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Thread: The Audiophile Thread

  1. #1051
    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Staun View Post
    What seems to be a good distance for speaker separation meaning left and right. I'm sure room size and how close you sit will have something to do with the answer. Also, if a cabinet is in between the speakers, how far in front of this cabinet should the speakers be placed?

    Everything else depends on room size.

    And personal preference.

  2. #1052
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post

    Everything else depends on room size.

    And personal preference.
    Note in that picture the center channel is not equidistant from the listener in the center. No matter where you place the speakers, it ain't gonna be optimal for surround without calibration for delay and amplitude. My system goes a step further and adjusts eq for each speaker individually.
    Im not giving in an inch to fear David Crosby

  3. #1053
    There are differing opinions on proper surround placement for movies and for music. For music afaik the accepted positioning equates to placing the speakers on the radius of a circle, all equidistant to the listener. The surround setup for movies and effects usually has speakers just behind and to the side of the listener and directly behind facing forward- a box as opposed to a circle.

  4. #1054
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    Quote Originally Posted by trurl View Post
    There are differing opinions on proper surround placement for movies and for music. For music afaik the accepted positioning equates to placing the speakers on the radius of a circle, all equidistant to the listener. The surround setup for movies and effects usually has speakers just behind and to the side of the listener and directly behind facing forward- a box as opposed to a circle.
    I disagree, with proper calibration it doesn't matter. Most movie theatres have speakers in front and on the sides of the listener.
    Im not giving in an inch to fear David Crosby

  5. #1055
    cunning linguist 3LockBox's Avatar
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    I've never lived in a house where I had a room conducive to an optimal surround setup.

  6. #1056
    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 3LockBox View Post
    I've never lived in a house where I had a room conducive to an optimal surround setup.
    This was a prime requirement, a deal-breaker, when I bought my present place 22 years ago this week.

  7. #1057
    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Note: suspenders are REQUIRED with this arrangement.

  8. #1058
    Member Jerjo's Avatar
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    What kind of room would be most conductive to an audio setup? One of these years I'm going to get the basement in shape and...
    I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down.'- Bob Newhart

  9. #1059
    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Ideal room configuration (IMO):
    • 9' or 10' ceilings
    • Minimum 15' deep x 20' wide
    • Carpeting
    • Adjustable acoustics on wall -- not just sheetrock or cement
    • Minimal reflective surfaces (windows)
    • Lots of outlets(! - no matter how many I've added I always need more)
    • A comfortable chair and a warm dog (or cat -- your preference)
    • I have a cement slab -- next time I would go for raised wooden floor
    Last edited by rcarlberg; 09-29-2015 at 02:23 PM.

  10. #1060
    Member rottersclub's Avatar
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    There is something called the Golden Ratio that may or may not yield superior acoustics (surprise, surprise - there is some heated debate on this).

    Another thing to consider in terms of treatments - don't forget to treat the ceiling as you would the floor and walls. It too will have reflection points and the corners ought to be treated.

    Some folks think that the room should not have any 90 angles. A hard-core guy I know uses a room that has six or eight walls (can't remember) so as to reduce those dreaded "standing waves". It's the same principle was speaker manufacturers that eschew boxes with right angles. I think he has 4 dedicated electrical circuits running into the room - 2 for each monoblock, one for his sources and the fourth I think he used for his custom built music server.
    Think of a book as a vase, and a movie as the stained-glass window that the filmmaker has made out of the pieces after hes smashed it with a hammer.
    -- Russell Banks (paraphrased)

  11. #1061
    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Sound-absorbing baffles do the same thing -- and they're a lot cheaper.

    Also, a completely dead (anechoic) room sounds terrible, if you've ever been in one. There's a balance.

  12. #1062
    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Sound-absorbing baffles do the same thing -- and they're a lot cheaper.

    Also, a completely dead (anechoic) room sounds terrible, if you've ever been in one. There's a balance.
    Yeah, that's what I was going to say- a really dead room generally doesn't sound good at all, but you want your room to interact with your system in a positive way. It's needs to seem neutral but not really be. It's a tough balance. What you generally really don't want a very bright, very short slap-back effects, so you want to keep bright surfaces (hard wood, concrete) under control.

  13. #1063
    Member Staun's Avatar
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    Well Stan, I'm still a four wall holdover. Besides speaker design, how do you rid yourself of those terrible standing waves. I don't seem to have any now but, a bigger room may become avaliable if I can call up the energy to clean it out. What are the simple things I should look for?
    The older I get, the better I was.

  14. #1064
    Member rottersclub's Avatar
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    Staun, I'm sure the vast majority of us have 4 square rooms. Like I said, the guy I cited is hard-core and has lots of $$$ to afford this high-end nonsense.

    Like the others have said, it's a delicate balance in removing reflections and room modes (dips/suckouts and peaks) and not deadening the room to the point where there's no life in the music. Most of us have multipurpose rooms that are not treated with acoustic panels, bass traps, etc. There is a ton of information available about ways to go about setting up your room for better sound.
    Think of a book as a vase, and a movie as the stained-glass window that the filmmaker has made out of the pieces after hes smashed it with a hammer.
    -- Russell Banks (paraphrased)

  15. #1065
    Non-parallel walls and heavy treatment is the kind of thing usually relegated to studio control rooms, an environment for creating mixes, not enjoying them. Obviously if your room has serious problems you need to treat but I'm not sure a good listening room has to be sterile.

  16. #1066
    Member Firth's Avatar
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    Abbey Road Studios[emoji57]
    Im not giving in an inch to fear David Crosby

  17. #1067
    Member Staun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rottersclub View Post
    Staun, I'm sure the vast majority of us have 4 square rooms. Like I said, the guy I cited is hard-core and has lots of $$$ to afford this high-end nonsense.

    Like the others have said, it's a delicate balance in removing reflections and room modes (dips/suckouts and peaks) and not deadening the room to the point where there's no life in the music. Most of us have multipurpose rooms that are not treated with acoustic panels, bass traps, etc. There is a ton of information available about ways to go about setting up your room for better sound.
    Thanks Stan, I did forget to mention that it will be a dedicated room. Starting off on the right foot will give better results in the end. Kind of excited about this as I can now go in with a certain thought process and not just setting things up against a wall, putting in some chairs and calling it a day. Man, what happened to the old days when none of this stuff matter?
    The older I get, the better I was.

  18. #1068
    I'd love to find an audio guy to visit my "room" and evaluate it professionally. I recently (last year) remodeled it, extending the depth of the listening area by removing closets, and covered some duct work. I've got the "wall" of vinyl opposite the my speakers, which makes for good absorption, and the couch is in the sweet spot, inside that "golden triangle". Only real downside (other than square walls) is that the ceiling is about 7'.

    I can say that the new Parasound gear I recently purchased was a superb upgrade, and they seem very well matched for my speakers (PSB Synchrony bookshelf). Lot more depth to the music, wider sound stage, cliche perhaps, but the sound in the room transcends the speakers. Plus the home theatre bypass is fantastic.

    And my wife didn't divorce me when I brought it all home!
    "Always ready with the ray of sunshine"

  19. #1069
    Member Staun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by strawberrybrick View Post

    And my wife didn't divorce me when I brought it all home!
    I get the, "You and all your music stuff. Why can't you just have an Ipod like me?", look. I think if I stay out of the way and keep my head down, I'll be safe for a little while at least.
    The older I get, the better I was.

  20. #1070
    Member rottersclub's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by strawberrybrick View Post
    I'd love to find an audio guy to visit my "room" and evaluate it professionally. I recently (last year) remodeled it, extending the depth of the listening area by removing closets, and covered some duct work. I've got the "wall" of vinyl opposite the my speakers, which makes for good absorption, and the couch is in the sweet spot, inside that "golden triangle". Only real downside (other than square walls) is that the ceiling is about 7'.

    I can say that the new Parasound gear I recently purchased was a superb upgrade, and they seem very well matched for my speakers (PSB Synchrony bookshelf). Lot more depth to the music, wider sound stage, cliche perhaps, but the sound in the room transcends the speakers. Plus the home theatre bypass is fantastic.

    And my wife didn't divorce me when I brought it all home!
    Great to hear that you like the Parasound gear.

    There is a guy named Jim Smith who advertises in Stereophile. He has a book and a DVD called "Get Better Sound". He does home visits, but I would expect it be a very costly service. Maybe the book and/or DVDs would be a good start. I have never read or seen either, so please don't ream me out if it's garbage.
    Think of a book as a vase, and a movie as the stained-glass window that the filmmaker has made out of the pieces after hes smashed it with a hammer.
    -- Russell Banks (paraphrased)

  21. #1071
    Member Jerjo's Avatar
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    Found this on YouTube - there's also some seven part series by some dude with an insane amount of money

    I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down.'- Bob Newhart

  22. #1072
    Quote Originally Posted by Staun View Post
    I get the, "You and all your music stuff. Why can't you just have an Ipod like me?", look. I think if I stay out of the way and keep my head down, I'll be safe for a little while at least.
    My nominal excuse is "it keeps me at home and out of the bars, dear".... (runs down to the basement) ...
    "Always ready with the ray of sunshine"

  23. #1073
    Member rcarlberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by strawberrybrick View Post
    My nominal excuse is "it keeps me at home and out of the bars, dear".... (runs down to the basement) ...
    Does that work for you?

    My wife keeps telling me it'd be cheaper if I was a drunk.

  24. #1074
    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Does that work for you?

    My wife keeps telling me it'd be cheaper if I was a drunk.
    Alas, I am not a cheap drunk!
    "Always ready with the ray of sunshine"

  25. #1075
    Member Jerjo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by strawberrybrick View Post
    Alas, I am not a cheap drunk!
    Are you in the single malt PM?
    I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down.'- Bob Newhart

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