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Thread: Vezhlivy Otkaz recent concert footage

  1. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Zappathustra View Post
    Because you ARE on earth, and this is the ultimate displacement and not-remembering that could ever happen to anybody.
    Alright, 'thustra-man. I'll rephrase it, then:

    One of those rare instances and experiences where you think on first listen that perhaps you've actually known this music all your life - before asking why the FUCKING HELL-SHIT you would ever displace it and not remember.

    Seriously, I gave this album on to a coworker of mine who's a Russian-language major, as well as a former girlfriend of mine from the Ukraine; none of them had any affility whatsoever to "deep" rock music, but both were completely transfixed by lyrics, vibe and various cultural references (history, psychology, religion) in this. It's a totally transcendent type of music; virtuosic to the core only if you're in the "know", otherwise utterly non-exhibitionist at that. "Buryatsea Song" is a stupendously haunting piece of work, sporting some counterpoint beyond belief which aren't even heard if you aren't aware of what they are and do as common tricks. And they play this shit with *so much* apparent ease snd conviction, it's almost frightening.

    Even that finishing acoustic-guitar piece is stunningly layered.

    Well, I'm off to see Trond (from Panzerpappa) over beers; haven't spoken to him in a while. Be sure to check his recent release with sideproject Suburban Savages - it's a quirky art-pop treat.
    Last edited by Scrotum Scissor; 11-04-2017 at 09:17 AM.
    "Improvisation is not an excuse for musical laziness" - Fred Frith
    "[...] things that we never dreamed of doing in Crimson or in any band that I've been in," - Tony Levin speaking of SGM

  2. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrotum Scissor View Post
    Alright, 'thustra-man. I'll rephrase it, then:

    One of those rare instances and experiences where you think on first listen that perhaps you've actually known this music all your life - before asking why the FUCKING HELL-SHIT you would ever displace it and not remember.
    That's far better. Everything is better when swearing comes in.

  3. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Zappathustra View Post
    Everything is better when swearing comes in.
    And violence!
    "Improvisation is not an excuse for musical laziness" - Fred Frith
    "[...] things that we never dreamed of doing in Crimson or in any band that I've been in," - Tony Levin speaking of SGM

  4. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrotum Scissor
    "Buryatsea Song" is a stupendously haunting piece of work, sporting some counterpoint beyond belief which aren't even heard if you aren't aware of what they are and do as common tricks. And they play this shit with *so much* apparent ease snd conviction, it's almost frightening.
    This is their best song IMO. Everything that's good about Vezhlivy Otkaz is there in the condensed form.

    Even that finishing acoustic-guitar piece is stunningly layered.
    The new album ends with a short acoustic instrumental piece again, but overall it is MUCH more loud and electric than Geese & Swans. That one was a "rural" album, this one is "urban", that one was about peace and nature (Suslov has been living on the countryside for many years), this one is about war and combat. So expect a lot of jagged, clashing electric guitar vs trumpet battles on this one.

  5. #30
    I'm here for the moosic NogbadTheBad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scrotum Scissor View Post

    Well, I'm off to see Trond (from Panzerpappa) over beers; haven't spoken to him in a while. Be sure to check his recent release with sideproject Suburban Savages - it's a quirky art-pop treat.
    Quirky pop-art is right, it's very good, bought it when it came out, Anders & Nina are RIO regulars.
    Ian

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  6. #31
    Member thedunno's Avatar
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    Album should be distributed by Altrock before end of the year.

  7. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Levgan View Post
    In this case, you'd be better off checking out some of the more lyric-heavy stuff from the 1980s and 1990s – the fresh War Songs material doesn't have too many lyrics per se, most of the stuff there is done in a glossolalia / voice-as-another-instrument format.
    Is that what's going on on the track "Lz" from Gusi - Lebedi? That doesn't sound like Russian to me. My Russian degree was over 30 years ago, mind.

  8. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by thedunno View Post
    Album should be distributed by Altrock before end of the year.
    That's great news. I have Gusi -Lebedi (on CD) and the Melodiya LP (in digital form), but I really don't remember where I got them from. It would be good to be able to buy through a familiar source.

    And, coming from a Cardiacs perspective, one has to ask: are ALL of their geese swans?

  9. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by spacewaltzer View Post
    That's great news. I have Gusi -Lebedi (on CD) and the Melodiya LP (in digital form), but I really don't remember where I got them from. It would be good to be able to buy through a familiar source.

    And, coming from a Cardiacs perspective, one has to ask: are ALL of their geese swans?
    Yes they are. And with a little extra marching touch and some catchy (almost childishly sing-along) themes on the new Otkaz album, you can bet they are again.

    It's a strange world recently, where no one would dare to get them out to some Western RIO fest or even short tour, despite them being a hell of a live band. I've spoken to Roman Suslov a few years ago and he wasn't very enthusiastic about the chances. Someone might still pick it up with some well-considered offer before they retire for good?

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jibber and Twitch View Post
    It's a strange world recently, where no one would dare to get them out to some Western RIO fest or even short tour, despite them being a hell of a live band.
    Why not?

    Is anybody going to consider them responsible for their country's activities and policies? Or the promoter for supporting those same activities and policies? Are people really that dim? I suppose they are.

    For that matter: I find it interesting that, even though Roman Suslov is (I believe) considered an excellent lyricist, he chose to use his voice as a lyric-less instrument on War Songs. Which might be simultaneously an act of self-preservation and a commentary on how, in Putin's Russia, it is no longer safe to sing about what you want to sing about and what needs to be sung about. And so he makes that point by not singing about anything at all.

  11. #36
    I'm here for the moosic NogbadTheBad's Avatar
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    So I've had the new one, Military Verses, for about a week now having bought the download from the bands site. It is really rather excellent, right up there with Geese & Swans, which is probably one of my favorite albums of the last decade. Edgier and more angular than G&S still having all the usual sounds you expect from them. Will certainly be in my top 5 on the year. Will probably buy the CD when it makes its way to Wayside as they are usually pretty nice packages. What I'd really like is a DVD of the 2010 Dom Cultural Center concert that's up on Youtube. It's probably my favorite band footage.
    Ian

    Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on progrock.com
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    Gordon Haskell - "You've got to keep the groove in your head and play a load of bollocks instead"
    I blame Wynton, what was the question?
    There are only 10 types of people in the World, those who understand binary and those that don't.

  12. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by NogbadTheBad View Post
    So I've had the new one, Military Verses, for about a week now having bought the download from the bands site.
    So how was buying from the band's site? I can understand the Russian fine, but I was wondering what the payment mechanism was. Just a bit nervous about putting credit card information on a Russian website.

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by spacewaltzer View Post
    So how was buying from the band's site? I can understand the Russian fine, but I was wondering what the payment mechanism was. Just a bit nervous about putting credit card information on a Russian website.
    I used paypal.
    Ian

    Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on progrock.com
    https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-a...re-happy-hour/

    Gordon Haskell - "You've got to keep the groove in your head and play a load of bollocks instead"
    I blame Wynton, what was the question?
    There are only 10 types of people in the World, those who understand binary and those that don't.

  14. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Baribrotzer View Post
    Why not?

    Is anybody going to consider them responsible for their country's activities and policies? Or the promoter for supporting those same activities and policies? Are people really that dim? I suppose they are.

    For that matter: I find it interesting that, even though Roman Suslov is (I believe) considered an excellent lyricist, he chose to use his voice as a lyric-less instrument on War Songs. Which might be simultaneously an act of self-preservation and a commentary on how, in Putin's Russia, it is no longer safe to sing about what you want to sing about and what needs to be sung about. And so he makes that point by not singing about anything at all.
    Why not? It's mostly a business issue. As far as i know, no organizers to show the detailed interest and bring the band to the Western audiences as of yet. And it's not impossible these days. There's one Israeli promoter dealing with experimental music - Victor Levin. He is the one that brought them to Israel about 3 times in recent years, and they are even flexible enough to come with a full line-up or shortened line-up - depends on an economic factor. Victor is a fan, and there's a bit of ex-USSR audience in Israel that is familiar and in love with Otkaz for many years. So, if anyone is there to signal to the European organizers of relevant music events, it might still be not too late.

    As of politics and lyrics, the reason for the voice as lyric-less instrument is more because of Suslov is getting tired with making too much specific sense with a wordy structures, it's literally like in Zappa's title "stop making sense". Suslov usually seeks to get away from narratives into some kind of abstract forms, paying more attention to the way the words sound, and the glossolalia is one of them. And it's not that much related to Putin's Russia or whatever. Even if Suslov would do some directed and personal anti-something message, i don't think it would change that much. For starters, because the bands like Otkaz have too little of the wide public influence in the eyes of a government to even care about and pay any attention.
    Last edited by Jibber and Twitch; 11-29-2017 at 05:56 AM.
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  15. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by spacewaltzer
    Is that what's going on on the track "Lz" from Gusi - Lebedi?
    Yes. And there's more of it on the new record.

    Quote Originally Posted by Baribrotzer
    Roman Suslov is (I believe) considered an excellent lyricist
    He's alright as a lyricist, I guess, with some nice verses to his credit (and a few clunkers too), but he always insisted that this is a difficult part for him, and it's no coincidence that quite a few of VO's lyrics are penned by guest poets (kinda like Keith Reid in Procol Harum or Betty Thatcher in Renaissance) such as Arkadiy Semenov or Grigoriy Dashevskiy. Lately, Suslov said that he gets gradually more and more opposed to the very concept of fixed lyrics in a song – one of the reasons cited is that they make a song itself appear fixed, while he is more interested in further developing even those tracks that have already long been in the repertoire. Another reason see below...

    Quote Originally Posted by Baribrotzer
    he chose to use his voice as a lyric-less instrument on War Songs. Which might be simultaneously an act of self-preservation and a commentary on how, in Putin's Russia, it is no longer safe to sing about what you want to sing about and what needs to be sung about. And so he makes that point by not singing about anything at all.
    Not really. Vezhlivyi Otkaz can sing all they want – they are a cult band for those in the know, with very few TV or radio appearances and small but devoted fanbase, so no one is going to censor their lyrics for the time being. The reason why there are so very few sung texts on War Songs a.k.a. Military Verses is that the album itself refers to war as an archetype, as a concept within the Russian "collective unconscious", rather than to any specific war – and since in 2017 Russia any statement on the subject of military conflicts is almost certain to be questioned in the context of "who do you side with?", sticking to glossolalia and wordless vocalizing is a smart way to avoid that. So, at the end of the day, there probably is a connection with current state of affairs here in my neck of woods, but one that is way more subtle than implied by your comment.

    Quote Originally Posted by NogbadTheBad
    What I'd really like is a DVD of the 2010 Dom Cultural Center concert that's up on Youtube. It's probably my favorite band footage.
    I was there!

  16. #41
    Yep. I actually remember that one recent interview, sorry for very non perfect translation of his quotes, but those might shed some more light on his current position:

    "Same with lyrics. Basically i was never satisfied with them, their incompatibility to the music. They were pushing too much of attention, being too meaningful/expressive. So i started to avoid text more and more, because words play a destructive role sometimes, at least in case of going with my music - that's for sure. It's hard to imagine the sharp and edgy musical thing where words would sound in harmony with it. The word is destructive for music, so it seems".

    About any political or social influence of the recent times on Military Verses:
    "Otkaz is still the band that sticks aside of that. And i'm very glad about it. No outside events or cataclysms are contributing to the foundation of our creative output"

    https://iz.ru/news/674348
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  17. #42
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    We got to a second page on a Vezhlivy Otkaz thread!! YAY!
    Ian

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    https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-a...re-happy-hour/

    Gordon Haskell - "You've got to keep the groove in your head and play a load of bollocks instead"
    I blame Wynton, what was the question?
    There are only 10 types of people in the World, those who understand binary and those that don't.

  18. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Jibber and Twitch
    https://iz.ru/news/674348
    Never thought I'd live to see a link to Izvestia on PE! My life will never be the same again

  19. #44
    I'm here for the moosic NogbadTheBad's Avatar
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    Just seen that their 3 piece version are going to be playing a festival in the USA next June only 5 hours from me! It's a Russian - American festival but what the hell I'm in.
    Ian

    Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on progrock.com
    https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-a...re-happy-hour/

    Gordon Haskell - "You've got to keep the groove in your head and play a load of bollocks instead"
    I blame Wynton, what was the question?
    There are only 10 types of people in the World, those who understand binary and those that don't.

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by NogbadTheBad View Post
    Just seen that their 3 piece version are going to be playing a festival in the USA next June only 5 hours from me! It's a Russian - American festival but what the hell I'm in.
    Where? Info?
    Steve F.

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    “Remember, if it doesn't say "Cuneiform," it's not prog!” - THE Jed Levin

    Any time any one speaks to me about any musical project, the one absolute given is "it will not make big money". [tip of the hat to HK]

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  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve F. View Post
    Where? Info?
    Jetlag Festival June 21st to 23rd Downsville NY

    JETLAG-2019: ВЕЖЛИВЫЙ ОТКАЗ ("Polite Refusal")

    We are proud and excited to make our first JetLAG-2019 announcement. Welcome the pioneers of Russian experimental art rock, with their inimitably sophisticated, often almost academic but also most erratic and groovy style, unique signature sound and edgy avant-guard lyrics. Back to US after almost 20-year break, now as a trio. Dmitry Shumilov - bass, vocal, Roman Suslov - guitar, vocal, Mikhail Mitin - drums. Yes, it is they! VEZHLIVY OTKAZ!

    YOU-TOP-EE-YEAH! UTOPIA!
    WELCOME TO JETLAG-2019!

    ���������� ����������������
    ♪ JUNE 21-23, 2019♪
    Tickets on sale at http://jetlagfestival.com/tickets/
    Find out more about us at jetlagfestival.com � instagram.com/jetlagmusicfestival/
    Ian

    Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on progrock.com
    https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-a...re-happy-hour/

    Gordon Haskell - "You've got to keep the groove in your head and play a load of bollocks instead"
    I blame Wynton, what was the question?
    There are only 10 types of people in the World, those who understand binary and those that don't.

  22. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by NogbadTheBad View Post
    ВЕЖЛИВЫЙ ОТКАЗ ("Polite Refusal")

    We are proud and excited to make our first JetLAG-2019 announcement. Welcome the pioneers of Russian experimental art rock, with their inimitably sophisticated, often almost academic but also most erratic and groovy style, unique signature sound and edgy avant-guard lyrics. Back to US after almost 20-year break, now as a trio. Dmitry Shumilov - bass, vocal, Roman Suslov - guitar, vocal, Mikhail Mitin - drums. Yes, it is they! VEZHLIVY OTKAZ!
    That's a great roundup of descriptions!

    Unfortunately, it won't tempt the ones who'd rather hear about the degree to which VO will remind them of their already-favourite 'prog rock' artist from before. But then, who needs 'em?
    "Improvisation is not an excuse for musical laziness" - Fred Frith
    "[...] things that we never dreamed of doing in Crimson or in any band that I've been in," - Tony Levin speaking of SGM

  23. #48
    Member thedunno's Avatar
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    The last album of VEZHLIVY OTKAZ is now on bandcamp.

    https://otkaz.bandcamp.com/album/war-songs

    Great ! looking forward to finally hearing it.

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by thedunno View Post
    The last album of VEZHLIVY OTKAZ is now on bandcamp.

    https://otkaz.bandcamp.com/album/war-songs

    Great ! looking forward to finally hearing it.
    It's good, if not quite as sublime as Geese & Swans.
    Ian

    Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on progrock.com
    https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-a...re-happy-hour/

    Gordon Haskell - "You've got to keep the groove in your head and play a load of bollocks instead"
    I blame Wynton, what was the question?
    There are only 10 types of people in the World, those who understand binary and those that don't.

  25. #50
    Member Steve F.'s Avatar
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    The band is doing a few dates in the USA in June - I booked them in DC. Looking forward to seeing them.
    Steve F.

    www.waysidemusic.com
    www.cuneiformrecords.com

    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

    “Remember, if it doesn't say "Cuneiform," it's not prog!” - THE Jed Levin

    Any time any one speaks to me about any musical project, the one absolute given is "it will not make big money". [tip of the hat to HK]

    "Death to false 'support the scene' prog!"

    please add 'imo' wherever you like, to avoid offending those easily offended.

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