Punk Sites articles on Prog Rock bands

[Scrotum Scissor]

every new musical revolution seems to happen every 10 years or so.

Seemed. The grand cyclic scheme is over and done with, as far as popular music is concerned. What we're left with pretty much sums down to (at least here in Europe) misogynist/antisemitic hip-hop on stylistic repeat as well as some hyper-shallow renditions or variations on long since outdated configurations of so-called "r&b" and cheap electronica. And what's still being created in progressive rock is almost uniformly not taken to heart by fans of "prog-rock".

Current popular culture isn't about music at all, and when it eventuall returns - or if - it won't resemble what once was.

[NogbadTheBad]

In the USA we seem to be on a constant repeat of watered down hip-hop with super bland "I love you why did you leave me" lyrics, female vocalist autotuned to hell and back and rapper cut in. It's horrendous.

[JKL2000]

<<That's where the whole dressing like tramps or whatever thing came from>>

Interesting, because I never saw it as looking anything like “tramps,” but being very similar to Glam. Dayglow mohawks and other weird hairstyles, leather jackets and piercings, etc. Whatever the style, it seemed like a lot of thought went into the looks.

[Crawford Glissadevil]

I know a few greying Punk Rockers, who gaze back fondly on 70's Prog as a worthy adversary. A Rivalry! A reverse muse...

[NogbadTheBad]

And Don't forget about slick bland cliched modern Pop Country

Well I was trying to until you mentioned it

[vmartell]

Good point raised above - by my age, and assuming a general rule that people find pop music in their teen years and kind of stay there - I should be a mostly post-punk person - and yes, love punk, post-punk and the synthpop, industrial stuff, EBM stuff - however while a child, around 8 years old, I was greatly influenced by a kind worker in my grandma's shop - and he was a prog head/classic rock guy - so I was a fan of our music even before - so I always loved both currents in rock - so I find weird the forced choice. To me the enemy was disco!
I always thought the prog fans are relatively the most open ones - specially because some of the post punk stuff has kind of crossed over into prog-like territory.

And there there is that for pretentiousness Elvis Costello and U2 are up there with the worst of prog - I mean, Elvis Costello recently "composed" a BALLET he called "Ill Sogno" - how's that for pretentiousness? pretty high I say...

Anyone else in the same boat, straddling classic rock ?
v

[hFx]

I mean, Elvis Costello recently "composed" a BALLET he called "Ill Sogno" - how's that for pretentiousness? pretty high I say...

Ah... finally bringing ballet to the masses? :-D

As for myself, being a teen in the midst of it, this clip sums up the essence of punk, for what it was worth...



Edit: I did (do) know a few involved in the punk scene that weren't morons... ;->

[GuitarGeek]

I appreciate that ethos but how much of "all that stuff" really mattered to prog fans? Speaking for myself and my circle back then it meant nothing. It was all about loving the music regardless of all the outfits and stage props. When I started listening to prog I fell in love with the music and had no idea about any of the stage excess.

Well, be that as it may, I think all the stage excess mattered to the punks. That's why they went out of their way to look trashy.

Also, it might not have mattered to "prog fans", but it seemed to have mattered to somebody, because demand for Genesis went up after Gabriel started wearing the costumes. Or at least that's the way the band tells it: their booking fees went up after Melody Maker ran a picture of Gabriel in the fox head on the cover. Apparently, there were a lot of punters, whether they were "prog fans" or not, saying "What about this bloke with the fox head and the red dress?".

TBH, I started listening to "punk" after it's original peak and The Police's Outlandos and Clash's London Calling were my main "punk" records.

Interesting you mention The Police, since I think Stewart Copeland admitted that they sort of jumped on the "punk bandwagon", or at least, that's how they were perceived in the press at the time, i.e. they weren't real punks, and in fact, Stewart had been in "one of those disreputable prog rock bands" (his words).

[GuitarGeek]

Interesting, because I never saw it as looking anything like “tramps,” but being very similar to Glam. Dayglow mohawks and other weird hairstyles, leather jackets and piercings, etc. Whatever the style, it seemed like a lot of thought went into the looks.

Were the early punks wearing "dayglow mohawks, leather jackets, and piercings"? I had the impression that came later, after the "revolution" got co-opted by the major labels and shopping mall owners.

I was referring to the early stuff. If you look at pictures of bands like the Pistols, The Clash, etc, as well as the CBGB's bands, they were wearing ripped up clothes, held together by safety pins, etc. There was nothing "glam" about that.

And there there is that for pretentiousness Elvis Costello and U2 are up there with the worst of prog - I mean, Elvis Costello recently "composed" a BALLET he called "Ill Sogno" - how's that for pretentiousness? pretty high I say...

The whole "We're going to destroy the establishment through our music" nonsense strikes me as pretty pretentious too.

[spacefreak]

And there there is that for pretentiousness Elvis Costello and U2 are up there with the worst of prog - I mean, Elvis Costello recently "composed" a BALLET he called "Ill Sogno" - how's that for pretentiousness? pretty high I say...

When by 1983, Siouxsie and the Banshees released a double live album, the first generation of punk was forever buried into the "old ways" of rock'n'roll...

[Trane]

Interesting you mention The Police, since I think Stewart Copeland admitted that they sort of jumped on the "punk bandwagon", or at least, that's how they were perceived in the press at the time, i.e. they weren't real punks, and in fact, Stewart had been in "one of those disreputable prog rock bands" (his words).

Absolutely, them and The Stranglers were seen as fake punks, the latter having someone over 30 and a KB player, but a lot of punk thought of their rowdy French bassist JJ Burnel as the punkest of punks.

But if they indeed jumped on the bandwagon (their first album dates of autumn 78, about a year after the "original wave" died), the Police heavily relied on reggae, which The Clash did too from London Calling onwards.

Were the early punks wearing "dayglow mohawks, leather jackets, and piercings"? I had the impression that came later, after the "revolution" got co-opted by the major labels and shopping mall owners.

I was referring to the early stuff. If you look at pictures of bands like the Pistols, The Clash, etc, as well as the CBGB's bands, they were wearing ripped up clothes, held together by safety pins, etc. There was nothing "glam" about that.

Yup, early punks could've looked like extremely poor Pub Rock fashion, like Dr Feelgood or The Stranglers, wearing jeans and leather jackets... or in The Jam's case, even suits. Much like their forebayers (3 albums out by the end of 77) The Ramones were wearing, but with much shorter hairdos

But Malcolm McLaren was there right from the start, with his Vivien Westwood "GF" and their fashion store selling badges and T-shirts and it caught like wildfire, because the highly volatle british crowds always loved to dress-up for their music. Unlike the Frisco hippies (broke, dirty, sometimes sick - clap-ridden - and torn-clothed runaways), the UK hippies were trendy upper-middle class dressed in expensive designer clothes and hanging around the Swinging London, spewing out loads of cash to get in trendy clubs like The UFO or The Roundhouse... In many ways, McLaren was more a profiter with the Sex Pistols like Andy Warhol was in NY and the VU.

I mean, there was also a real cultural revolution happening in the Swinging London of 67/68, but it was more in the journalists (International Times and Oz)and the artistes/muzos that did it, rather than the crowds like in California or Detroit or Chicago. The Paris and Prague revolutions were rather different, not driven by some kind of musical revolution (France's music scene in 68 was just "yé-yé" - despite Daevid Allen creating his first incarnation of Gong a few km away from the barricades.

[Zalmoxe]

"Luckily they made every album identifiable with the godawful Roger Dean designed covers so there was no way you could buy one by accident and you could warn your mum. If by chance you do want to buy them its a credit to Yes that you can buy their whole back catalogue in secondhand record stores for about £5 as people realizing later on in life what shite they had bought turned them in their thousands"

[arturs]

^^^ You know, the guys who wrote these blog posts linked in the OP seem more like prog-fan trolls to me more than they do real punks. First, they *know* way too much about prog than any punk should. Second, their arguments are over-the-top caricatures of every anti-prog album review you've ever read. What real punk would bother to read Jon Anderson's gatefold notes in Topographic?

[bigjohnwayne]

Much of the CBGB crop of bands were quite arty, albeit in a very different way than prog was arty.


Of course, you guys all know that.

I'm mainly just trying to look cool by namedropping Marquee Moon by Television. Which is a great album by a great band. The vocals are kinda garbage, but, hey--that's most prog bands too.

[Zappathustra]

I just love it when a quality band with clear punk connections pops up, then it's immediately "they're not real punks" time.

It reminds me of a friend of mine who tries to convince me that Soft Machine or even King Crimson isn't "real prog". Because she hates prog, and therefore if she likes these bands they're not prog.

The punk aesthetic is much wider and far more significant than what some of us would like to admit. And it definitely wasn't over within 2-3 years. It permeated the whole 80's music in various ways.

But I forgot that 80's is bad...

I am listening to Chrome - Alien Soundtracks right just now, and I don't hear any complex chords or divine melodies, but it is a hell of a record. I'd take this any given day over Styx or Marillon. But they're not "real punks". And I am not a "real prog fan".

[Progbear]

I am listening to Chrome - Alien Soundtracks right just now, and I don't hear any complex chords or divine melodies, but it is a hell of a record. I'd take this any given day over Styx or Marillon. But they're not "real punks". And I am not a "real prog fan".

Oh, me too. I love that album. It transcends labels like “prog” or “punk.” If it has a genre, it’s “weird shit.”

[Zappathustra]

Oh, me too. I love that album. It transcends labels like “prog” or “punk.” If it has a genre, it’s “weird shit.”

I would even handle the Polymoog in there Bear!

[JKL2000]

Elvis Costello recently "composed" a BALLET he called "Ill Sogno" - how's that for pretentiousness? pretty high I say...

I just looked this up. The score was commissioned by a dance company. I'd have written it too if someone offered to pay me for it. Of course, it would have been awful.

[vmartell]

I just looked this up. The score was commissioned by a dance company. I'd have written it too if someone offered to pay me for it. Of course, it would have been awful.

As per the punk ethos he should have rejected the commission! He should have said:

"A ballet? BAH - No way! that is pretentious! - now excuse me I need to call Burt Bacharach"

v

[The Dark Elf]

I just looked this up. The score was commissioned by a dance company. I'd have written it too if someone offered to pay me for it. Of course, it would have been awful.

"The Dance of the Middle-aged Couch-Sitters: A Horizontal Ballet"

[Paulrus]

The punk aesthetic is much wider and far more significant than what some of us would like to admit. And it definitely wasn't over within 2-3 years. It permeated the whole 80's music in various ways.

When I was a senior in high school (1982) I worked in a deli with another guy who managed a punk band that played around the Long Beach area. They were more surf-punk, but in California that trend lasted for years. Black Flag and X were quite popular in So Cal for eons. They still are with a sizable core audience (which then begat Green Day, et al.)