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Thread: Peter Gabriel 4 (Security) - Overlooked or quietly respected?

  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by mozo-pg View Post
    Was that the show the lights moved up and down on arms and coming down on Gabriel's body?
    No, he had nothing that elaborate. I think you might be thinking of the "Back To Front" tour where he played "So" in it's entirety. I also saw that tour and it was great, but a much much larger production that back on the "Security" tour.

  2. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by chalkpie View Post
    This album slays. Pete has such a knack for setting a mood in his tunes, even during the early days with the lads, and this one is no exception. It has an 80's thing going on, but honestly I find that pretty cool too personally. Such a great album.
    Totally agreed. This was one of his best, IMO.

    A track that doesnít seem to get mentioned a lot (at least from what Iíve seen) is ďLay Your Hands On MeĒ. The percussion during the end of that song is just insane.

  3. #78
    Un the channel 4 documentary he stated he wants to follow the path of IV
    For a short while he did
    his song was recorded over two days in Bath in May 1982. Peter Gabriel and Stewart Copeland would perform it live at the 1st WOMAD festival on 1982-07-18.
    Personnel
    Peter Gabriel: Fairlight CMI, vocals, surdu
    Shankar: double neck violin
    David Rhodes: vocals, guitar
    Stewart Copeland: drums, percussion


    Last edited by Udi Koomran; 2 Weeks Ago at 01:35 PM.

  4. #79
    That's Mr. to you, Sir!! Trane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by olivetti View Post
    Well, as I wrote earlier Geffen wanted a name for the fourth one, so Gabriel settled for Security!
    But only in USA and Canada!

    As for the names, I dont recall any names for the first three before the internet.
    Me and my friends just called them 1,2 and 3 :-)
    I had to check this out, and you're right, Geffen had the US version with a purple sticker calling it security,
    https://rateyourmusic.com/release/al...el/security-2/
    but the Canadian version was the normal nameless album sleeve, hence most of us called it Mask ... Though on Discogs, on the Canadian release the label on the vinyl does mention Security

    As for the first three (and 4) it's not that we called them outright with those name, but to specify, we said "you know, the one with the car on the cover" or the "one where he's melting"

    Quote Originally Posted by mozo-pg View Post
    I definitely idolized Gabriel in the past but seldom play his music now. I saw him with Sting a couple of years ago and the show, as usual, was excellent.
    Don't feel the urge of hearing his music anymore

    I'll still listen to it on the radio, and I'll check out his new stuff if I have a chance to, but I won't go out of my way to listen to new albums (last I made a specific effort was borrowing UP in my library system)

    I should one day see him on stage, but I dount it will happen someday
    I was planning on the Sting&Gabe, but I can't handle such large venues & crowd anymore >> slightly agoraphobic and I refuse to endure these crowd control measures
    my music collection increased tenfolds when I switched from heroin-addicts to crazy ones

  5. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Trane View Post
    I'll still listen to it on the radio, and I'll check out his new stuff if I have a chance to, but I won't go out of my way to listen to new albums
    I don't think you need to worry over much on that score...

  6. #81
    Highly Evolved Orangutan JKL2000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveSly View Post
    The really amazing thing about the tour was how small the production was, and what Gabriel was able to do with what he had. I remember he had a very minimal lighting rig and really not much else. What he did with the lighting he had was amazing and just his charisma had the crowd in the palm of his hand from the beginning.
    I was going to say the same. Very minimal lighting, all white lighting as I recall. And the charisma/choreography of Gabriel and the rest of the band provided enough visual interest. I thought it was really cool when Gabriel swung with one arm from the bar in that sort of boxy thing behind the band. These were the kind of theatrics he used on his first solo tour (judging from the available video), and as someone mentioned, after this tour the shows became much bigger - still lots of theatrics but on a scale that was more "distant," if that makes sense. Still good, but different. After the Security tour, I saw him on the So tour and the Up tour and that was it. Missed the Us tour, which was pretty cool judging from the video. The Up show wasn't bad, but a little strained IMO. Trying a bit to hard, with the walking upside down, the big ball thing, etc. I would have preferred a more stripped down show, but as the show I saw was at MSG, I guess big effects were called for.

  7. #82
    Masterpiece of an album. My favorite by him and it's not even close.
    Be a loyal plastic robot for a world that doesn't care... Frank Zappa

  8. #83
    Two replies to two posts:

    1. There were no cymbals on either III or IV, at Gabriel's request, because he felt drummers leant on them too heavily. Fripp made a similar request of Bruford on one of the '80s Crimson albums if I recall correctly, and also (in Fripp's case) because the constant use of cymbals eats into the guitars' sonic space.

    2. About the walking from the back of the audience thing (and this is all shows I saw, ymmv):
    For the second album, Gabriel walked from the back to the front of the audience with the house lights up, hopped up onto the stage and sat behind the piano. He said he'd like to bring out "someone who has been a great influence on me," causing the audience to call out for a certain guitarist, but he pulled out a teddy bear and sang the teddy bear song. My local college newspaper described this as a "Fripp-tease".
    For the third album, Gabriel announced a game of "Hunt the band," and used a hand spotlight to search for bandmembers who advanced through the audience to the front of the stage.
    For the fourth album, a drum machine began playing the opening rhythm of "Rhythm of the Heat" to an empty (except for instruments) stage. The band members, wearing little spotlights, came forward from the back of the audience and climbed up onto the stage and began playing the song.

    Cheers.
    Ring the bells, that still can ring,
    Forget your perfect offering.
    There is a crack - a crack in everything.
    That's how the light gets in.

  9. #84
    I am quite a big Gabriel fan. I saw his first tour in 77 bought the first three ...and then started again with So and loved all his concerts I saw, but I just realized that I not only have no copy of 4 I've never even heard the record. I had for some time the compilation Shaking The Tree in the car and suppose there are some tracks on it , I know San Jacinto. I do like a lot the second one with its punk energy and the first one mainly because it was the first one.
    One reason could be that I don't like the cover of 4 at all...have to listen to it
    Dieter Moebius : "Art people like things they donít understand!"

  10. #85
    Highly Evolved Orangutan JKL2000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sturgeon's Lawyer View Post
    Two replies to two posts:

    1. There were no cymbals on either III or IV, at Gabriel's request, because he felt drummers leant on them too heavily. Fripp made a similar request of Bruford on one of the '80s Crimson albums if I recall correctly, and also (in Fripp's case) because the constant use of cymbals eats into the guitars' sonic space.

    2. About the walking from the back of the audience thing (and this is all shows I saw, ymmv):
    For the second album, Gabriel walked from the back to the front of the audience with the house lights up, hopped up onto the stage and sat behind the piano. He said he'd like to bring out "someone who has been a great influence on me," causing the audience to call out for a certain guitarist, but he pulled out a teddy bear and sang the teddy bear song. My local college newspaper described this as a "Fripp-tease".
    For the third album, Gabriel announced a game of "Hunt the band," and used a hand spotlight to search for bandmembers who advanced through the audience to the front of the stage.
    For the fourth album, a drum machine began playing the opening rhythm of "Rhythm of the Heat" to an empty (except for instruments) stage. The band members, wearing little spotlights, came forward from the back of the audience and climbed up onto the stage and began playing the song.

    Cheers.
    The spotlight thing sounds familiar, but maybe that was on a later tour (for me). On the Security tour, I seem to remember Marotta entering playing some kind of drum.

  11. #86
    That's right; a couple of the musicians were carrying drums, and they all picked up drums at the end of the song.
    Ring the bells, that still can ring,
    Forget your perfect offering.
    There is a crack - a crack in everything.
    That's how the light gets in.

  12. #87
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    My memory from '82 is of them processing from the back of the house, each playing a drum of some sort, before arriving at their respective places and instruments on stage. BTW, the concert I saw was one of the four used as a source for the 'Plays Live' recording (Braden Aud, ISU, Normal, IL).
    David
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  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveSly View Post
    No, he had nothing that elaborate. I think you might be thinking of the "Back To Front" tour where he played "So" in it's entirety. I also saw that tour and it was great, but a much much larger production that back on the "Security" tour.
    He had those on the So tour, which i managed to see twice. Once indoors (Rosemont Horizon?) and once outdoors (Poplar Creek). And yes, they came back for the Back to Front tour (United Center).

    Quote Originally Posted by Sturgeon's Lawyer View Post
    Two replies to two posts:

    1. There were no cymbals on either III or IV, at Gabriel's request, because he felt drummers leant on them too heavily. Fripp made a similar request of Bruford on one of the '80s Crimson albums if I recall correctly, and also (in Fripp's case) because the constant use of cymbals eats into the guitars' sonic space.
    I think that was specifically hi-hats with Crim.

    Quote Originally Posted by proggy_jazzer View Post
    My memory from '82 is of them processing from the back of the house, each playing a drum of some sort, before arriving at their respective places and instruments on stage.
    That's the way I remember it as well.

  14. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by Sturgeon's Lawyer View Post
    Two replies to two posts:

    1. There were no cymbals on either III or IV, at Gabriel's request, because he felt drummers leant on them too heavily. Fripp made a similar request of Bruford on one of the '80s Crimson albums if I recall correctly, and also (in Fripp's case) because the constant use of cymbals eats into the guitars' sonic space.

    2. About the walking from the back of the audience thing (and this is all shows I saw, ymmv):
    For the second album, Gabriel walked from the back to the front of the audience with the house lights up, hopped up onto the stage and sat behind the piano. He said he'd like to bring out "someone who has been a great influence on me," causing the audience to call out for a certain guitarist, but he pulled out a teddy bear and sang the teddy bear song. My local college newspaper described this as a "Fripp-tease".
    For the third album, Gabriel announced a game of "Hunt the band," and used a hand spotlight to search for bandmembers who advanced through the audience to the front of the stage.
    For the fourth album, a drum machine began playing the opening rhythm of "Rhythm of the Heat" to an empty (except for instruments) stage. The band members, wearing little spotlights, came forward from the back of the audience and climbed up onto the stage and began playing the song.

    Cheers.
    For the third album tour (there were t-shirts calling it the 1984 Tour of China...), The show I saw in Santa Barbara (June 1980), the band came in from the back playing drums to "Intruder" .

    Edit - now that I remember, I believe they all had flashlights / searchlights . Maybe Marotta was already onnstage playing the "Intruder" beat. Or maybe it was playing on a tape... but I dont think the whole band was playing drums ( that happened on the next tour)
    Last edited by thos; 2 Weeks Ago at 03:28 PM.

  15. #90
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    I had to look back to see when/where PG came to my area back in the 80's. I saw him on the Security tour on Dec. 9, 1982 at the Agora Ballroom in Dallas. It was a "rock club" so the seating/tables made it seem pretty intimate. Pete did his "Shock the Monkey" bit where he climbed around the lighting struts and hung from a horizontal pole like an ape. The light effects were decent for such a small venue. Saw him almost exactly four years later on Dec. 8, 1986 on the So tour. By that point, Sledgehammer was a big hit and he was playing arenas, so we saw him at the Reunion arena in Dallas. His light show looked deceptively simple & I was disappointed at first as I was used to the Genesis & Yes monster light shows. As the show continued, multiple lights mounted on gimbals and telescoping arms began to emerge from the lighting grid. When the lights came out to "attack" Peter and "drive him to the ground" during No Self Control, I was sitting gobsmacked with my mouth gaping open. Mind totally blown. Great stagecraft and lighting design. Here's a sample of that performance at a different venue:
    https://youtu.be/1uju0dUOzr8

  16. #91
    Member yesman1955's Avatar
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    By 1993, Peter had graduated to the two center of the venue stages connected by a moving walkway, huge projection screen and the red phone booth. Saw him that tour again at Reunion arena with my (new) wife, who had become a big fan at that point. That tour was documented as Secret World Live: https://youtu.be/Up6f7j8seFU

  17. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by JKL2000 View Post
    I was going to say the same. Very minimal lighting, all white lighting as I recall. And the charisma/choreography of Gabriel and the rest of the band provided enough visual interest. I thought it was really cool when Gabriel swung with one arm from the bar in that sort of boxy thing behind the band. These were the kind of theatrics he used on his first solo tour (judging from the available video), and as someone mentioned, after this tour the shows became much bigger - still lots of theatrics but on a scale that was more "distant," if that makes sense. Still good, but different. After the Security tour, I saw him on the So tour and the Up tour and that was it. Missed the Us tour, which was pretty cool judging from the video. The Up show wasn't bad, but a little strained IMO. Trying a bit to hard, with the walking upside down, the big ball thing, etc. I would have preferred a more stripped down show, but as the show I saw was at MSG, I guess big effects were called for.
    I remember he had a lot of white light, but not everything was white as in the green beam of light I described during San Jacinto earlier in this thread. I also remember the swinging from the bar during "Shock The Monkey" which was very cool. The only other tours I saw were "Up" and "Back To Front". I agree about the "Up" tour. It was very cool being in the round, but yea some of it was a bit strained. It was the first time I payed more than $100 for a concert ticket, which at the time I thought was highway robbery. He played the 20,000 seat Palace Arena in Detroit and the place was only maybe a 3rd full. In fact they had the entire upper bowl blocked off. Even with the ticket prices he was charging I wonder if he lost money on that show. BTW, the first time I paid more than $10 for a concert was also Garbriel on the 82 tour. Tix were a whopping $11 which I thought was way high at the time

  18. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by gearHed289 View Post
    He had those on the So tour, which i managed to see twice. Once indoors (Rosemont Horizon?) and once outdoors (Poplar Creek). And yes, they came back for the Back to Front tour (United Center).

    .
    Ah, I didn't see the "So" tour, so they were new to me on "Back To Front".

  19. #94
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    Not only do I love the performance on this, but I also really dig the production. Really fat bass and drums with a very warm guitar, everything has breathing room. Beautiful engineering there imo. Primus sucks!
    Last edited by chalkpie; 2 Weeks Ago at 07:00 PM.
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  20. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveSly View Post
    I agree about the "Up" tour. It was very cool being in the round, but yea some of it was a bit strained.
    I got the sense he felt a need to constantly top himself, even when it didn't make a ton of sense for the song. Like, he would come across something he thought was cool and decided it had to be worked into the show, no matter what.
    I'm holding out for the Wilson-mixed 5.1 super-duper walletbuster special anniversary extra adjectives edition.

  21. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by Sturgeon's Lawyer View Post
    1. There were no cymbals on either III or IV, at Gabriel's request, because he felt drummers leant on them too heavily. Fripp made a similar request of Bruford on one of the '80s Crimson albums if I recall correctly, and also (in Fripp's case) because the constant use of cymbals eats into the guitars' sonic space.
    Regarding the lack of cymbals, particularly on Melt, there are other percussion instruments, but the lack of cymbals creates tension - a totemic, animistic thrum and rumble - that permeates the album with an unrelieved edginess bordering on hysteria. The purposeful mania instilled by Gabriel is amplified further with the "gated drum" sound, a dramatic reverb effect that produces a booming but highly-compressed punch to the drums created specifically for this album and employed with gusto by drummer Phil Collins (who appears on four tracks). Collins would memorably re-use the gated drum effect on his hit "In the Air Tonight", but perfected it on Peter Gabriel's album. Credit for creating that sound goes to Steve Lillywhite, Collins and Hugh Padgham.
    "And your little sister's immaculate virginity wings away on the bony shoulders of a young horse named George who stole surreptitiously into her geography revision."

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    The team (musical and technical) managed to do an exceptional job of bringing Gabrielís vision into focus. While I enjoyed the previous albums, the Jungian aspect of this material, expressed so innovatively, resonated with me. No cymbals but many symbols.

  23. #98
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    The Family And The Fishing Net is probably the best song he ever recorded.

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    Only the first PG album beats the fourth in my view.
    I appreciate that this is not a commonly held opinion but I saw PG live twice in the late 70's playing the first album in full with just previews of tracks that would appear on the second album and they were excellent shows.
    That 2nd album was a little disappointing in comparison but the 3rd was excellent and bettered by the fourth. I still have mixed feelings for So (although Mercy Street is a candidate for my favourite PG song). After that the PG originality kind of faded slowly away although below-par PG is still way above what many others have produced.

  25. #100
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    Brilliant album. Gabriel's best after the third one.
    "A waste of talent and electricity." John Peel on ELP

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