90125/Asia

[Staun]

Listened to both albums last night and thought about which one I liked best. Both are fantastic in their own way but I really think I liked the first Asia by a gnats eye lash. I saw both tours and I had never seen Carl or John Wetton before. I recall how professional they were and how I just sat there stunned by what I was hearing and seeing. 90125 had a lot of moving pieces to it. How good would Trevor be live and could he pull off the older material. How comfortable would the entire band be playing this type music? I remember the energy Chris displayed that night. He was certainly at the top of his game. Well, has anyone else decided their all time fav?

[ScottAM]

Both albums must have been shockers to prog fans from the 70's who would be disappointed with the pop directions of these releases. But since I came into the bands just around the time that these albums were released, I loved them both. 90125 is way out in front for me, as all things Yes are of much greater love to me than Asia. But that debut Asia album is very impressive, given that band's approach to songwriting. Ironically, it was the live concert video with Greg Lake fronting Asia that made the biggest impact on me at that age, as I never saw them in concert live in person. The Yes 90125 tour was my first concert ever, and what a thrill it was!

[Top Cat]

Rating albums is like trying to decide which child you like better, it's impossible! why even try?
These 2 bands and these albums are so different, it's truly apples and oranges here.

[Scott Bails]

Asia was my gateway to all things prog, so it will always hold a special place in my heart. And I enjoy a lot of AOR, so I don't have the hangups about it that many others do. So, it remains one of my all-time faves. But I also really enjoy 90125, as well, as it was my first Yes album.

[arturs]

My first Yes album was Drama and I worked my way backwards. Two years later, 4 of my favorite musicians were suddenly "cool" as members of a new supergroup. Another year later 90125 came out, and my favorite band was cool again. Not that any of my friends gave a shit, but I loved boasting about how I was into all these guys way before they were "big".

Underneath all that, both albums were deserving of the success they got. Both still hold up for me.

[SongForAmerica]

The Asia album was an atrocity: horrible garbage made by musicians who knew better, all to make a buck.

In contrast, 90125 represented a revitalized Yes with fresh and excellent songs such as "Owner of a Lonely Heart," "Changes," "Leave It," and "Hearts." Although not as good as the very best Yes albums--The Yes Album, Fragile, and Close to the Edge--it was a vast improvement over the dreadful Tormato and a definite step up from the uninspired Drama.

Yes's big mistake thereafter was taking four whole years to release the next album and having Trevor Rabin be its producer.

[JJ88]

One of the benefits of getting into these bands decades after the event is that I don't get the sense of 'betrayal' that older fans did, with albums like these (and I like Genesis' 80s/90s stuff). I can understand those views but this is why I don't personally have them.

Of these, I think 90125 is superior. Despite some strong songs (I basically like all of the album) and the expected excellent musicianship from all four, the production of Asia is cavernous, putting it in league with straight-down-the-line stadium rock and sanding down the edges a little.

By contrast, 90125 had a rock-meets-New Pop aesthetic which was (IMHO) truly inventive. This meant that the songs whilst not sounding very much like they had in the 70s, nevertheless retained the artistry I expect of the band. I am not the biggest fan of anything else YesWest-related, though, so I give Trevor Horn and associates a lot of credit for its success.

[Scott Bails]

The Asia album was an atrocity: horrible garbage made by musicians who knew better, all to make a buck.

In contrast, 90125 represented a revitalized Yes with fresh and excellent songs such as "Owner of a Lonely Heart," "Changes," "Leave It," and "Hearts." Although not as good as the very best Yes albums--The Yes Album, Fragile, and Close to the Edge--it was a vast improvement over the dreadful Tormato and a definite step up from the uninspired Drama.

Yes's big mistake thereafter was taking four whole years to release the next album and having Trevor Rabin be its producer.

I agree with the bolded parts.

The rest is rubbish.

[Top Cat]

I agree with the bolded parts.

The rest is rubbish.

I agree with Scott.
Asia has some great memorable, turn up the car stereo and sing along with the songs on it. Asia isn't PROG in my opinion. Perhaps Top 40 prog or rock prog but the idea that music has to be complicated with deep intense cosmic lyrics and complicated time signatures to be any good is pure poppycock!!
Yes is a progressive rock band, Asia isn't... how can you compare them when they're almost two different genres.

[JJ88]

but the idea that music has to be complicated with deep intense cosmic lyrics and complicated time signatures to be any good is pure poppycock!!

I like the album, always have, but this is a regularly-made straw-man argument. There are many here who like lots of 'pop' but still can't be doing with Asia or other AOR.

[Top Cat]

I like the album, always have, but this is a regularly-made straw-man argument. There are many here who like lots of 'pop' but still can't be doing with Asia or other AOR.

well after livin 70+ years on this planet, all I can say is wearin stiff britches will give you hemorrhoids...

[gearHed289]

Speaking from 18 year old me's perspective, ASIA was a huge disappointment. I remember the excitement I felt when I found out those four guys formed a band. Then I heard Heat of the Moment. When I was in high school, AOR/arena rock was all the rage - Journey, Foreigner, Loverboy, Billy Squire, REO Speedwagon... I didn't like any of it. I had gotten turned on to 70s prog freshman year and became a huge fan of Yes and Rush, and eventually UK, ELP, Ponty, etc. ASIA was just not for me. I saw the tour. It was fine, nothing Earth shattering. Bought a jersey because I did like the album cover. In hindsight, the debut has a LOT of strong moments.

90125 was more my thing. By that time I was getting heavy into new wave/synth bands - the FIXX, Thomas Dolby, Missing Persons... I thought Yes did a great job of updating their sound for a new decade. Drama is still one of my favorite Yes albums, and I consider it the bridge between 70s and 80s Yes. I saw that tour, as well as 90125, and in my memory, Drama was superior, despite Horn's struggles with some vocal parts. 90125 was a bit too slick and choreographed. The fact that the follow up took so long and so obviously suffered from the strain of making it is a damn shame. Missed opportunity for a more successful followup.

[SteveSly]

For me it would be 90125. It was a huge change in direction for Yes, even from Drama (which I love BTW), but it was still high quality stuff. I saw the tour twice and both shows were a blast. Asia was not at all what I was expecting, given the pedigree of the musicians involved, but I liked it for the most part. I also saw the tour which was a lot of fun.

[moecurlythanu]

Rating albums is like trying to decide which child you like better, it's impossible! why even try?

I wouldn't write either of these children into my will, but I'd give each of them a hundred dollars to go away.

[MmusicM]

I saw both tours too. 1982?
I embraced the Asia album, as it had 3 of my Fav Prog artists on it, & was hoping for a Prog resurgence as it actually topped the charts! Yes kind of did the same thing with Trevor, who I had been a fan of since his 1st solo album.
True Prog? Okay, no, not really, but at least there were Prog moments & I was hoping it would spark interest to the uninitiated - the Younger 80's listeners who didn't "know" what Prog was.
Marillion's "Script..." kind of follwed with "He Know's You Know," & I thought for sure Prog was comming back in the mainstream world! The radio stations I was listening to at the time played Asia, Yes, & that one Marillion song, so I thought there was Hope!
Like 'em or not, looking back, I think these groups/albums/songs were the catalyst that caused a resurgence; just not in the mainstream that I hoped it would.

[noisynoise]

Like Scott mentioned above, Asia was also my gateway into prog, but I think 90125 has aged better.

[dropforge]

In contrast, 90125 represented a revitalized Yes with fresh and excellent songs such as "Owner of a Lonely Heart," "Changes," "Leave It," and "Hearts." Although not as good as the very best Yes albums--The Yes Album, Fragile, and Close to the Edge--it was a vast improvement over the dreadful Tormato and a definite step up from the uninspired Drama.

Get outta heah!

[BravadoNJ]

Asia was the new animal on the scene. big sound, big vocals, big music and big production. it was nothing like the history of it's members which is why many Prog fans dismiss it as pop. there was a force behind the band that was the architect of it's success. the band soon fell apart then Geoff Downes reinvented it with John Payne and took it into a different direction. we now know that Trevor Rabin was to be a fifth member of Asia but he exited. 90125 was recorded to follow in the success of Asia.

[jrw]

Interestingly, I loved both of these albums at the time and still do. I also saw both tours and enjoyed both.

Of note, on Asia’s first tour, they played two unreleased songs, Midnight Sun and The Smile Has Left Your Eyes, both of which would end up on Alpha.

My recollection of Midnight Sun was that it would be a mini-epic when recorded. I later had a bootleg cassette and still thought that. When I heard Alpha, I thought “how could they ruin this song!”

[tdotdo]

Interestingly, I loved both of these albums at the time and still do. I also saw both tours and enjoyed both.

Of note, on Asia’s first tour, they played two unreleased songs, Midnight Sun and The Smile Has Left Your Eyes, both of which would end up on Alpha.

My recollection of Midnight Sun was that it would be a mini-epic when recorded. I later had a bootleg cassette and still thought that. When I heard Alpha, I thought “how could they ruin this song!”

I remember really liking Midnight Sun in concert, too. When I got Alpha, I went straight to that song and was so disappointed. It was bland nothingness.

[Gruno]

One of the benefits of getting into these bands decades after the event is that I don't get the sense of 'betrayal' that older fans did, with albums like these (and I like Genesis' 80s/90s stuff). I can understand those views but this is why I don't personally have them.

I still can't understand how some feel betrayed (good term, JJ88!). Some take it too far and personal.

[GuitarGeek]

At the time Asia came out, I had no idea who these guys. I was born in 1973, and at that point, my knowledge of 70's rock music was centered more around the likes of Queen, Uriah Heep, BTO, Lynyrd Skynyrd, Frampton, and Kiss. I'd never heard of ELP, Yes, King Crimson, the Crazy World Of Arthur Brown, Atomic Rooster, Tomorrow, or really, any of the bands those guys had been in during the 70's (except for Heep, and Roxy Music, but I wouldn't know about Wetton's involvement in those two groups until years later).

So I didn't have expectations when I first heard Heat Of The Moment and Only Time Will Tell. They sound good catchy rock n roll songs to me, and they certainly had the "sound of electric guitars" that I "really liked" (thank you Paul Stanley for that word picture). ANd later, I got both of the first two Asia records (fished out of the one dollar bin at Wax Stax). I thought the first two albums were good, and I dug the Asia In Asia concert, which i stayed up to about 2:00am to watch on MTV.

Same thing with Yes. I didn't know who these guys were. I was vaguely aware this was one of the bands Steve Howe had been in before Asia, but apart from the bits of Roundabout and Tempus Fugit that were in MTV's The Road To Asia special, I really didn't know their music, though I was intrigued by a 90125 era news report that referred to them as "the band known for their LP side length songs and extraterrestrial album covers". So Owner Of A Lonely Heart really was my beginning with getting to know this band. I saw the 9012Live video on MTV before I actually owned the album, but I dug it.

Which do I like better? I dunno, I like 'em both. I think both bands are to be commended for doing something different than didn't blow up in their faces. Well, I guess that happened with the post-Alpha Asia (with Wetton coming back, then demanding Howe be 86ed, etc) and pretty much everything Yes has done since 90125, but for a brief while, both bands made it work.

And either was still better than listening to the Allman Brothers Band demonstrate why synths have no place in "Southern Rock" or listening to Graham Nash or Grace Slick go synth-pop, or watching Barbra Streisand crawl around under the covers with Roger Daltrey (yes, you read right, Roger Datlrey!) in her Emotion video. And don't forget Aretha Franklin singing a theoretically romantic duet with George Michael (I guess that made them the Kiki Dee and Elton John of the 80's). As much as I love the 1980's, it was a rough time for anyone who's career had survived the previous decade.

[calyx]

Interestingly, the two bands were never in competition on the touring front - by the time YesWest began the 90125 in early 1984, Wetton has left Asia and there would be no more Asia gigs until some years later.

[Man In The Mountain]

I had just started getting into the classic 70's prog when ASIA came out. So, it was a huge disappointment to me. Still, I saw them live on that first tour because I wanted to see Steve Howe & Carl Palmer. The album stayed shelved for about a decade, but over the years I have come to appreciate and enjoy it more and more. It's now a staple of my listing in my iTunes rotation. I find it to be a classic album showcasing an amazing blend of catchy pomp pop with prog sprinklings. Comparable to a great Styx album.

90125, I never liked, never warmed up to it. Aside from 2 or 3 songs that are kinda fun once in a while, the album as a whole does nothing for me. I do like "Owner" a lot though. Was never a Rabin fan, and never a fan of his set of YES albums. Never saw them live during that time, except for Union. To my surprise however, I have enjoyed hearing him again in ARW. Not sure why, maybe just a bit of fun nostalgia... or if you can't have Howe, he's the next best choice. So, enjoy while we can. It can't go on much longer.

[miamiscot]

I was disappointed with both. I didn't feel betrayed, just confused.
In retrospect, they are both fine LP's - much better than what would follow (Alpha and Big Generator are both terrible records...)