Musings on Genesis Revisited II

[Progatron]

Finally got the chance to properly sit down with this beast last night and now tonight again. Here are some random thoughts.

Thought the first: The accompanying artwork for some of the tracks is outstanding - I mean, I really love it. (side note: the booklet smells amazing - I'm one of those freaks who loves the smell of cd booklets)

Thought the second: "Entangled" sounds great but it is just too jarring for me that the crunch of "Squonk" does not immediately follow. Those two tracks for me are like "Heartbreaker/Livin' Lovin' Maid" or "We Will Rock You/We Are The Champions". What's worse is the intro to the usually excellent song "Eleventh Earl Of Mar" (which is what does follow) sounds painfully lifeless here. The song improves as it goes on but overall lacks the oomph of the original. The weakest moment of the album for me.

Thought the third: (is that getting pretentious yet?) I adore "Shadow Of The Hierophant" and I'm so pleased Steve has resurrected it in recent years (live DVD with Steven Wilson joining in, etc.) - I'll take any version I can of this stone-cold classic. I really like how Steve mixed in a few of his own Genesis-like tracks with this collection, it really works well IMO. I had no idea this was partially rehearsed as far back as Foxtrot.

Thought the fourth: I love how Steve used his 'police siren' guitar wails from the High Voltage festival appearance in "Hogweed". And I do like Neal Morse a lot, he has obvious fun singing this track (nice to have Stolt there as well but I kinda miss Portnoy's thunderous drums at the end section).

Thought the (firth of) fifth: Is it just my player acting funny, or do the tracks that flow together (Windshield/Broadway Melody and Unquiet Slumbers/Quiet Earth/Afterglow) have a two-second gap? Ugh.

Thought the sixth: Overall I was more pleased with this than I thought I would be. I've heard that Mike Rutherford made some disparaging remarks regarding this release but I have yet to actually see those for myself. If it's true, that's not cool - there's absolutely nothing wrong with ONE ex-member showing a fondness for the past. I had originally heard comments about how the tracks were largely 'carbon copies' - and while that's true to a point, they still sound great and are treated with love and respect. In some ways it was like listening to the Genesis songs in a particularly arranged playlist. In some ways.

Edit - Additional thought (the minor seventh): As much as I truly enjoy this release, make no mistake - there ain't no replacing the original guys, most notably in this case Phil.

[UnephenStephen]

from the samples i heard, didn't like the singing at all. maybe it's just being used to Peter/Phil but the voice on here just didn't fit. was it Steve who was singing?

[Progatron]

from the samples i heard, didn't like the singing at all. maybe it's just being used to Peter/Phil but the voice on here just didn't fit. was it Steve who was singing?

Many different singers throughout the album. Rarely Steve himself (save for "Willow Farm"!).

[jkelman]

I'm really liking it, overall, and think a couple of things particularly stand out, most notably Nik Kershaw's vocal turn on The Lamia; man, that guy's voice is still sweet. I know he was largely pop in the day, but even then, his voice was tremendous (and he's actually a kickass guitarist too).

I love Jakko Jakszyk's turn on Entangled, also, as I think he brings (like Kershaw) something very different to it, even if the lines he sings are pretty faithful. Both singers have qualities so different from Gabriel and that's why I think I like them so much . Nad is great, no doubt, but a little too Gabriel-esque and, while that isn't necessarily a bad thing, it means too much grist for comparison, whereas you can take Kershaw and Jakszyk on their own merits much more easily (but I do love ya, Nad, so not to worry!). Steven Wilson's also solid on Can-Utility, though I do think that Nik and Jakko have more emotive voices, at least in this context.

While a lot of the music is literal in arrangement, not necessarily so in the playing, and I think the opportunity Hackett took to sonically upgrade a few tracks was good. I also am ok with him adjusting the balance a little differently, putting keyboards a little farther down in the mix at times, and boosting the guitar. As much as he was a key player in the group, I always felt, but especially with The Lamb forward, that he was given a little too short shrift. Sometimes, here, it works, sometimes not so much, but that's fine.

And opening with Chamber of 32 Doors was a ballsy move, and one that, for me, really worked well.

And song selection? Fantastic. I give this a solid A- (since I won't be giving it a formal review).

[AncientChord]

My thoughts are mostly positive. Not all of the singers are perfect, or fit the songs as well as others, but overall IMO Steve did an excellent job of reviving the old songs to sound fresh, with new little flourishes and additions throughout. Remember, the music of the prog Genesis was nothing like what followed. The music was not easy to write or perform. I've said in the old PE site posts that it is obvious that the musicians that Steve employed for the project truly hold a lot of love in their hearts for the once great band. Since I've bought the album, I've been playing it quite a bit. Although the sound is pristine throughout, I do think on some tracks that the drums and mellotron are too buried in the mix. But that's a minor complaint. IMO I hope there will be another in the future similar like II. I'd like GR I -Watcher of the Skies to be revived, and more like II, closer to the roots of the original songs. God I'd love to hear a II version of "Watcher" and "Firth of Fifth" again. I'm really hoping that Steve might do one of those songs as a surprise for an encore at the upcoming show I'll be attending in La Mirada California. At any rate I love the new album, and am highly looking forward to the 2013 concert.

[Trane]

Is the Chamber Of 32 Doors so very close to the original one??

I heard in a friend's car the version in the latest Prog Mag's sampler CD, but it didbn't specify whether it was from Gen Rev II or Lamb (though credited to Hackett and not Genesis)... It sounded close enough to the Gabriel version (vocals incredibly Gabian), but couldn't be sure >> too much conversation going on in the car

[roddenberry]

I'm very eager to get this one, I read Hackett's description of it and sampled a few bits, need it!

i'll grab it next weekend when I go to the local HMV (I have a $50 gift certificate) and i'll also get the new live PTree album too.

Robert

[Progtopia]

Is the Chamber Of 32 Doors so very close to the original one??

Most of the tracks are pretty darned faithful to the originals. The vocalists seem to be the main sticking point for some, but personally, I'm fine with them all. I even thought the use of a female lead on "Ripples" was a nice touch.

[Richard]

The guitar at the end of The Lamia featuring Hackett along with Steve Rothery is the most amazing thing I've heard in years. My only complaint is that it doesn't extend for 10 minutes :lol I would love to hear more collaboration between my all-time 2 favorite guitarists!

[NotTheMama]

A great collection. It's amazing how much I don't miss Gabriel or Collins on this stuff. I suppose purists will have issues with the singers, but you have to wonder why folks like that buy this kind of record anyway. If there are complaints, it might be that the arrangements are a little too faithful, though I'm ok with how Hackett has done this. I have to say, Roger King nails it on keyboards. Let's be honest, Hackett is the only one of the Genesis guys who makes no apologies for this music. He deserves to inherit the repertory. I hope he tours it far and wide.

[Mr. Grizzly Bear]

Heard it myself, and, [WARNING: DISSENTING OPINION INCOMING] thought, WHY? Geez, didn't they do it right the first time? I don't know, this whole thing of exact or near exact remakes just strikes me as more than a little pointless and lame no matter how technically perfect it's executed, just this old bear's opinion. I thought the whole point of the original proggers was to create something new, not become a rigidly codified style or worse yet, a slavishly exactly nostalgia thing.

[Progtopia]

The way Steve Hackett explained it on my podcast show with him is that he felt they didn't have enough time when these songs were recorded to do them to everyone's satisfaction, so this is a way to spend the time to refine it. Even though, obviously, it can't be relived without the original members and at least somewhat close to the original time.

[Scott Bails]

A lot of complaints about the vocalists, but there are a few that were splendid, IMO, including Steven Wilson and John Wetton. I'm not sure that I'll ever warm to Nad Sylvan's voice, but he's acceptable here.

[NotTheMama]

One big problem with rock after about Sgt. Pepper is that the recording itself often (but not always) becomes the music, not allowing for much variation and/or interpretation in live performance. Fans listen to the albums and get that exact sound in their heads, often complaining when what they hear in another version doesn't exactly match what they already know. No other style of music is constrained in this way, and it's really too bad that this limitation is so prevalent. Nobody listens to jazz or classical that way.

[ca1ore]

Bought this album, as I do everything from Steve Hackett, but not sure it will stand the test of time for me. While the original versions may have been rushed and a product of available technology at the time, I have heard them so many times that no other version will sound right. I just think I will always reach for those, not these.

[firth5th]

A lot of complaints about the vocalists, but there are a few that were splendid, IMO, including Steven Wilson and John Wetton. I'm not sure that I'll ever warm to Nad Sylvan's voice, but he's acceptable here.

Wetton is good. Wilson is too emo for me, and his contribution is weak tea.

Some of the singers are not native english speakers, and it comes through in the vocal pronunciations, which doesn't sound real professional.

[jkelman]

Wetton is good. Wilson is too emo for me, and his contribution is weak tea.

Some of the singers are not native english speakers, and it comes through in the vocal pronunciations, which doesn't sound real professional.
Can't agree with you on Wilson - don't think he's weak at all. As for using folks with accents not sounding professional? Should we indict Neal Morse because he doesn't have an English accent either? Sorry, firth; it may bother you, but to suggest it's unprofessional is, imo, going a little far. They all do just fine with the pronunciations, to my ears, and while there have been some cringe moments for Nad in early Agents of Mercy (the chorus of the opening title track to Fading Ghosts of Twilight, which they fixed in the live version, though), there's none of that here, just guys with accents, and what's unprofessional about that? They deliver the lyrics emotively, in tune and well-articulated. They're all pros to me.

[Sturgeon's Lawyer]

I have to agree -- Nad Sylvain's voice is really annoying. It sounds to me like Bon Scott doing a Peter Gabriel impression.

[JIF]

Can't agree with you on Wilson - don't think he's weak at all. As for using folks with accents not sounding professional? Should we indict Neal Morse because he doesn't have an English accent either? Sorry, firth; it may bother you, but to suggest it's unprofessional is, imo, going a little far. They all do just fine with the pronunciations, to my ears, and while there have been some cringe moments for Nad in early Agents of Mercy (the chorus of the opening title track to Fading Ghosts of Twilight, which they fixed in the live version, though), there's none of that here, just guys with accents, and what's unprofessional about that? They deliver the lyrics emotively, in tune and well-articulated. They're all pros to me.What about Simon Collins and his Canadian accent?

[firth5th]

What about Simon Collins and his Canadian accent?

Simon sounds great! It not a North America versus British accent (often times you cant tell in songs) it's the inability to pronounce English words.

I played PG's German version of Security to a German friend, who thought it sounded really "weird" because you could tell Gabriel is not a native German speaker.

Here's a humorous (exaggerated) example of a non-English speaker singing Genesis:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3ttQ7vdqek

[flowerking]

Production value is way up over the original recordings. But that isn't enough reason to re-record these songs. I do like some of the embellishments from Steve on guitar. This was his chance to really do something that Genesis would not let him do, but sadly he didn't take enough advantage of it. He wails in a few spots, the end of Suppers Ready comes to mind. I wish he would have done more. Overall, I really enjoy this but wish he would have taken more liberties, been at least slightly less faithful.

As far as Rutherford's supposed comments, until or unless any other member of Genesis is willing to embrace their past like Steve has always been willing to do, I don't care what they think.

[Jacob Holm-Lupo]

Frankly I don't see the point. I had some hopes for this, especially after seeing the intriguing track list. But what on earth is the point of re-recording all these originally excellent songs when they are mostly note-for-note replicas of the original recordings? I appreciate the fun in bringing in some new voices (and I agree with Kelman that especially Kershaw and Jakszyk perform excellently). But if you're not going to offer a new perspective on the material, I really don't see what the purpose is of doing this (beyond the obvious reason which shall not be named). I was hoping for actual re-interpretations, like the gorgeous Blunstone version of "For Absent Friends" on Revisited I.

All that said, many singers do a great job, and Hackett is in top form as a guitarist (is he ever not...?).

One thing, though - there is not a single track here where whoever drums shows the flair and elegance of Phil.

J.

[jkelman]

What about Simon Collins and his Canadian accent?
Eh? :)

[battema]

Frankly I don't see the point. I had some hopes for this, especially after seeing the intriguing track list. But what on earth is the point of re-recording all these originally excellent songs when they are mostly note-for-note replicas of the original recordings? I appreciate the fun in bringing in some new voices (and I agree with Kelman that especially Kershaw and Jakszyk perform excellently). But if you're not going to offer a new perspective on the material, I really don't see what the purpose is of doing this (beyond the obvious reason which shall not be named). I was hoping for actual re-interpretations, like the gorgeous Blunstone version of "For Absent Friends" on Revisited I.

All that said, many singers do a great job, and Hackett is in top form as a guitarist (is he ever not...?).

One thing, though - there is not a single track here where whoever drums shows the flair and elegance of Phil.

J.

Agree with all of the above. I find this album disappointingly safe after the relatively interesting first Genesis Revisited.

[Magic Mountain]

A lot of complaints about the vocalists, but there are a few that were splendid, IMO, including Steven Wilson and John Wetton. I'm not sure that I'll ever warm to Nad Sylvan's voice, but he's acceptable here.

It's funny. I agree with you on Nad's voice on studio albums...hard to take. However, I actually like his voice MUCH better when seeing him perform live. Go figure.

[Squids]

My opinion would be biased perhaps so I won't get into details except to say that I personally love the album and I'm blown away by the whole thing. So many songs, so much love and talent in it, so many different flavors and even the packaging is stellar. Can't WAIT to see this live. I don't see how any Genesis fan could be TOO picky about this! Amazing this is happening in 2012. Just incredible.

As for Rutherford's comments, for what it's worth, I think he was making a more general commentary which could apply to Steve or also Darryl who does his own Genesis-related live show, Ray who does one as well... I think he was just saying he doesn't personally see the need to go back... apart from playing a few Genesis songs in his M&TM shows. That's all (npi). I bet you that's all he meant and some people are blowing it out of proportion. But that's pure conjecture anyway. I really don't know. Doesn't matter. Steve did it! The album is out there ready to be consumed by you.

I think I'm going to the LA show. Maybe I'll have Francis Dunnery or Simon Collins with me as I know they want to go as well!

[Dean Watson]

I thought Supper's Ready was spectacular!

[Progatron]

Mixed reviews as I was expecting, and that's okay. The first one got mixed reviews too, with a lot of people at the time saying that Steve strayed too far from the originals, so he really can't win unless he does both types of albums (as he's done) to please half the fans the first time and the other half the second. :D

[mellotron storm]

I didn't like the first Genesis cover album Hackett did so i wasn't planning on getting this but it's interesting reading people's opinions. And i didn't know Steven Wilson was on it either.

[Sturgeon's Lawyer]

If you didn't like Genesis Revisited, you'll probably like this one...

[firth5th]

Mixed reviews as I was expecting, and that's okay. The first one got mixed reviews too, with a lot of people at the time saying that Steve strayed too far from the originals, so he really can't win unless he does both types of albums (as he's done) to please half the fans the first time and the other half the second. :D

I thought this review below was funny. The guy criticizes Hackett for BOTH remaining too close to the original arrangements and for veering off the original arrangements.


The album's main weakness is an obvious and unavoidable one, in that there's perhaps too much awareness of the original music. This can either lead to over-experimentation in musical texture so as to make the song distinct from the version in Hackett's head, or more commonly there is a tendency to respect the original shape of the songs too much, when more could be gained by lopping off a bit and making a freer reinterpretation.

http://metaltalk.net/columns/20103605.php

[Paul]

I'm not normally a fan of these types of albums: they usually make me want to listen to the originals, but that's not the case here. I'm enjoying this a lot more than I thought I would, to such an extent that it's giving songs I know like the back of my hand a new lease of life (in the short term at least). The musicians involved obviously love the oriiginal material, and it shows.

[Dodie]

Much closer in spirit and detail to the original Genesis songs than 'Genesis Revisited' was, and not so free at reinventing things as that album was - but, to be honest, most of those attempts failed. I think Hackett's played things straighter this time, and it's much to the benefit of the music. For what it's worth, I hear plenty of small details, textures and ideas that are new, but they're not blatant re-arrangements. They're certainly not just carbon copies. For example, Rothery and Hackett trading guitar solos at the end of 'Lamia', the use of sax in 'Blood on the rooftops', a musical box in 'The Musical Box', etc.

I really like a lot of what Hackett's done here, but after 7 or 8 listens I'm not really enjoying "Ripples" that much anymore, and to be honest I could do without the more tenuous solo career tracks (e.g. "Camino Royale"). Seems to me that most of the vocalists are absolutely fine.

[martiprog]

Having been lucky enough to talk at length to Steve about it early 2012, I know he felt that there had been some criticism from fans of the 1st Revisited album for straying "too far from the path", so he's possibly overcompensated with the 2nd one by playing it too straight, although it is a fine record. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Yes, one or two of the vocals are inferior - Amanda's "Ripples" is too low for her voice, and Nad sounds like Gabriel-lite - but for the serious fan who collects live bootlegs, the differing versions add a welcome dash of spice to a favourite recipe. Having said that, he has certainly revitalised a lot of people's interest in this era of Genesis, and also in his solo records - interviews on the BBC Breakfast show, a top 30 UK chart entry etc, and tickets for what promises to be a terrific live show are selling well. Mission accomplished Steve !

[Scott Bails]

For what it's worth, I hear plenty of small details, textures and ideas that are new, but they're not blatant re-arrangements. They're certainly not just carbon copies. For example, Rothery and Hackett trading guitar solos at the end of 'Lamia', the use of sax in 'Blood on the rooftops', a musical box in 'The Musical Box', etc.


Excellent points. :up

I also love the little "Greensleeves" intro to "Moonlit Knight."

[Geoff O'Donoghue]

My copy of GRII arrived earlier this week and I've been listening to it almost exclusively. I managed to hear the whole thing when it was streamed a little while back so, despite my failing memory, I had a fair idea of what to expect.

I think it's a great album and a very worthwhile endeavour. It's not without its flaws (Amanda Lehmann turns in the best vocal performance on Hierophant and also the most jarring on Ripples) but taken as a whole it is a very good Hackett release and a worthy adjunct to the Genesis canon.

There have been valid questions raised as to Hackett's motivation in approaching GRII the way he has - with arrangements that are very faithful to the originals. I think the project is part of his taking ownership of his entire musical legacy. I think he sees himself in some ways as the custodian of this music. This quote from a 2011 interview that Hackett did with genesis-news.com sheds some light:

"I don't have any prejudice against any era of the band. I think I can see it for its merit. I'd like to think I'm the most objective. I've heard guys in the band saying „Oh yeah, we did that stuff, that was all student stuff“ and dismissing so much of the early stuff that was obviously passionately felt by fans and still passionately felt by me, and I still think there's a huge audience there for that. Admittedly it's an audience that is getting older, but on the other hand in the same way that there's still an audience for Dark Side Of The Moon and all of that Pink Floyd stuff. There is an aspect – I think that Floyd have been aware of the timelessness of their music, perhaps, whereas Genesis always felt the need to justify and update and modernise and, in the process, reject. It's the idea of throwing out the baby with the bath water. Although, ironically, I left the band, you would think that I wouldn't owe any allegiance to the music, but I still have allegiance to the music which is why I do it live. I do it live because I still love it."

I think it's also likely that GRII is Hackett's way of satisfying his desire for a (now unlikely to ever take place) reunion tour of the classic Genesis line-up. This later part of the interview would support that:

"GNC: What do you think will happen with the reunion idea in the future?
Steve: I can't say for anyone else. I was up for it, I was ready to perform, but nobody wanted to do it, so I'm tired of waiting. Hey, that's a song by the Kinks!"

A year after that interview we have a new Genesis-related release and a forthcoming tour to support it. The media attention surrounding GRII and the tour would suggest that Hackett has tapped into the "huge audience" he mentioned above. I think he is a worthy custodian of the classic Genesis legacy.

The full interview is here: http://www.genesis-news.com/c-Steve-Hackett-Interview-in-Aschaffenburg-ColosSaal-23112011-s470.html

In related news: Hackett may not be able to get any of his former bandmates up on stage with him but it looks like he will be joined by Genesis alumnus Ray Wilson for some shows during the GRII tour -
http://www.genesis-news.com/news-Ray-Wilson-to-join-Steve-Hackett-on-stage-in-2013-n316.html

Geoff

[Progtopia]

So I'm the only one who likes "Ripples," huh? :meh

[Stickleback]

„Oh yeah, we did that stuff, that was all student stuff“ and dismissing so much of the early stuff

That's the first time I read that quote from Steve. It really cauterizes my feeling about some members of Genesis dismissing their past. It's a great point that you make about Pink Floyd standing behind their music. Genesis are a huge part of Rock history which would indicate that they are wrong about the importance of their early music. I am grateful to have Steve, who was so integral to the Genesis sound, become the custodian of this music.

[AncientChord]

So I'm the only one who likes "Ripples," huh? :meh

No you're not. I love Amanda Lehmann's renditions on the album. It will be interesting hearing Nad Sylvan's vocals in concert in place of Amanda Lehmann's on "Ripples" and "Shadow." No surprise that Nad will take on Phil well, but what about "Shadow of the Hierophant?" Originally set for the Foxtrot album, this will be the first time ever that a male with be the singer, as first intended on Foxtrot. Will Nad do it "his own special way?" ;) or will he try to sound like Gabriel would have done it? Should be quite interesting, and hopefully memorable.

[Prog Lives]

So I'm the only one who likes "Ripples," huh? :meh

I'm really enjoying the entire release but had to make a CDR to cut Ripples out of the rotation. I'm a fan not a worshiper of the classics but I'd say this track was almost sacraligious ;)

[Scott Bails]

So I'm the only one who likes "Ripples," huh? :meh


It's not one of my favorites on the album, but I certainly don't dislike it as much as many others seem to.

[Nearfest2]

It's funny. I agree with you on Nad's voice on studio albums...hard to take. However, I actually like his voice MUCH better when seeing him perform live. Go figure.

I'm in the same boat. Nad's voice, to me, is the weakest on the album. I'm a little disappointed that he's the vocalist for the tour, but if you say he's better live, then there is hope.

[NotTheMama]

+1 Good points all!


My copy of GRII arrived earlier this week and I've been listening to it almost exclusively. I managed to hear the whole thing when it was streamed a little while back so, despite my failing memory, I had a fair idea of what to expect.

I think it's a great album and a very worthwhile endeavour. It's not without its flaws (Amanda Lehmann turns in the best vocal performance on Hierophant and also the most jarring on Ripples) but taken as a whole it is a very good Hackett release and a worthy adjunct to the Genesis canon.

There have been valid questions raised as to Hackett's motivation in approaching GRII the way he has - with arrangements that are very faithful to the originals. I think the project is part of his taking ownership of his entire musical legacy. I think he sees himself in some ways as the custodian of this music. This quote from a 2011 interview that Hackett did with genesis-news.com sheds some light:

"I don't have any prejudice against any era of the band. I think I can see it for its merit. I'd like to think I'm the most objective. I've heard guys in the band saying „Oh yeah, we did that stuff, that was all student stuff“ and dismissing so much of the early stuff that was obviously passionately felt by fans and still passionately felt by me, and I still think there's a huge audience there for that. Admittedly it's an audience that is getting older, but on the other hand in the same way that there's still an audience for Dark Side Of The Moon and all of that Pink Floyd stuff. There is an aspect – I think that Floyd have been aware of the timelessness of their music, perhaps, whereas Genesis always felt the need to justify and update and modernise and, in the process, reject. It's the idea of throwing out the baby with the bath water. Although, ironically, I left the band, you would think that I wouldn't owe any allegiance to the music, but I still have allegiance to the music which is why I do it live. I do it live because I still love it."

I think it's also likely that GRII is Hackett's way of satisfying his desire for a (now unlikely to ever take place) reunion tour of the classic Genesis line-up. This later part of the interview would support that:

"GNC: What do you think will happen with the reunion idea in the future?
Steve: I can't say for anyone else. I was up for it, I was ready to perform, but nobody wanted to do it, so I'm tired of waiting. Hey, that's a song by the Kinks!"

A year after that interview we have a new Genesis-related release and a forthcoming tour to support it. The media attention surrounding GRII and the tour would suggest that Hackett has tapped into the "huge audience" he mentioned above. I think he is a worthy custodian of the classic Genesis legacy.

The full interview is here: http://www.genesis-news.com/c-Steve-Hackett-Interview-in-Aschaffenburg-ColosSaal-23112011-s470.html

In related news: Hackett may not be able to get any of his former bandmates up on stage with him but it looks like he will be joined by Genesis alumnus Ray Wilson for some shows during the GRII tour -
http://www.genesis-news.com/news-Ray-Wilson-to-join-Steve-Hackett-on-stage-in-2013-n316.html

Geoff

[bill g]

That's the first time I read that quote from Steve. It really cauterizes my feeling about some members of Genesis dismissing their past. It's a great point that you make about Pink Floyd standing behind their music. Genesis are a huge part of Rock history which would indicate that they are wrong about the importance of their early music. I am grateful to have Steve, who was so integral to the Genesis sound, become the custodian of this music.

Well not Tony Banks, who asserted a year or so ago in an interview that Foxtrot through Duke was his favorite era of the band. I think for a while, playing the songs over and over and over and over he finally tired of them for a while.

[Progatron]

Tony definitely doesn't dismiss their past, he just has his own favourites and is somewhat critical of certain pieces. Overall I think he and Steve are the most fond of the 70s Genesis material. Tony was present for the remixing of every single track on the 2008 boxed sets, and while he remains somewhat critical of absolute fan classics ("Watcher Of The Skies" and "Dancing With The Moonlit Knight" for example), he also mentions that he kind of 'came around' to some others that he considered 'B tracks' for many years ("Harlequin" was one). He is also very complimentary - as is Mike, actually - of "Blood On The Rooftops", which he says is one of his favourites on that album, so it's not only his own contributions he praises. I find he is every bit as critical of his own material as anyone else's too.

It's surprising sometimes to hear musicians discuss their own music, they can have such a different take on it than the fan base does.

[Progatron]

One more spin of this tonight before I file it away on the shelf for a little while (too much stuff in the 'In' pile right at the moment) and I can say I do quite like this overall, but I do NOT like the very end of "Can-Utility" - sorry, Steve Wilson, but that part is supposed to be screamed, it just doesn't sound right otherwise.

Also, it never occurred to me the first few times I listened, but "Hierophant" is in a different key.

[elliottnow]

I think I have video footage of Shadow of the Hierophant from 1979-80 with a male singer. He sings in a very high falsetto.

[Scott Bails]

I do NOT like the very end of "Can-Utility" - sorry, Steve Wilson, but that part is supposed to be screamed, it just doesn't sound right otherwise.


Excellent observation. I love Wilson's singing on that song - except for the ending. You're absolutely right - he's waaay too timid there.

[Rufus]

It would appear this has piqued the publics interest as some UK dates have now sold out. Pleased for Mr. Hackett this is turning out a successful project !

[polmico]

Who will be in the touring band?

[Rufus]

Not actually sure who his band will be?

[firth5th]

Not actually sure who his band will be?

His band is the live band he has been using for the past 12 years or so, plus Nad Sylvian on vocals.
T

[Rufus]

Thanks for that...wouldn't be surprised by one or two guests along the way...wonder which gig will be filmed for DVD ¿

[noisynoise]

While I feel not everything on the CD was a success, this has the makings for "Tour of the Year" in 2013. I hope Steve can afford some production budget and come up with some cool visuals to support this music. Alternatively, it might be interesting to "crowd-source" the background film-making, could be a cool promotional tool.

[AncientChord]

Most of the unnecessary questions posed by Dufus...I mean Rufus, noisynoise and others can be answered at either the CalProg web site and/or Steve Hackett's site. From Steve Hackett's October Newsletter:

We’re preparing for a 2013 Genesis Revisited tour which is planned to be a spectacle with special lights and screens.

www.calprog.com

www.hackettsongs.com/index.html

[Chris Kemp]

So I'm the only one who likes "Ripples," huh? :meh
I like it, too. I think the female voice adds a dimension to the original. "Ripples" and "Hogweed" were the first two songs that made me take notice.

[Chris Kemp]

My take on it is the older the material, the more vital the re-recordings. Especially the "Nursery Cryme" stuff, and to a lesser extent "Foxtrot" and "Lamb". I like that part of the album. The sonic upgrade is enough difference in itself. I do think that the material on "Trick" and "Wind" didn't really have to be re-recorded. It was pretty much perfection the first go-round. It's made me appreciate Phil even more as a vocalist and a drummer. Would have been nice if Steve would have done a song or two off of "Trespass" ("The Knife" and "Stagnation" maybe) and just kept it to a single CD. The re-recordings of his own material do little for me.

[AncientChord]

From Hackett's latest blog:

"Now I'm seriously embarking on a time journey of the mind, re-learning all those old Genesis songs and guitar phrases in preparation for what promises to be a real spectacle..."

Bee...Jesus! I just can't wait! And the April 1st concert is still over 4 months away! :geezer

[martiprog]

Re Nad possibly singing "Hierophant", I would assume that Amanda will continue to sing it as she has done on the last 2 tours and the album. However, as was pointed out in an earlier post, this has actually been sung live by a male singer, bassist Dik Cadbury, on the 1978 live dates and can be seen on the "spectral Mornings" DVD released on 2010.

[AncientChord]

Re Nad possibly singing "Hierophant", I would assume that Amanda will continue to sing it as she has done on the last 2 tours and the album. However, as was pointed out in an earlier post, this has actually been sung live by a male singer, bassist Dik Cadbury, on the 1978 live dates and can be seen on the "spectral Mornings" DVD released on 2010.

I wasn't aware of Dik Cadbury's vocals on "Hierophant" so I stand corrected as Nad being the first male vocalist. But it will still be interesting. And it will be Nad singing, as Amanda WILL NOT be on the GR II world tour. She's sitting this one out as posted on the Hackett web site. Quote from Amanda:

"Regrettably I have decided not to join Steve Hackett and the band for the Genesis Revisited World tour... due to both illness in the family and the fact that I don't feel right about being away from my son for extended periods of time (and this tour is going to be a looooong one!!). All being well, I'll be returning to the band in 2014."

[firth5th]

Amanda WILL NOT be on the GR II world tour.

:up

[Octavio Trimmingham]

Thought the third: (is that getting pretentious yet?).

Nope.




Thought the (firth of) fifth:

Ok, now it is. ;)

[r2daft2]

What I really really would've liked to have seen on GRII would've been a recording of "The Light" - and maybe some versions of the other very early songs that Genesis played live when Steve first joined the band.

And...... in some parallel universe somewhere..... the 5.1 remaster of "And Then There Were Four" could be really special.

[martiprog]

I wasn't aware of Dik Cadbury's vocals on "Hierophant" so I stand corrected as Nad being the first male vocalist. But it will still be interesting. And it will be Nad singing, as Amanda WILL NOT be on the GR II world tour. She's sitting this one out as posted on the Hackett web site. Quote from Amanda:

"Regrettably I have decided not to join Steve Hackett and the band for the Genesis Revisited World tour... due to both illness in the family and the fact that I don't feel right about being away from my son for extended periods of time (and this tour is going to be a looooong one!!). All being well, I'll be returning to the band in 2014."

Aah, thanks for clarifying that Ancientchord. It's a pity, as I doubt Nad will be quite the same as Amanda, or indeed Sally Oldfield.

[Progatron]

What I really really would've liked to have seen on GRII would've been a recording of "The Light" - and maybe some versions of the other very early songs that Genesis played live when Steve first joined the band.

And...... in some parallel universe somewhere..... the 5.1 remaster of "And Then There Were Four" could be really special.

"The Light"... a little obscure, no? And confusing for the average fan who will think it's "Lilywhite Lilith", at least at first. Some of the others could be interesting though... "Twilight Alehouse", "Going Out To Get You"... I would have been happy to see "Seven Stones" or "Harlequin" as well. But, you can't have everything.

As for "And Then There Were Four", well, I'd love to hear Steve's take on the "Burning Rope" solo. :)

[bill g]

quote - As for "And Then There Were Four", well, I'd love to hear Steve's take on the "Burning Rope" solo. - end quote

Yeah, especially as Tony Banks said he shortened the composition to a solo that Mike Rutherford could handle. Had Steve still been in the band, the solo evidently would have been one to rival 'Firth of Fifth'.

[Progatron]

Yeah, especially as Tony Banks said he shortened the composition to a solo that Mike Rutherford could handle. Had Steve still been in the band, the solo evidently would have been one to rival 'Firth of Fifth'.

Interesting... I knew Banks had originally written a much longer piece but I'd never heard him mention shortening it because of Mike's newbie lead guitar status. I believe there was a whole other section to that piece that was scrapped when the decision was made to keep things a little shorter and fit more ideas onto the record. I'd love to hear what the 'epic' piece would have sounded like.

[JIF]

Interesting... I knew Banks had originally written a much longer piece but I'd never heard him mention shortening it because of Mike's newbie lead guitar status. I believe there was a whole other section to that piece that was scrapped when the decision was made to keep things a little shorter and fit more ideas onto the record. I'd love to hear what the 'epic' piece would have sounded like.On the reissue interview to ATTWT, Tony says that he shortened Burning Rope because he didn't want the comparisons to One For The Vine.

[Henry Krinkle]

Would have been nice if Steve would have done a song or two off of "Trespass" ("The Knife" and "Stagnation" maybe) and just kept it to a single CD.

Hackett wasn't in Genesis when Trespass was recorded. Hence, for the same reasons, he doesn't do any reworkings of songs off Invisible Touch. ;)

[mozo-pg]

Hackett wasn't in Genesis when Trespass was recorded. Hence, for the same reasons, he doesn't do any reworkings of songs off Invisible Touch. ;)

Yet Steve did do the definitive version of The Knife on Genesis Live - not to be forgotten.

I think this is a tremendous album 5/5

[80s were ok]

I'm glad this thread got revived because I just got this album and i'm terribly disappointed. These are essentially note-for-note remakes of the originals tunes. On the first album, the remakes had new character to them, some twists to them. On this album, it's almost like I'm listening to the orginal version for the millionth time...and where is the fun in that? This is an awfully boring album and that is coming from someone who feels Hackett solo albums are some of the best albums released by anyone in the last 50 years.

[pinkpanther]

I'm glad this thread got revived because I just got this album and i'm terribly disappointed. These are essentially note-for-note remakes of the originals tunes. On the first album, the remakes had new character to them, some twists to them. On this album, it's almost like I'm listening to the orginal version for the millionth time...and where is the fun in that? This is an awfully boring album and that is coming from someone who feels Hackett solo albums are some of the best albums released by anyone in the last 50 years.
Could not agree more! If anyone feels like checking, I bet the tempos match up exactly!

[Henry Krinkle]

Yet Steve did do the definitive version of The Knife on Genesis Live - not to be forgotten.




Well, yeah, he did play a lot of Trespass songs live over the years, but this project was reworkings of songs that he was involved in with regard to the writing/composing/playing on the original during his time in Genesis.

[80s were ok]

Could not agree more! If anyone feels like checking, I bet the tempos match up exactly!

and as I reread this thread, I see we are not the only ones that feel this way. The solo Hackett songs on this albums are probably the most interesting. I REALLY love the first Genesis Revisited album because they weren't note-for-note remakes. I"m probably one of the few that loved the vocals "Dance of the Volcano" sung by Hackett ("DO YOU WANT TO DANCE WITH MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee")

[mozo-pg]

Well, yeah, he did play a lot of Trespass songs live over the years, but this project was reworkings of songs that he was involved in with regard to the writing/composing/playing on the original during his time in Genesis.

I guess my point is Hackett improved on the Phillips' version - no mean feat.

[Henry Krinkle]

I love the album for the most part, as I am in the camp of "there can't be enough classic Genesis in the world". Kudos to Hackett for being the true keeper of the Genesis flame, and having the balls to not only record these songs again but play many of them live, reminding the music world what a creative monster Genesis was. Especially as Gabriel continually distances himself and ignores the past, and is apparantly chicken to tackle the Genesis legacy in any way, and as Collins has sometimes tended over the years to minimize and cringe over some of the complex progressive music he used to be a part of. I always welcome hearing Hackett playing guitar and am proud he loves these songs so much to devote this much time and energy to such a project. Great to see people like Steven Wilson and Wetton etc contributing.

I do have some quibbles similar to what others have expressed. I was expecting more of a reworking of many of these songs so I was a bit surprised Hackett kept pretty literal to the originals. Still love the songs, as many are some of my favorites as they are Hackett's. I thought there were some missed opportunities with songs like Musical Box, Moonlit Knight and Earl of Mar, as I wanted to hear more of the power and heaviness of old Genesis for instance in the guitar/keyboard battle in Musical Box, the menacing guitar parts in Moonlit Knight, and the opening heavy chords of Earl of Mar. Steve is usually a big user of bass pedals, and there were missed opportunities where I thought he would give us some Clocks--Angels of Mons type deep bass in some of these tunes. Even Fly on a Windshield wasn't quite as heavy as I had hoped having heard him do that tune live several times. He took more of a pastoral approach to the tunes overall, which was nice, I just thought he would have ramped it up more in spots. I do love the extra textures and nuances Hackett adds to most of these tunes which makes them different enough that it does overall make for a fresh listen, and in many cases enhances and reaffirms the majesty of this astounding music.

For the most part I have no problem with the vocalists, and I was surprised at how Gabriel-like many of them sounded. Some tunes did come off as 'tribute bandish', upon first listen Hogweed was one of those. I need to digest Supper's Ready again to determine whether that was worth redoing---a bit surprised Hackett took on that masterpiece in total. I also think it might have been better for him to leave the Hackett solo tunes to a future "Hackett Revisited" album, although I get the connection of some of the material (Please Don't Touch, Shadow of H) to the Genesis years.

But all considered, a very nice effort and great listen to some of the greatest music ever composed, and I cannot wait to see and hear this tour live. Must see as Hackett keeps the flame burning.

[Henry Krinkle]

I'm really enjoying the entire release but had to make a CDR to cut Ripples out of the rotation. I'm a fan not a worshiper of the classics but I'd say this track was almost sacraligious ;)


skip button on the CD player broken?

[Scott Bails]

I'm glad this thread got revived because I just got this album and i'm terribly disappointed. These are essentially note-for-note remakes of the originals tunes. On the first album, the remakes had new character to them, some twists to them. On this album, it's almost like I'm listening to the orginal version for the millionth time...and where is the fun in that? This is an awfully boring album and that is coming from someone who feels Hackett solo albums are some of the best albums released by anyone in the last 50 years.


Could not disagree more.

Sure, the arrangements are pretty true, but the guitars are more out front, the vocalists all put a bit of their own spin on their songs, some of the guitar parts are expanded.

They're different from the originals, but the differences are subtle.

These are classic songs - you don't want to mess with them too much.

[jupiter0rjapan]

I can never seem to get enough of Wetton singing Genesis songs. He also was amazing on Revisited 1 and the Live in Japan CD.

[80s were ok]

Could not disagree more.

Sure, the arrangements are pretty true, but the guitars are more out front, the vocalists all put a bit of their own spin on their songs, some of the guitar parts are expanded.

They're different from the originals, but the differences are subtle.

These are classic songs - you don't want to mess with them too much.so you must've hated the first Genesis revisited. Oh well, different strokes for different folks. DO YOU WANT TO DANCE WITH MMMMEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[polmico]

I'm not a huge Genesis or Hackett fan, but I've been enjoying this for what it is. It's not going to replace the originals, but I enjoy it for what it is--and it doesn't need to be anything more than what it is.

[JIF]

I can never seem to get enough of Wetton singing Genesis songs. He also was amazing on Revisited 1 and the Live in Japan CD.At first, I was turned off by hearing Wetton on Revisited II, as I only wanted to hear young singers. I eventually came around, as I feel that Wetton's voice is still strong(especially considering that he had heart problems many years ago).

[80s were ok]

At first, I was turned off by hearing Wetton on Revisited II, as I only wanted to hear young singers. I eventually came around, as I feel that Wetton's voice is still strong(especially considering that he had heart problems many years ago).

you haven't seen Asia in concert, have you...

[JIF]

you haven't seen Asia in concert, have you...Do I want to?

[Scott Bails]

If you're a fan at all, I highly recommend it, JIF. Wetton sounds amazing, and the whole band really plays with a lot of energy, considering their respective ages.

I had a blast at their most recent show 'round here a couple months ago.

[JIF]

If you're a fan at all, I highly recommend it, JIF. Wetton sounds amazing, and the whole band really plays with a lot of energy, considering their respective ages.

I had a blast at their most recent show 'round here a couple months ago.Good to know. I have a concert dvd of theirs saved on Netflix(Fantasia?). I think I should watch that soon.

[bill g]

A couple areas that turned out really well on the album:

The pastoral mid-section of 'Earl of Mar', love the backing vocals there. Those really add to the music something that wasn't there before. (Though I too felt the intro was lacking the mystique of the original version).

The instrumental passage at the end of Lovers Leap. Well I always love that section. And something about 'Ikhnaton and Itsacon...' sounds stronger to me than the original.

I too felt John Wetton did a nice job in Afterglow. The fuller voice I think works well for that tune.

Steve's guitar intro to Chamber... very nice.

[Tangram]

Got it today. Will report in this week. I really liked Revisited I, some of his reinterpretations are excellent. Not always better but very good and different. There are very few times that a new cut beats an established original. SH is one of a very few who I feel get better with age.

[Henry Krinkle]

One thing is clear. This album just proves once again, that NO ONE composes music like this anymore, and few in rock music ever reached these heights.

[Splicer]

One thing is clear. This album just proves once again, that NO ONE composes music like this anymore, and few in rock music ever reached these heights.

Same could be said for the music of Frank Zappa. There are people influenced by him but no one other than Frank Zappa could write Frank Zappa music. With the music of Genesis you have two people in the five and four piece versions of the band with classical tastes and aspirations: Banks and Hackett. I think creating music when you lean towards classical composition and arrangement while working in a rock band format produces music that is as tuneful and lush as much of the early to mid period Genesis output.

[rickmoraz]

The pastoral mid-section of 'Earl of Mar', love the backing vocals there. Those really add to the music something that wasn't there before. (Though I too felt the intro was lacking the mystique of the original






Love it, for some reason makes me think of the Beach Boys, in a very good way


Ed

[Sturgeon's Lawyer]

...no one other than Frank Zappa could write Frank Zappa music.

Check out Weird Al's "Genius in France."

[Finn_McCool]

A big missed opportunity was the chance to add a guitar solo to the end of "Afterglow". That's the only thing that could make that song any better!

I'm probably one of the few who enjoyed Hackett's take on "Your Own Special Way" on the first "Genesis Revisited" album. The "smoov jazz" version of this song suddenly gets a kick in the pants with Hackett's soaring guitar solo.

[Scott Bails]

I'm probably one of the few who enjoyed Hackett's take on "Your Own Special Way" on the first "Genesis Revisited" album.

Probably! ;)

[Henry Krinkle]

With the music of Genesis you have two people in the five and four piece versions of the band with classical tastes and aspirations: Banks and Hackett. I think creating music when you lean towards classical composition and arrangement while working in a rock band format produces music that is as tuneful and lush as much of the early to mid period Genesis output.


I just wish Banks and Hackett put aside the stiff upper lip English standoffishness and any quibbles they may have had with each other in Genesis and put an album together before its too late. I still think they could make a monster of an album together, the closest thing we could get to a Genesis reunion album. I would give my left nut to hear Banks and Hackett compositions side by side and/or combined along with Banks' keyboards interacting with Hackett's guitar again. And as we see from this Revisited album, the list of potential vocal contributors is decent, although I wouldn't mind a mostly instrumental album either.

[bill g]

I just wish Banks and Hackett put aside the stiff upper lip English standoffishness and any quibbles they may have had with each other in Genesis and put an album together before its too late. I still think they could make a monster of an album together, the closest thing we could get to a Genesis reunion album. I would give my left nut to hear Banks and Hackett compositions side by side and/or combined along with Banks' keyboards interacting with Hackett's guitar again. And as we see from this Revisited album, the list of potential vocal contributors is decent, although I wouldn't mind a mostly instrumental album either.

Man that would be nice. Seems a Banks/Hackett album wouldn't shortchange either composition-wise, and their compositions complement one another quite nicely. Some collaborations would be nice too.
Wouldn't mind Anthony Phillips being involved either.

[80s were ok]

A big missed opportunity was the chance to add a guitar solo to the end of "Afterglow". That's the only thing that could make that song any better!

I'm probably one of the few who enjoyed Hackett's take on "Your Own Special Way" on the first "Genesis Revisited" album. The "smoov jazz" version of this song suddenly gets a kick in the pants with Hackett's soaring guitar solo.

no you aren't, the vocals were great on that version too. Was that Paul Carrack? I don't have the CD in front of me now.

[Scott Bails]

Was that Paul Carrack?

Yep

[Tangram]

A big missed opportunity was the chance to add a guitar solo to the end of "Afterglow". That's the only thing that could make that song any better!

I'm probably one of the few who enjoyed Hackett's take on "Your Own Special Way" on the first "Genesis Revisited" album. The "smoov jazz" version of this song suddenly gets a kick in the pants with Hackett's soaring guitar solo.

Would have been really interesting to try and add a guitar solo there. Wish he gave it a shot.

Loved Hackett's version of "Your Own Special Way". Had it played at my wedding and the band did a great job with it.

[East New York]

On first listen, I thought this album was pretty good, and I plan to give it another shot. I love that Kershaw, Dunnery, and Wilson are on it.

[Smörgåsbord]

I keep returning to the versions of "Blood On The Rooftops" and "Lamia". Never cared for the original The Lamb so Lamia with delicate "neo prog vox" of Nik Kershew was a revelation.

[Tangram]

First impressions: The sound to very impressive, which is what I have come to expect from SH. All the better because the production on some of those early Genesis albums left a bit to be desired. The song selections are top notch but then again there isn't much from this period that I don't appreciate.

What I miss is that on the first album, SH took some of the songs and rearranged them. I gave those songs a new identity and was more adventurous. True some did not turn out so well, but I liked what they did. On Revisited II, the songs stayed much closer to the originals. To me this makes it more of a cover band album, albeit a very good cover band. It does not make you want to replace the originals. It also makes me appreciate the singing of Peter Gabriel and especially Phil Collins even more.

I'll see if my opinion changes after a few more spins.

[logicmandoo]

True some did not turn out so well, but I liked what they did.

So are you saying that you like the ones that didn"t work so well?

[Tangram]

So are you saying that you like the ones that didn"t work so well?

Maybe I could have phrased it better but I liked that they tried to rearrange some songs and took some chances on Revisited I instead of just tweaking the originals. There are very few places on II that I found an improvement to the original and there is no new excitement because there is very little change. SH albums have oddities, change of paces and unexpected twists in his albums and this really has none. It plays like a very good cover band and I like the original singers better.

[JIF]

I am spinning this again after putting it down for awhile. Let's see if it still holds up. Btw, does anyone have the link so I can know who sings on which parts of Supper's Ready?

[jkelman]

I'm probably one of the few who enjoyed Hackett's take on "Your Own Special Way" on the first "Genesis Revisited" album. The "smoov jazz" version of this song suddenly gets a kick in the pants with Hackett's soaring guitar solo.
Genesis? Jazz? Tain't nothin' jazz-like - smooth, smoov or otherwise -about "Your Own Special Way." Eek!

[jkleban]

Reference to Mike's comment on Steve's worK:

http://ultimateclassicrock.com/mike-rutherford-genesis-past/

Not too bashing and I understand Mike's point. Don't necessarily agree with it but if you played the same 50 songs for the last 50 years, I think any musician would grow tired of the songs and want to do something new. But, Steve, didn't have 50 years with GENESIS so his perspective is totally different.

Jim

[Plasmatopia]

Played all of disc one while cleaning the house over Christmas vacation and it's still pretty great if you ask me.

[Scott Bails]

I am spinning this again after putting it down for awhile. Let's see if it still holds up. Btw, does anyone have the link so I can know who sings on which parts of Supper's Ready?

I think this is it (http://www.genesis-news.com/c-Steve-Hackett-Genesis-Revisited-II-2CD-review-s499.html)

[JIF]

I think this is it (http://www.genesis-news.com/c-Steve-Hackett-Genesis-Revisited-II-2CD-review-s499.html)Yep. Thanks, Scott.

[bsk]

So far this LP holds well for me. Finally Genesis material at a decent sonic quality. I have no qualms about the music, it just soars for me. I have severe reservations, though, about the vocals - no one can replace PG, but I'm sitting on the edge with this.

Still, I have a ticket to the Bristol show in Oct. & we'll see. As someone who never had the opportunity to see the real Genesis, this is probably the best I can ever hope for.

[Smörgåsbord]

Can utility just kills. The lush arrangements really make it brilliant, far better than the original.