Crest of a Knave - 30 Years Old

[Sputnik]

I like it. It's really grown on me while I've been listening to the later Tull catalogue. Granted that's an ahistorical context so 2 caveats: still not sold on "She Said She Was a Dancer" by Jethro Straits, and my favorite cut was not on the intial LP release - Dogs in the Midwinter. I think that's as good as any classic Tull...

It was the lack of Dogs in the Midwinter and Waking Edge on the LP that finally convinced me to get a CD player. Crest of a Knave was the first CD I bought, and I got it along with Tull's 20th Anniversary set plus a couple of others, I've forgotten now which but they were reissues of things I had on vinyl. But think I still have all of them, certainly CoaK and the 20th set, both of which I love. Shortly thereafter, I ditched all my vinyl and it was CD all the way for me after that, so thank you CoaK, I guess.

I said it before, but I'll say it again. I hear the Dire Straits similarity. I actually noticed it when I first heard Farm on the Freeway on the radio, as much in the guitar playing as the singing. I certainly noticed it on lots of tracks when I got the album. But it has never bothered me, because I like the songs, very much including Said She Was a Dancer, which I also enjoy playing and singing on my acoustic guitar (along with Waking Edge). As I also said before, in this album I hear the last gasp of the 70s Tull sound and ambition, and that comes through as clearly to me as the Dire Straits sound. So, Dire-Straitsy or not, this remains quintessentially a Tull album to me.

The song I scratch my head about is Part of the Machine. I think that's every bit as good a song as some on the album, and it's odd to me it was left off. I think it should have been used for the follow-up, Rock Island, where it easily could have, and imo should have, replaced any number of tracks. I tried for years to like Rock Island, but finally gave up. Oh well.

Bill

[Mister Triscuits]

The song I scratch my head about is Part of the Machine. I think that's every bit as good a song as some on the album, and it's odd to me it was left off. I think it should have been used for the follow-up, Rock Island, where it easily could have, and imo should have, replaced any number of tracks.

"Part of the Machine" was recorded in 1988 especially for the 20 Years box set. So it couldn't have been included on CoaK, and it would have been a bit of a gyp to repeat it on Rock Island (even though it's better than anything on that album, IMO).

[arturs]

I tried for years to like Rock Island, but finally gave up. Oh well.

Pretty much my experience as well... But here's the unique thing about Rock Island: I keep *trying*. At this point it is almost 30 years old; it is what it is and it isn't going to change. But every year or so I still think maybe this time I'll get it and I pull it out again. Because it has seemed so close to clicking for me. When I haven't heard RI for a year or two I have really good memories of it. But then when I actually sit down and listen to it, the reaction is always "meh".

[Sputnik]

"Part of the Machine" was recorded in 1988 especially for the 20 Years box set. So it couldn't have been included on CoaK, and it would have been a bit of a gyp to repeat it on Rock Island (even though it's better than anything on that album, IMO).

I see. I thought it was recorded during CoaK sessions. That makes sense now.

Pretty much my experience as well... But here's the unique thing about Rock Island: I keep *trying*. At this point it is almost 30 years old; it is what it is and it isn't going to change. But every year or so I still think maybe this time I'll get it and I pull it out again. Because it has seemed so close to clicking for me. When I haven't heard RI for a year or two I have really good memories of it. But then when I actually sit down and listen to it, the reaction is always "meh".

Yes, my experience exactly. I have no time for "meh" music, in fact I wind up spending way too much time trying to like stuff I don't really like, which keeps me from the stuff I do like. This is why I purge stuff regularly and try to keep my collection focused on things I like rather than things I have for completeness sake.

I don't miss any of the post CoaK Tull albums that I had but got rid of. I occasionally re-sample RtB, which always gets praised here. I always walk away scratching my head. There's more on that album that I actively dislike than I like. I'm glad others connect with it, but it just isn't for me. But many folks have the same reaction toward CoaK, which I love. So it goes.

Bill

[Fracktured]

The last great Tull album. It was a great comeback after a few ok albums. Loved the tour also. The show I saw was with Fairport Convention. I believe the did the whole tour with them with Pegg pulling double duty. They used the violinist from Fairport on Budapest like the album. I frequently revisit it.


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[3LockBox]

Just to be clear, I thought I heard a lot of Dire Straits similarities on CoaK but still played the hell out of it. I had older acquaintances who hated it for multiple reasons. But then again they hated most all '70s artists in the '80s. Robert Plant's Now and Zen a year later was roundly derided in my running circles but got heavy play in my car - talk about yer dated production.

[Fracktured]

It was the lack of Dogs in the Midwinter and Waking Edge on the LP that finally convinced me to get a CD player. Crest of a Knave was the first CD I bought, and I got it along with Tull's 20th Anniversary set plus a couple of others, I've forgotten now which but they were reissues of things I had on vinyl. But think I still have all of them, certainly CoaK and the 20th set, both of which I love. Shortly thereafter, I ditched all my vinyl and it was CD all the way for me after that, so thank you CoaK, I guess.

I said it before, but I'll say it again. I hear the Dire Straits similarity. I actually noticed it when I first heard Farm on the Freeway on the radio, as much in the guitar playing as the singing. I certainly noticed it on lots of tracks when I got the album. But it has never bothered me, because I like the songs, very much including Said She Was a Dancer, which I also enjoy playing and singing on my acoustic guitar (along with Waking Edge). As I also said before, in this album I hear the last gasp of the 70s Tull sound and ambition, and that comes through as clearly to me as the Dire Straits sound. So, Dire-Straitsy or not, this remains quintessentially a Tull album to me.

The song I scratch my head about is Part of the Machine. I think that's every bit as good a song as some on the album, and it's odd to me it was left off. I think it should have been used for the follow-up, Rock Island, where it easily could have, and imo should have, replaced any number of tracks. I tried for years to like Rock Island, but finally gave up. Oh well.

Bill

By 1984 I was purchasing everything on CD only. A move which now I wish I hadn't. I wish I had CoaK on vinyl also. In the early days of CD's they released the vinyl version about 2 weeks before the CD version came out. I would even hold out those 2 weeks before buying it on CD even though some albums I was desperately wanting to have right away. I think there's 2 or 3 songs on Rock Island I kind of like but nothing really grabbed me. In fact none of the Tull albums after this blew me away including the Ian Anderson solo stuff.

[Vic2012]

I played COAK this afternoon. First time in years. Same opinion, good Tull album but not crazy about all the songs. Favorite track is Farm On The Freeway. Other tracks are good like Budapest, Raising Steam, Mountain Men. Not a Tull album I reach for often (I don't reach for Tull much anyway) but it is worth keeping. Plus I think Martin Barre is fantastic on this album.

[The Dark Elf]

The last Tull album I gave a damn about. "Jump Start", "Budapest" and "Farm on the Freeway" are all excellent Tull tunes. Afterwards, I liked individual songs but never whole albums. The '87 Tull tour was phenomenal, backed as they were with Fairport Convention.

[dropforge]

I like it. [...] and my favorite cut was not on the intial LP release - Dogs in the Midwinter. I think that's as good as any classic Tull...

Yes, a great song that you didn't get with the (haha) cassette! A far better song than anything on the actual album, which I do like. Funny thing about the Straits references, the other bonus track, "The Waking Edge," sounds to me more Straitsy than anything else, especially Ian's vocal.

[dropforge]

The last Tull album I gave a damn about. "Jump Start", "Budapest" and "Farm on the Freeway" are all excellent Tull tunes. Afterwards, I liked individual songs but never whole albums. The '87 Tull tour was phenomenal, backed as they were with Fairport Convention.

Wish I'd caught that. I did see them on the Rock Island tour, with some new band called It Bites as the warm-up.

[Frankh]

The last Tull album I gave a damn about. "Jump Start", "Budapest" and "Farm on the Freeway" are all excellent Tull tunes. Afterwards, I liked individual songs but never whole albums. The '87 Tull tour was phenomenal, backed as they were with Fairport Convention.

I did see this tour and will back you up . Phenomenal. I remember the billing being Fairport Friends, who joined Tull onstage at some point. First half of Tull's set was acoustic, then the second half a continuous fifty minute medley that climaxed satisfyingly 'neath a banner unfurled to read "Oh, no! Not another twenty years of Jethro Tull!"


...and the crowd went wild!...

[Sputnik]

Wish I'd caught that. I did see them on the Rock Island tour, with some new band called It Bites as the warm-up.

The 87 tour with Fairport really was awesome. I though they really did a good job with the setlist, mixing stuff from Crest with older classics. This was actually my first time seeing Tull. I saw them several times after, but they never bettered this performance in my mind. Dave Pegg was a standout, seeming to thrive on double-duty.

I saw them on the Rock Island tour. As I said above, I thought the album largely sucked, but the tour was pretty good. I remember the performance of Whaler's Dues, which I thought definitely added to the impact of that rather turgid track. I liked the visuals on the screen for Kissing Wille too. I think this is the last arena/large theater show I saw that was geared at really promoting a new album. After that, it was all more "generic." Even KC and Yes, who had new albums, seemed to have less focus for the tour on that specific material.

Whatever. Glad I caught Tull in 87, I feel I caught a whiff of their 70s greatness, which after this was gone for good.

Bill

[Mister Triscuits]

I did see this tour and will back you up . Phenomenal. I remember the billing being Fairport Friends, who joined Tull onstage at some point.

That was actually the next tour, in 1988. (The Crest of a Knave tour had Don Airey on keyboards; the 20 Years tour had Martin Allcock.) Fairport Friends started out as just the duo of Simon Nicol and Ric Sanders, who as their set went on were joined by the shared Tull members Dave Pegg, Martin Allcock, and Doane Perry.

[Frankh]

That was actually the next tour, in 1988. (The Crest of a Knave tour had Don Airey on keyboards; the 20 Years tour had Martin Allcock.) Fairport Friends started out as just the duo of Simon Nicol and Ric Sanders, who as their set went on were joined by the shared Tull members Dave Pegg, Martin Allcock, and Doane Perry.

Ah, thank you. The years, you know. The years they cloud perception. Alter it, even.

Still a great show, if any of my mnemonic circuitry can be trusted any longer.

That second set, man.

Rocked.

[arturs]

Yes, a great song that you didn't get with the (haha) cassette! A far better song than anything on the actual album, which I do like. Funny thing about the Straits references, the other bonus track, "The Waking Edge," sounds to me more Straitsy than anything else, especially Ian's vocal.

I originally had the CoaK cassette, back in '87 or '88. And I don't remember those songs. Wikipedia says they were on the original cassette and CD, but only omitted from the LP. But it sounds like based on what you are saying that's not true. If you are right, when I listened to the album yesterday on YT, that would explain why it sounded quite different from what I remember.

FWIW my fresh listen revealed, as for many of you, that Farm on the Freeway is indeed the standout track. Could have been a keeper on Heavy Horses for example. The Straitisms are just annoying enough for me to degrade the overall listening experience, and Budapest is still way too damn long. We get it, Ian, you meet some interesting women on tour...

[Facelift]

I originally had the CoaK cassette, back in '87 or '88. And I don't remember those songs. Wikipedia says they were on the original cassette and CD, but only omitted from the LP. But it sounds like based on what you are saying that's not true. If you are right, when I listened to the album yesterday on YT, that would explain why it sounded quite different from what I remember.

Waking Edge and Dogs in Midwinter were not on the cassette (I have the cassette). The were CD-only "bonus" tracks, which were intended to entice purchase of the higher-margin CD product (which I think sold for like $15 or $16 30 years ago - yikes).

[Mister Triscuits]

Waking Edge and Dogs in Midwinter were not on the cassette (I have the cassette). The were CD-only "bonus" tracks, which were intended to entice purchase of the higher-margin CD product (which I think sold for like $15 or $16 30 years ago - yikes).

Those tracks were omitted from the U.S. cassette, but they were included on the U.K. and other European cassette editions.

[Facelift]

Those tracks were omitted from the U.S. cassette, but they were included on the U.K. and other European cassette editions.

Oh. Didn't know.

[Zinister]

Good album, but I don´t own it anymore. I don´t have the time to listen to everything anymore. Getting too old

[Scrotum Scissor]

One of the better prog-oriented albums of the mid 80s IMO.

"Farm on the Freeway" and "Budapest" are alright. But there were dozens and dozens of utterly superb "prog-oriented albums of the mid 80s", and AFAIC no single 70s act were responsible for any of them.

Their time had already long since come and gone. And now we're 30 years on.

[Zinister]

"Farm on the Freeway" and "Budapest" are alright. But there were dozens and dozens of utterly superb "prog-oriented albums of the mid 80s", and AFAIC no single 70s act were responsible for any of them.

Their time had already long since come and gone. And now we're 30 years on.

So true

[Trane]

I originally had the CoaK cassette, back in '87 or '88. And I don't remember those songs. Wikipedia says they were on the original cassette and CD, but only omitted from the LP. But it sounds like based on what you are saying that's not true. If you are right, when I listened to the album yesterday on YT, that would explain why it sounded quite different from what I remember.

FWIW my fresh listen revealed, as for many of you, that Farm on the Freeway is indeed the standout track. Could have been a keeper on Heavy Horses for example. The Straitisms are just annoying enough for me to degrade the overall listening experience, and Budapest is still way too damn long. We get it, Ian, you meet some interesting women on tour...

I was in a jazz phase and buying very little rock vinyls back then (so I didn't buy CoaK), and I didn't switch to CD until 92/3, but you mean that there three bonus tracks on the remastered CD compared to the original vinyl?

In 87, the onlynew rock music vinyls were probably Joshua Tree and Wondeur Brass, but I probably bought a lot of second-hand 70's stuff.

[dropforge]

Those tracks were omitted from the U.S. cassette, but they were included on the U.K. and other European cassette editions.

Even back then, Crest seemed kind of light on songs. And that's why. Side B had only three. If they had at least opened Side B with "Dogs in the Midwinter," it would've helped tons.

[Trane]

Even back then, Crest seemed kind of light on songs. And that's why. Side B had only three. If they had at least opened Side B with "Dogs in the Midwinter," it would've helped tons.

according to the track length of the original LP, the three tracks on the flipside add up to a longer playing length (+/- 20 mins) than the four of the A-side, but in general the overall album length remains normal for a vinyl (from 35' to 45')