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Thread: The Audiophile Thread

  1. #3151
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    Quote Originally Posted by 3LockBox View Post
    The settlement doesn't address the pain and suffering by golden eared audiophiles who've been outted as not being to tell the difference.
    Not just that, as amusing as that has been.

    One can't defend MoFi in this and they may pay a heavy price for their duplicity. I have sympathy for those who merely bought these records in good faith, with no agenda. But then you read about others whose main worry is their collections now being 'devalued' and well, that's more like stocks/shares trading and little to do with music.

  2. #3152
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow View Post
    He made this a more interesting thread.
    Yes it's a real shame. A main contributor banned after so many years and for what? Ridiculous. He should be reinstated.

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    cunning linguist 3LockBox's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JJ88 View Post
    Not just that, as amusing as that has been.

    One can't defend MoFi in this and they may pay a heavy price for their duplicity. I have sympathy for those who merely bought these records in good faith, with no agenda. But then you read about others whose main worry is their collections now being 'devalued' and well, that's more like stocks/shares trading and little to do with music.
    Yes, the collectors. I don't feel sorry for those guys. I'm sure that what they do have are the finest mastered vinyl media that one could expect in the modern era, just not the exclusivity and scarcity they desired.

  4. #3154
    Member Mr.Krautman's Avatar
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    MoFi were caught and lost the case because they made some specific advertising statements which were found to be misleading, deceitul and/or false. Other "audiophile" vinyl producers are much more careful and avoid some specific or too descriptive technical terms in their ads which could be legally binding.
    But it must be remembered that 80% (or more) of the currently produced vinyls (audiophile or not) came from a digital(ized) source master anyway.
    A local friend of mine who has a disc cutting service recently told me that less than 20% of his clients are supplying an analog master (source), all the others are in the form of some digital files. His two STUDER (analog) tape reproducers are waiting there most of the time with their protective dust covers fitted.
    Now, all "audiophile vinyl lovers" please tell me how a digital(ized) audio source could be "improved" by transferring it to a next generation mechanical support. Best of both worlds ? Hard to believe...

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    Before the turntable I used this fall went tits up I was enjoying spinning some new vinyl. It's all nostalgia for me. Hearing old rock on vinyl sends me back to my youth. That's it. I don't have a lot of sympathy for those who bought "audiophile" recordings simply for the supposed value. Other than that, there's some vinyl that sounds better than CDs and there's CDs that sound better than vinyl. Just depends on how the recording and the medium was handled.
    I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down.'- Bob Newhart

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    cunning linguist 3LockBox's Avatar
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    I've said it before, in the audio hobby, it's ok to keep a harem. You can prefer whatever playback medium you wish. Hell, you can prefer cassettes if you like, just don't feel compelled to cite pseudo-scientific jargon or fake rationale to justify one or the other. Listen to music, not gear.

  7. #3157
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Krautman View Post
    MoFi were caught and lost the case because they made some specific advertising statements which were found to be misleading, deceitul and/or false. Other "audiophile" vinyl producers are much more careful and avoid some specific or too descriptive technical terms in their ads which could be legally binding.
    But it must be remembered that 80% (or more) of the currently produced vinyls (audiophile or not) came from a digital(ized) source master anyway.
    A local friend of mine who has a disc cutting service recently told me that less than 20% of his clients are supplying an analog master (source), all the others are in the form of some digital files.
    I can definitely believe this and am waiting for the next domino to fall.

  8. #3158
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Krautman View Post
    MoFi were caught and lost the case because they made some specific advertising statements which were found to be misleading, deceitul and/or false. Other "audiophile" vinyl producers are much more careful and avoid some specific or too descriptive technical terms in their ads which could be legally binding.
    But it must be remembered that 80% (or more) of the currently produced vinyls (audiophile or not) came from a digital(ized) source master anyway.
    A local friend of mine who has a disc cutting service recently told me that less than 20% of his clients are supplying an analog master (source), all the others are in the form of some digital files. His two STUDER (analog) tape reproducers are waiting there most of the time with their protective dust covers fitted.
    Now, all "audiophile vinyl lovers" please tell me how a digital(ized) audio source could be "improved" by transferring it to a next generation mechanical support. Best of both worlds ? Hard to believe...
    Modern vinyl records are cut from Hi-Res digital sources. Pretty much every modern recording starts out Hi-Res, and is downsampled to 16/44.1 for CD production. In the 80s when most multitrack digital recorders were 16/44.1, in most cases the multitrack digital source was still mixed and mastered to analog for vinyl. I can name the records in my collection which were direct transfers from the 16/44.1 CD master. Sounding exactly like the CD, with the added bonus of surface noise. Kansas Power, Yes Big Generator, Peter Hammill Skin, and Jerry Goodman Arial. I'm sure there are a couple more I can't remember right off hand.
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    Parrots Ripped My Flesh Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
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    I think my only MoFi purchase was this one that I got second-hand for not a whole lot of money, and it was obviated by the rerelease that included the DVD with Jarre and a few pals playing the material live in the studio.

    I find the Mo-Fi packaging style to be overly intrusive and detracts from the original artwork.
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    I made a copy of a friend's MFSL's take on Quadrophenia CDs. I'll give 'em this, it sounded better than the original and way, way better than the Astley remix decades later.
    I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down.'- Bob Newhart

  11. #3161
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    I don't think there's any issue with the MoFi CDs as there's no deception involved- obviously there is a digital step with the transfer to CD! I have the old Polydor CD of that album for the original mix.

    That said, I've read anecdotally (as I don't own them) about the packaging of MoFi's CDs sometimes causing disc centre-cracks. They used a liftable tray to put the discs on, instead of the flat tray which most jewel case CDs have.

  12. #3162
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    MOFI is a MOFO. If they were truly honest, the format would have been hybrid SACD, with DSD and CD layers. Disc plays in either an SACD player or a CD. And if people cared about quality they would have bought an SACD player to to play their MOFI SACDs on.
    Last edited by Firth; 05-15-2023 at 06:38 PM.

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    Parrots Ripped My Flesh Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
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    I examined my Jarre MOFI and it doesn't carry any claims about sound quality or mastering at all.

    It's a gold-colored disc and when you open the jewel case a little arm pushes the hub forward and makes the disc easier to remove, but I find it trickier to put back.

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    Major smokin' deal: yesterday I found a Teac 3 head cassette deck. In brand new condition, likely because it sat in its original box through most of its existence. It had an easily repairable issue. The belt for the mechanism which engages play, fast forward, rewind, and eject had gelatinized. I temporarily replaced it with 2 rubber bands, while waiting for the proper belt to ship from ebay. It works great and sounds awesome. Here's the kicker: because they couldn't even open the door to test it, the store sold it for $99. And because Zia Records is holding their customer appreciation all weekend, they took an additional 20% off that price. 20% off all used items storewide.

    For those who don't know why 3 head tape decks sound better than 2 head decks: tape recording is higher quality with a wider tape head gap. Playback is higher quality with a narrower gap. In any 2 head machine, of which the vast majority of cassette decks are, the combination record/playback head has a compromise gap. Right in between what would be optimal for each separate function.
    "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama

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    Quote Originally Posted by progmatist View Post
    Major smokin' deal: yesterday I found a Teac 3 head cassette deck. In brand new condition, likely because it sat in its original box through most of its existence. It had an easily repairable issue. The belt for the mechanism which engages play, fast forward, rewind, and eject had gelatinized. I temporarily replaced it with 2 rubber bands, while waiting for the proper belt to ship from ebay. It works great and sounds awesome. Here's the kicker: because they couldn't even open the door to test it, the store sold it for $99. And because Zia Records is holding their customer appreciation all weekend, they took an additional 20% off that price. 20% off all used items storewide.

    For those who don't know why 3 head tape decks sound better than 2 head decks: tape recording is higher quality with a wider tape head gap. Playback is higher quality with a narrower gap. In any 2 head machine, of which the vast majority of cassette decks are, the combination record/playback head has a compromise gap. Right in between what would be optimal for each separate function.
    Do you have any premium type 2 blanks, like Maxell XL-II S 100s?

  17. #3167
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    ^^ I have some normal, chrome, and metal blank tapes stashed away somewhere. I plan on using the deck mainly for playing my large collection of prerecorded cassettes. Which I still have from back in the day.
    "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama

  18. #3168
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    Of course, you DO realize that "prerecorded cassettes" are dubbed on high-speed duplicators and thus have pretty weak sound quality? Home-recorded cassettes, done on a quality deck like yours, can sound quite fine (as evidenced by the number of modern releases sourced from cassette) but commercial cassettes are mostly pretty execrable.

  19. #3169
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Of course, you DO realize that "prerecorded cassettes" are dubbed on high-speed duplicators and thus have pretty weak sound quality? Home-recorded cassettes, done on a quality deck like yours, can sound quite fine (as evidenced by the number of modern releases sourced from cassette) but commercial cassettes are mostly pretty execrable.
    Less so starting in the 80s, when quality improved. Many titles using chrome tape.
    "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama

  20. #3170
    cunning linguist 3LockBox's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcarlberg View Post
    Of course, you DO realize that "prerecorded cassettes" are dubbed on high-speed duplicators and thus have pretty weak sound quality? Home-recorded cassettes, done on a quality deck like yours, can sound quite fine (as evidenced by the number of modern releases sourced from cassette) but commercial cassettes are mostly pretty execrable.
    Howdy.

    A buddy of mine demonstrated that to me back in the 80s. I just picked up the newly released Nothing Like The Sun by Sting on cassette. I had a great sound system in my car (Nakamichi TD 500). But I was underwhelmed by the sound quality of the cassette. My buddy looked at it and said, "wow, that's really dark tape for a type-1. Can I borrow this?" I said sure. A few days later he gave it back and said, "listen to it now". I popped it in my deck and it sounded amazing. He actually re-recorded it on his home deck (I forget the brand) straight from his CD, no EQ, with Dolby C. He said it was good quality normal position tape but he was positive it had been high-speed dubbed by the manufacturer. It was probably the last time I bought a pre-recorded cassette. I went out and bought a home stereo within a few weeks of that.

  21. #3171
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    I've still got my old Nakamichi cassette deck in bubble wrap. I got rid of my old tapes about 5 years ago, but kept the deck. I really don't know why. Anyone looking for one?
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  22. #3172
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    Quote Originally Posted by BobM View Post
    I've still got my old Nakamichi cassette deck in bubble wrap. I got rid of my old tapes about 5 years ago, but kept the deck. I really don't know why. Anyone looking for one?
    Yes b/c I have to transfer my old shows from stereo soundboard Cassettes

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    Back when I worked in an audio store in 1990, I made a TON of cassettes of fellow employees CDs. I've still got a hundred or so. I've sorted through them and the keepers are either music I can't track down (OOP) or some really good compilations. I hooked up an ancient JVC deck to a boombox bought a decade ago in the basement. Perfect for working in the basement. Someday, when I get flush enough to revamp the upstairs system, I'll get a decent deck so those old tapes can be heard in a better environment.
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  24. #3174
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    Quote Originally Posted by BobM View Post
    I've still got my old Nakamichi cassette deck in bubble wrap. I got rid of my old tapes about 5 years ago, but kept the deck. I really don't know why. Anyone looking for one?
    I'd recommend test playing a tape before selling the deck. Belts tend to deteriorate, particularly when a machine sits unused. A customer finding it doesn't work would be very upset.
    "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"--Dalai Lama

  25. #3175
    cunning linguist 3LockBox's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by progmatist View Post
    I'd recommend test playing a tape before selling the deck. Belts tend to deteriorate, particularly when a machine sits unused. A customer finding it doesn't work would be very upset.
    Well, a Nak would be be worth paying someone to service it, that's for sure.

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