The current MLB rules treat a catch the same whether the ball is fair or foul with regard to reaching over or falling over a fence/stands. I have seen no valid argument for bball to change that consistent rule and add confusion and another "catch rule" controversy in pro sports.
Fuck the current rules.
"The White Zone is for loading and unloading only. If you got to load or unload go to the White Zone!"
"The White Zone is for loading and unloading only. If you got to load or unload go to the White Zone!"
"The White Zone is for loading and unloading only. If you got to load or unload go to the White Zone!"
Okay, let me try to make it a bit more clear:
I countered that I was discussing balls in play and HR territory, not fair and foul. You were mistaken.
So, yes, even you can make a mistake. Get over yourself.
Oh yeah, the obligatory
Now, can we move on?
"The White Zone is for loading and unloading only. If you got to load or unload go to the White Zone!"
We can move on quite easily as soon as you acknowledge that I do comment and have commented on my fallibility here when warranted and I'm not sure I've ever seen you do that, Ron. But, relatively speaking, there are enough assholes far worse than you or me on this site, so fuck it.
No obligatory emoticon.
"My choice early in life was either to be a piano player in a whorehouse or a politician, and to tell the truth, there's hardly any difference"
President Harry S. Truman
Oh, I've been wrong many times and will continue to be. I didn't realize you followed me so closely, though.
"The White Zone is for loading and unloading only. If you got to load or unload go to the White Zone!"
It seems to me that either situation (catching a foul ball in the stands or a home run in the stands) constitute making an effort to catch a ball in play. If an out is recorded when someone tumbles into the stands catching it, an out should be recorded if a player were to do the same catching what would have been a home run. The height of the outfield fences in almost all ML parks make the latter unlikely in the extreme, though.
David
Happy with what I have to be happy with.
Good grief. Can we not discuss anything without argument? C'mon, guys.
FWIW, I do agree with Ron, here. I would treat a foul ball and a HR differently. There is no need to keep a foul ball in play - it's foul, regardless. A home run, on the other hand, is only a home run because it doesn't land on the field of play. It safely travels over the fence, out of play. Therefore, if a player catches the ball but doesn't prevent it from leaving the field of play, it should be considered a home run. In my opinion. The goal of the fielder is to keep the ball in play. The fielder doesn't have that goal on a foul ball.
Music isn't about chops, or even about talent - it's about sound and the way that sound communicates to people. Mike Keneally
But when does a ball leave the field of play? Is when it touches the ground (or a fan) beyond the fence, or is it an NFL-like "crosses the plane" thing? Asking honestly.
David
Happy with what I have to be happy with.
Never understood the catch counting when you fall out of the field of play, may as well stand in the seats and catch it, in cricket if you catch it at the boundary but go over the rope its a 6.
Ian
Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on progrock.com
https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-a...re-happy-hour/
Gordon Haskell - "You've got to keep the groove in your head and play a load of bollocks instead"
I blame Wynton, what was the question?
There are only 10 types of people in the World, those who understand binary and those that don't.
But there is a distinction between catching a ball in play while leaping or falling and having your momentum carry you into the stands or over a fence, and simply leaving the field of play and running up into the stands to catch a ball. You can't do the latter. I get the impression from some comments here that people think the 3B can go sit in the 1st row and catch a foul ball for an out. I hope they realize that you can't do that. Nor can you stand behind the OF wall and catch a HR ball for an out. This is how the NFL catch rule got all screwed up. People trying to account for and legislate the one in a million unlikely scenario, and changing perfectly understandable rules to account for those few rare situations. The rule is fine and doesn't need changing. It's consistent and has worked for decades.
Hockey uses an imaginary plane as the demarcation for a score, as does football. Baseball does not. Otherwise every single "reach over the fence" foul ball caught would not really be outs, and every spectacular leaping reach over the OF wall game saving catch depriving someone of a HR would also have to be called HRs and not catches, because reaching over "breaks the plane." Surely you understand that distinction.
If bball had a "break the plane" rule, imagine the endless ridiculous replay reviews that would spawn as umps standing in the IF would now have to judge if a catch was made before it "broke the plane of the wall" for a HR or not (and to determine if a foul ball broke the plane of the fence/wall). It would be absurd.
Last edited by DocProgger; 07-06-2018 at 11:34 AM.
Sure. I completely understand the distinction. But do you understand the similarities?
The goalie's job is to keep the puck out of the net. Part of the fielder's goal is to keep the ball in play.
I get the argument on both sides. But I just think that, if the ball lands on the other side of the fence, it should be a home run - regardless of whether it's in a fielder's glove or not. Once the ball leaves the field of play (or lands outside of the field of play, if you prefer), it should be a home run.
Music isn't about chops, or even about talent - it's about sound and the way that sound communicates to people. Mike Keneally
I don't see any need for all sports to have the same rules. They are different sports.
So you really are arguing for a "break the plane" rule, and not just talking about the one in a million situation where a player catches a HR ball and lands over the fence holding the ball? (which is what I thought your original Q was about). Just think about the can of worms that would open up and the increase in even more replay reviews. No thanks.
Music isn't about chops, or even about talent - it's about sound and the way that sound communicates to people. Mike Keneally
Regardless of which side of the fence you're on (I thought of that all by myself), this discussion has definitely run its course.
"My choice early in life was either to be a piano player in a whorehouse or a politician, and to tell the truth, there's hardly any difference"
President Harry S. Truman
Ok, then I guess I'm missing the point of the hockey goalie analogy. So even if the player successfully catches the ball while leaping in the field of play, and secures the ball in his glove and never drops it, if he somehow lands over the fence due to his momentum from running/leaping still holding the ball in glove, you want that to be called a HR. And that would include a few minor league catches I think I've seen where a player caught the ball robbing someone of a HR, crashing into the fence which then broke/fell apart, yet still held onto the ball. Because the fence failed, you would have to call that a HR because the ball "landed" on the other side (still in the glove). To me it's simply a catch is a catch, but we'll have to agree to disagree.
Last edited by DocProgger; 07-06-2018 at 12:49 PM.
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