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Thread: Dimeadozen.org asking for financial support

  1. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Gruno View Post
    An artist has to find this website and then inform them to not feature their recordings there?

    That's semi-rhetorical, as the process should be Dimeadozen asking the artists if they wish to be featured in their trading community.
    I guess this part could be fuzzy. It's not as if Dime has tons of time to check every upload and personally confirm permission from the performers, any more than musicians have time to track every place a recording might be distributed. That's not to mention that people share recordings going back decades and there's a shit-ton by artists who are dead now. But if there are any remaining opposite-of-Spotify outlets that still genuinely care about respecting artists' wishes and copyrights, this is one of 'em. They aren't making money off anyone's work or undercutting musicians by copying/pirating material that's meant to be sold. Hell, more often than not sometimes, the recordings are muddy enough to push you to seek out the real things for quality alone.

    I don't think copyright applies to songs themselves, just recordings. Is hearing a torrent of a cover band much different from hearing some local band cover something in person at the bar? Neither one needs written permission just to play a song live.

    Dime was the first place I heard the Toy Matinee 5-1-91 show, just to pick an example familiar to this board. I don't remember whether it was a boot of the soundboard or a duplicate audience tape, but it was the reason I jumped to buy the official CD as soon as it was available. Yes, I know we who only buy legit are in a dwindling minority, but nycsteve is right that this at helps lead to sales that otherwise might not happen. There's plenty of stuff the artists want to distribute that wouldn't have as much of an outlet to be heard through less-known channels. Gray areas and all, I think this is a case where the benefits do outweigh the inevitable imperfections.

  2. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by AncientChord View Post
    I believe that all their downloads are in the public domain category many of them being FM radio broadcast or TV broadcasts, which the public have been recording since time immortal.
    They are certainly not in the public domain. A recording has to be 75 years old to even qualify for public domain.
    "The White Zone is for loading and unloading only. If you got to load or unload go to the White Zone!"

  3. #28
    Spiral;
    It's not as if Dime has tons of time to check every upload

    Heres a personal experience on this. I used to record and upload shows on Dime. One time a web aquantaince mailed me a load of shows he wished uploaded and could not do himself, I forget why. It was jazz shows, 20 or so. I picked one at random to start uploading, I forget the artist ,but they were on the not allowed list. It definitely was not an artist that one would think was opposed to this type of thing. My bad , I didn't check the list. BTW it was the only one of the 20 not allowed. I uploaded the torrent, within a minute I was contacted by a user to get it down because the artist was not allowed. With no delay I attempted to remove the show but was already to late. In less than 3-4 minutes site mods removed the show and suspended my account. I pleaded ignorance and stupidity, my account remained suspended for at least 3 monthes, it might have been more. Dime is a tightly run ship, with strictly enforced policy. It is an incredible resource with a trove of early recordings of artists most never knew even existed. IMO worthy of support in their time of need. I ask again, if paypal is out , anyone know how one might contribute if so inclined?

  4. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by nycsteve View Post
    Dime is a tightly run ship, with strictly enforced policy. It is an incredible resource with a trove of early recordings of artists most never knew even existed. IMO worthy of support in their time of need.
    Absolutely agreed. I was only talking about the idea of Dime checking every artist's stance on recording/sharing before an upload, as opposed to waiting for the artists to ask to be on the don't-share list.

  5. #30
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    I gotta say that while there may be a legal grey area regarding Dime, the public good aspect of this site is huge. A couple of years ago someone uploaded several Brazilian TV performances by Hermeto Pascoal for example. While I'm sure no one explicitly asked Hermeto whether this was ok, these shows were downloaded a lot and I have watched them all many times. Jaw-dropping amazing music that I would never have had the chance to see/hear otherwise. I would buy these in a heartbeat if they were ever offered legitimately on DVD, but there's no way that would ever happen with all the damn licensing issues, etc. So Dime is the only way that this great music reaches fans. My guess is Hermeto would probably be pleased if he knew.

  6. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by arturs View Post
    I would buy these in a heartbeat if they were ever offered legitimately on DVD, but there's no way that would ever happen with all the damn licensing issues, etc. So Dime is the only way that this great music reaches fans.
    And, in many ways, that's exactly what it comes down to. Most, if not all, who download these torrents already have all the legit recordings by the bands and are simply starving for more.
    "The White Zone is for loading and unloading only. If you got to load or unload go to the White Zone!"

  7. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by nycsteve View Post
    I ask again, if paypal is out , anyone know how one might contribute if so inclined?
    Ah, I see there's a page on the site about that. It's either through the EZTree shop, Skrill (whatever that is), or with Bitcoins.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spiral View Post
    ...or with Bitcoins.
    gotta get my virtual currency mining rig upgraded then.....
    Death inspires me like a dog inspires a rabbit

  9. #34
    Highly Evolved Orangutan JKL2000's Avatar
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    ^ I don't know. We should each donate a dime.

  10. #35
    Parrots Ripped My Flesh Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
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    1/12th of a Bitdime.

  11. #36
    Highly Evolved Orangutan JKL2000's Avatar
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    To those who oppose the idea of distributing RoIOs in a non-profit way, I will just reiterate what I so often find myself saying here: the best live Pink Floyd recordings are RoIOs. If you refuse to listen to them on moral grounds, you're missing out on the best live PF, very different from the official live releases (which are few to begin with). It's your call though.

  12. #37
    Member Yodelgoat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JKL2000 View Post
    To those who oppose the idea of distributing RoIOs in a non-profit way, I will just reiterate what I so often find myself saying here: the best live Pink Floyd recordings are RoIOs. If you refuse to listen to them on moral grounds, you're missing out on the best live PF, very different from the official live releases (which are few to begin with). It's your call though.
    I dont know how to respond to this kind of thinking. OK, so I write a song and perform it and sell it on CD baby. Someone comes to oe of my shows and records the show, and puts it up on This place... Forget the fact that its my song and that its my image on the screen, Suddenly someone else can take my work and display it out free of charge to anyone and everyone?

    If I wanted to one day release my own version of the show, that person has rendered my ability to sell my own stuff worthless, because he likes it, he hasnt profited from it in any way, but he's killed my future opportunities to do something with something I own. because what I would like to sell, he has made available for free without asking my permission.

    OK so I dont release music, I dont do shows, but if I were, say David Gilmore, I could see that this might be an issue for me. But hey, hes already rich enough right? I should get to choose who is "rich enough" and who isn't. Shouldn't anyones net worth be judged rich or poor by the average dolt on the street, and not by the owner of the product? (no, I'm not calling anyone a dolt here). Well...

    Just sayin'...

  13. #38
    Parrots Ripped My Flesh Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yodelgoat View Post
    if I were, say David Gilmore



  14. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Yodelgoat View Post
    Someone ... records [my] show, and puts it up on This place... ... If I wanted to one day release my own version of the show, that person has rendered my ability to sell my own stuff worthless ... he's killed my future opportunities to do something with something I own. because what I would like to sell, he has made available for free without asking my permission.
    Actually, if you tell This Place you don't want your stuff shared, they won't let anyone share it. Even if you don't ask, This Place would take down any material of yours that gets officially released. Also, someone's audience boot most likely isn't going to sound all that great. But if someone hears a torrent and likes it, there's one more person out there who now knows who you are and has reason to buy the legit recording in better quality straight from you.

    No, it's not always this simple, but it's not nearly as predatory as you're painting it.

  15. #40
    Highly Evolved Orangutan JKL2000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yodelgoat View Post
    I dont know how to respond to this kind of thinking. OK, so I write a song and perform it and sell it on CD baby. Someone comes to oe of my shows and records the show, and puts it up on This place... Forget the fact that its my song and that its my image on the screen, Suddenly someone else can take my work and display it out free of charge to anyone and everyone?

    If I wanted to one day release my own version of the show, that person has rendered my ability to sell my own stuff worthless, because he likes it, he hasnt profited from it in any way, but he's killed my future opportunities to do something with something I own. because what I would like to sell, he has made available for free without asking my permission.

    OK so I dont release music, I dont do shows, but if I were, say David Gilmore, I could see that this might be an issue for me. But hey, hes already rich enough right? I should get to choose who is "rich enough" and who isn't. Shouldn't anyones net worth be judged rich or poor by the average dolt on the street, and not by the owner of the product? (no, I'm not calling anyone a dolt here). Well...

    Just sayin'...
    I get it - this is why I also ask are you morally against the vinyl bootlegs of the 60s and 70s? Because this is the same really, except the vinyl bootlegs WERE done for money, but the music WAS a vital part of a band's "canon" sometimes. BTW, Floyd is on record as saying "listen to the boots - we're not really interested in releasing live albums."

  16. #41
    ALL ACCESS Gruno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spiral View Post
    Actually, if you tell This Place you don't want your stuff shared, they won't let anyone share it.
    Isn't that backwards? Shouldn't they ask the artist first rather than having an artist have to search this site out? How many artists out there have no clue about this site, yet, would not appreciate their stuff being shared?

  17. #42
    Member Plasmatopia's Avatar
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    Of all the harms done to artists via the downloading phenomenon....this seems the least of them by a very long shot. If indeed there is any harm at all.
    <sig out of order>

  18. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Gruno View Post
    Isn't that backwards? Shouldn't they ask the artist first rather than having an artist have to search this site out? How many artists out there have no clue about this site, yet, would not appreciate their stuff being shared?
    Probably a few. In a perfect world, of course it would be easy to reach out to every single artist and check with them beforehand. In our impractical one, Dime has to either err on the side of caution and lose tons of potential uploads, or err on the side of making things available and doing their best (which is impressive) to minimize unwanted sharing. Most of us here seem to agree that the benefits of option 2 outweigh the imperfections.

  19. #44
    Parrots Ripped My Flesh Dave (in MA)'s Avatar
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    Dimeadozen doesn't "make things available", they just provide the site that hosts the trackers. The users host the material, and Dime tries to keep up with policing what's shared, and I think they do a very good job. They should make it easier to donate.

  20. #45
    Member AncientChord's Avatar
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    I just tried to go to Dime and this happened:

    ERROR

    The requested URL could not be retrieved

    While trying to retrieve the URL: http://www.dimeadozen.org/index.php

    The following error was encountered:

    Unable to forward this request at this time.
    This request could not be forwarded to the origin server or to any parent caches. The most likely cause for this error is that:

    The cache administrator does not allow this cache to make direct connections to origin servers, and
    All configured parent caches are currently unreachable.
    Your cache administrator is webmaster@dimeadozen.org.
    Generated Sun, 08 May 2016 00:41:55 GMT by pattismith.dimeadozen.org (squid/2.6.STABLE21)

    Anyone else having this problem? I love Dime. I hope it's not the end!
    Day dawns dark...it now numbers infinity.

  21. #46
    Member rapidfirerob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AncientChord View Post
    I just tried to go to Dime and this happened:

    ERROR

    The requested URL could not be retrieved

    While trying to retrieve the URL: http://www.dimeadozen.org/index.php

    The following error was encountered:

    Unable to forward this request at this time.
    This request could not be forwarded to the origin server or to any parent caches. The most likely cause for this error is that:

    The cache administrator does not allow this cache to make direct connections to origin servers, and
    All configured parent caches are currently unreachable.
    Your cache administrator is webmaster@dimeadozen.org.
    Generated Sun, 08 May 2016 00:41:55 GMT by pattismith.dimeadozen.org (squid/2.6.STABLE21)

    Anyone else having this problem? I love Dime. I hope it's not the end!
    Hopefully just down for maintenance, which is a regular occurrence, though this is not the message I get. Send an email to the address in the message if you like.

  22. #47
    Member Jerjo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ronmac View Post
    And, in many ways, that's exactly what it comes down to. Most, if not all, who download these torrents already have all the legit recordings by the bands and are simply starving for more.
    This! There are several bands/musicians who I have pretty much every legit recording and still crave more. Most of the legacy acts are middling to laughable at releasing live material. They could fill that void but either choose not to or just couldn't be bothered. And don't get me started on BBC recordings or unreleased studio stuff.
    I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down.'- Bob Newhart

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