine condition at a record store in L.A. for $3.... even though it's mono.
    Sorry, I found this amusing. He might as well test speakers with a cassette.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brent Butterworth
    I heard a similar sense of wraparound on Brian Eno's Ambient 1: Music for Airports. In this recording, lots of reverb is added to the piano, so it sounds pretty spacious through almost any speaker. While the reverb added a sense of depth behind the speakers, the wraparound effect I got from the UF5 made this album more involving than it would be on an average set of speakers.
    Note: this is NOT Brian Eno's "Ambient 1." I also found this amusing.

    I also think I might miss that first octave:


    Quote Originally Posted by Frith
    however to get the sound quality they can deliver ... a powered subwoofer ... [may be] necessary.
    Sounds about right.
    Last edited by rcarlberg; 02-26-2019 at 11:47 AM.

  7. #1957
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    I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down.'- Bob Newhart

  8. #1958
    Member Emeritus (A.M.P.) rcarlberg's Avatar
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    "Out of the mouths of babes..." or in this case dogs. It's the old "the emperor's not wearing any clothes" story -- it takes an innocent with no skin in the game to tell the truth.

    Still, "Bad dog! No biscuit" for making the man cry. Better to let him bask comfortably in his own delusions.

  9. #1959
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    Quote Originally Posted by chalkpie View Post
    No complaints from me...I'd have both a 500k system AND a Ferrari 488 GTB faster than I could blink.

  10. #1960
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerjo View Post
    “[They] agreed that it was neither possible nor necessary to educate people who never questioned anything.”

  11. #1961
    Picked up the Lumin D2 Streaming DAC at Axpona. Fine piece of equipment...
    "Always ready with the ray of sunshine"

  12. #1962
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    Cool!

    There's a big thread over at Hoffman on Axpona

    https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threa...report.831721/
    I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down.'- Bob Newhart

  13. #1963
    Member Emeritus (A.M.P.) rcarlberg's Avatar
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    You *do* realize the Hoffman forum is the Fox News of audio, don’t you?

  14. #1964
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    "Out of the mouths of babes..." or in this case dogs. It's the old "the emperor's not wearing any clothes" story -- it takes an innocent with no skin in the game to tell the truth.

    Still, "Bad dog! No biscuit" for making the man cry. Better to let him bask comfortably in his own delusions.
    There's that nervous twitch again.

  15. #1965
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    You *do* realize the Hoffman forum is the Fox News of audio, don’t you?
    It's just pictures/videos of an audio show - you won't get any woo on you!
    I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down.'- Bob Newhart

  16. #1966
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    Best to just block him and his rabid foolishness.
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  17. #1967
    Member Emeritus (A.M.P.) rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Bask comfortably, Bob. I know you have me blocked so you won't read this.

  18. #1968
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerjo View Post
    It's just pictures/videos of an audio show - you won't get any woo on you!
    One of the speakers featured in the photos is the KEF Muon. I just ran across this website while looking for something else.

    The KEF Muons are $225,000 a pair. They only made 100 pair.
    One of the reasons for the superlative sound quality of Muon is that it functions beyond the normal range of the sound frequency spectrum. What this means is that it reproduces sound so low or so high that the human ear cannot register it. Nonetheless, these sounds are still present, and when included in the audio mix have an enriching effect. To this extent Muon radically enhances the listener's audio experience.
    (Emphasis added)

    Normal sources don't provide subsonic or ultrasonic output. You couldn't hear it anyway if it was there. But your experience is somehow magically "radically enhanced." Eww. I got some woo on me.
    Last edited by rcarlberg; 3 Weeks Ago at 10:56 PM.

  19. #1969
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    One of the speakers featured in the photos is the KEF Muon. I just ran across this website while looking for something else.

    The KEF Muons are $225,000 a pair. They only made 100 pair.
    (Emphasis added)

    Normal sources don't provide subsonic or ultrasonic output. You couldn't hear it anyway if it was there. But your experience is somehow magically "radically enhanced." Eww. I got some woo on me.
    Salesman are idiots. Non-linear distortion can produce ultrasonic or subsonic output. A system that is linear within a significant bandwidth and dynamic range will be clearer within the audible range. Also, any company which has the blue print for great sound, won’t be communicating that info to anybody. Hence bull shit descriptions.
    “[They] agreed that it was neither possible nor necessary to educate people who never questioned anything.”

  20. #1970
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    Last year I started a search for a good 4K Blu-Ray player.......I was waiting for the new Oppo....it came out and was discontinued! Then I looked at the Cambridge......and it was discontinued.....WTH is happening? Is it the manufacturers can't compete with the cheapie models of play stations?

    I want balanced Audio outputs to go into my Jeff Rowland pre. I also have a Theta DAC processor so I could settle for a Digital out (coax) if the player doesn't have internal DAC's.

    I, like Carlberg, have a fear of getting Woo on me and the local peddler of Woo, Definitive Audio in Seattle is the only name I can think of. This place provides home theaters to employees of Starbucks, Amazon & Microsoft and I can't justify all the "zeros" they add to the price of their services. I recently received a quote of $3,500.00 to come to my home and unbolt my Stewart film Screen from the ceiling and ship it to California for repair.....that doesn't include the repair or installation!

    Any recommendations?
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  21. #1971
    Member Emeritus (A.M.P.) rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garyhead View Post
    I want balanced Audio outputs to go into my Jeff Rowland pre. I also have a Theta DAC processor so I could settle for a Digital out (coax) if the player doesn't have internal DAC's.
    My new CD player has all three outputs: balanced analog, optical digital and co-axial digital.

    I very carefully A-B'ed them (I guess it was A-B-C'ed?) and came to the following conclusions:
    1. The digital outputs have slightly higher gain than the analog, so adjusting the volume is required for direct comparison
    2. Both digital outputs sounded identical (as they should)
    3. The digital output has a crisper low end, and less cluttered/better defined low midrange (200-1000Hz)
    4. The analog output has a slightly crisper -- and louder -- high end (5,000 Hz and up)


    So it's basically a tossup. The differences are exceedingly subtle -- I couldn't tell you which one I was listening to without switching between them -- and all three sound fine to my ears.

    BTW, Definitive have been woo merchants since the 1970s. I know people who shop there. They get fleeced.

    On Amazon, there are lots of OPPO UDP-203's for sale, ranging from $1000 to $1800, if you don't mind buying an orphaned product. Frankly, for less than $400 you can get a full-featured highly rated Samsung which seems like a much better deal to me.
    Last edited by rcarlberg; 2 Weeks Ago at 12:29 PM.

  22. #1972
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    I am very, very late to this thread, but thought I'd contribute in a very small fashion. Most of my Hi-Fi stuff is presently in storage in the UK, and I look forward to the day I'll be able to retrieve it. I'm not sure how much of this stuff counts as 'audiophile' equipment, but it sounds pretty bloody good to me. Most was bought secondhand and accumulated over a number of years:

    Sansui SR-212 turntable (currently using Audio-Technica cartridge, but this will be upgraded to an Ortofon Gold when I get back to the UK full-time)
    Marantz CD-63 II KI Signature cd player
    Beresford TC-7510 external DAC
    Matsui DA-1 DAB Tuner (tiny and an absolute bargain. Given I only ever listen to BBC Radio 4, which is all spoken word, this is perfect for me.)
    Aiwa ADF-450 Cassette deck
    Arcam Alpha 7 (used as a pre-amp)
    Quad 303 Power amp
    Heybrook HB3 Series 2 speakers
    Sony RDR HXD870 DVD Recorder + hard drive
    Panasonic DMP BD84 region-free Blu-Ray Player.
    Samsung 40" LCD TV (forget the model)

  23. #1973
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garyhead View Post
    Last year I started a search for a good 4K Blu-Ray player.......I was waiting for the new Oppo....it came out and was discontinued! Then I looked at the Cambridge......and it was discontinued.....WTH is happening? Is it the manufacturers can't compete with the cheapie models of play stations?

    I want balanced Audio outputs to go into my Jeff Rowland pre. I also have a Theta DAC processor so I could settle for a Digital out (coax) if the player doesn't have internal DAC's.

    I, like Carlberg, have a fear of getting Woo on me and the local peddler of Woo, Definitive Audio in Seattle is the only name I can think of. This place provides home theaters to employees of Starbucks, Amazon & Microsoft and I can't justify all the "zeros" they add to the price of their services. I recently received a quote of $3,500.00 to come to my home and unbolt my Stewart film Screen from the ceiling and ship it to California for repair.....that doesn't include the repair or installation!

    Any recommendations?
    Why have analog outs. Keep it modular and architect the analog audio via a DAC. Buy the Sony UBP 700, every format the Oppo handled. The UPB has a separate HDMI for audio. Of course let you TV do the video processing.
    https://www.whathifi.com/sony/ubp-x700/review
    “[They] agreed that it was neither possible nor necessary to educate people who never questioned anything.”

  24. #1974
    If you want to do a little early Christmas shopping.

    https://www.octaneseating.com/most-e...eater-speakers
    NEVER UNDERESTIMATE THE POWER OF STUPID PEOPLE IN LARGE GROUPS!

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