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Thread: Phil Collins Unretires, Laments that PG won't sing "Invisible Touch"

  1. #51
    Oh Phil, what's the point mate?! You'll just play a lot of pointless Motown covers, songs from your biggest album that 'aren't you', and make us lament about who you once were. And this is from another left handed drummer who based his kit and drumming style on yours up to the Abacab era. Can't fault your love of music , but aahhhhh, well.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rufus View Post
    So what your saying is that if the 70's line up reunited there wouldn't be the same kevel of interest? Personally I think it would exceed it!
    I hate to say this but unfortunately this is total wishful thinking. The level of interest for the 70's line-up in the prog community clearly does not extend to the big world out there.
    PG's presence would make a certain buzz and attract many people who know the trivia fact that he was in the band but are clueless about the music he made with them, but I doubt they would fill the same venues they did or would with the 3-man lineup.
    Not just a Genesis fanboy.

  3. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Firth View Post
    He can play drums, but needs practice.
    He did very little drumming on his last solo tour. The set began with a 15-minute drum duet with Chester, but after that it was nearly all singing (save for the big moment on "In the Air Tonight," I believe). I'm suspecting these shows will be similar.

  4. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Rufus View Post
    So what your saying is that if the 70's line up reunited there wouldn't be the same kevel of interest? Personally I think it would exceed it!

    There is no evidence to compare it with cos it ain't happened so your analogy is futile!
    The evidence is in album sales and tour venues. While Hackett's Genesis revisited touring was quite successful, he hardly scratched the surface of the 2007 reunion tour numbers. Also, considering how much longer the PG era albums have been around, you might expect them to have sold comparably to the big 80's and 90's albums by now. You'd be very wrong.

    Look, I much prefer PG era Genesis and find it far better musically and technically than anything that was done by the PC fronted band (well, Trick and Wind are both great, but you know what I mean). However, it's painfully obvious that the vast majority of people interested in Genesis music in any form, would rather see the 3 man line up doing the 80's and 90's hits. There is simply no question about this.

    It's all pointless to discuss though, since Gabriel will never do a reunion tour with the other guys and I don't really think Banks and Rutherford care much about doing a 5 man reunion either.

  5. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by trurl View Post
    Dennis Chambers.


    Hey, why not??

    Mick Pointer, no question.

  6. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by infandous View Post
    The evidence is in album sales and tour venues. While Hackett's Genesis revisited touring was quite successful, he hardly scratched the surface of the 2007 reunion tour numbers. Also, considering how much longer the PG era albums have been around, you might expect them to have sold comparably to the big 80's and 90's albums by now. You'd be very wrong.

    Look, I much prefer PG era Genesis and find it far better musically and technically than anything that was done by the PC fronted band (well, Trick and Wind are both great, but you know what I mean). However, it's painfully obvious that the vast majority of people interested in Genesis music in any form, would rather see the 3 man line up doing the 80's and 90's hits. There is simply no question about this.

    It's all pointless to discuss though, since Gabriel will never do a reunion tour with the other guys and I don't really think Banks and Rutherford care much about doing a 5 man reunion either.
    whilst the 70's catalogue didn't reach platinum status at time of release, it would be interesting to know what the sales figures are retrospectivly if they exist? Certainly the 70's and Hackett era box sets easily out sold the 80's box sets! Whilst they are now all out of print, you can still buy them (80's box sets) through the usual sources quite cheap!

    And no one knows for sure how many of those who attended the reunion gigs where mostly fans of the 80's pop era?

  7. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Rufus View Post
    whilst the 70's catalogue didn't reach platinum status at time of release, it would be interesting to know what the sales figures are retrospectivly if they exist? Certainly the 70's and Hackett era box sets easily out sold the 80's box sets! Whilst they are now all out of print, you can still buy them (80's box sets) through the usual sources quite cheap!

    And no one knows for sure how many of those who attended the reunion gigs where mostly fans of the 80's pop era?
    Good questions. However, considering that "We Can't Dance", "Invisible Touch" and the "shapes" album (self titled "Genesis") are all included in the Billboard top 300 selling albums of all time, and the 70's albums are nowhere to be found, it seems to me that the sales question is easily answered. However, I would like to know about the box sets. I doubt that ANY of the box sets sold as many units as the albums from any era, though I don't have the figures to prove it. Also, I suspect the fans of the 80's and 90's aren't that interested in box sets anyway, while fans of BOTH eras probably bought both. The fans of the 70's era were far more likely to buy the 70's box set than fans of the 80's and 90's eras. Though, again, that last is speculation on my part, since I don't have the numbers.

    EDIT: According to the RIAA database, nothing before Selling England has even reached Gold status at this point (which seems wrong to me, but those albums are not listed in their database for gold and platinum albums). Both Selling England and The Lamb reached Gold status in the 1990's, however, ALL the 80's and 90's albums reached that (and beyond, in the case of the biggest 3 I mentioned above) upon release. So it seems that the older albums just simply have not sold as well over the years, even with more time to make up the differences since the 80's and 90's albums were released.
    Last edited by infandous; 10-29-2015 at 12:57 PM.

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by trurl View Post
    Phil Collins. That drum-whore plays with everyone.

    My point was he's apparently not physically capable of playing anymore(at least not according to him).

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by infandous View Post
    Good questions. However, considering that "We Can't Dance", "Invisible Touch" and the "shapes" album (self titled "Genesis") are all included in the Billboard top 300 selling albums of all time, and the 70's albums are nowhere to be found, it seems to me that the sales question is easily answered. However, I would like to know about the box sets. I doubt that ANY of the box sets sold as many units as the albums from any era, though I don't have the figures to prove it. Also, I suspect the fans of the 80's and 90's aren't that interested in box sets anyway, while fans of BOTH eras probably bought both. The fans of the 70's era were far more likely to buy the 70's box set than fans of the 80's and 90's eras. Though, again, that last is speculation on my part, since I don't have the numbers.

    EDIT: According to the RIAA database, nothing before Selling England has even reached Gold status at this point (which seems wrong to me, but those albums are not listed in their database for gold and platinum albums). Both Selling England and The Lamb reached Gold status in the 1990's, however, ALL the 80's and 90's albums reached that (and beyond, in the case of the biggest 3 I mentioned above) upon release. So it seems that the older albums just simply have not sold as well over the years, even with more time to make up the differences since the 80's and 90's albums were released.
    Album certifications are often years out of date, and I gather they have to be paid for.

    Nobody knows how well a Gabriel tour would do because it has not been done in 40 years (and indeed, probably never will). There are many Genesis fans- like me- who like everything they have done, so to arbitrarily divide concert attendance of the 2007 reunion tour into '70s fans'/'80s-90s fans' simply does not work.

  10. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by JJ88 View Post
    Album certifications are often years out of date, and I gather they have to be paid for.

    Nobody knows how well a Gabriel tour would do because it has not been done in 40 years (and indeed, probably never will). There are many Genesis fans- like me- who like everything they have done, so to arbitrarily divide concert attendance of the 2007 reunion tour into '70s fans'/'80s-90s fans' simply does not work.
    I agree, for the most part. I just think there is plenty of evidence that you won't get the same turnout for the 5 piece that you will for the 3 piece. Which doesn't mean it wouldn't be practical, as Hackett showed us recently. I imagine they would pull quite a bit more people than Hackett by himself did. I just don't think it would be comparable to what the 3 piece can pull. Of course, as you say, we'll likely never know.

  11. #61
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    I am eternally grateful to anyone who refuses to sing Invisible Touch. About as Prog as Britney Spears.

  12. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve983 View Post
    I am eternally grateful to anyone who refuses to sing Invisible Touch. About as Prog as Britney Spears.
    Say what you will about "Invisible Touch," but "...Baby One More Time" is a fantastic pop song. (It's almost as if there's music NOT actively trying to be prog. Hmmmmmmmm...)
    Last edited by soundchaser93; 10-29-2015 at 04:27 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by soundchaser93 View Post
    "...Baby One More Time" is a fantastic pop song. (It's almost as there's music NOT actively trying to be prog. Hmmmmmmmm...)
    ...and, if I may say so, succeeding admirably.

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    I wonder about the mindset of Joe six pack, classic rock addition 2015. Music is always in the background, but never THAT important.

    The average schmo who ponies up big bucks to go see aging iconic classic rock band in the big anonymous arenas---- Most of them I have no passionate concern or passion for music, it's more of an event to be seen at .

    I will always remember this conversation I had with someone while I was waiting in line for Lisa Gerard tickets in 2007.

    I asked him who is getting tickets for .

    He answered " i'm sure you've never heard of them, they're called Genesis. "

    Me-" what are they sing?"

    Him - ( rattles off familiar hits inspired by Lionel Richie, Robert John, Robbie Dupree, et al)

    Me "wait, I think I have heard of them. A friend of mine played 'the Fountain of Samalcis' the other day "

    Him-" The fountain of what ? Never heard of it "

  15. #65
    ALL ACCESS Gruno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by soundchaser93 View Post
    Say what you will about "Invisible Touch," but "...Baby One More Time" is a fantastic pop song.
    Her 2004 song, "Toxic", is also a pop gem!

    The best "Baby, One More Time" cover I have heard was done by the Zappa brothers:





    Quote Originally Posted by soundchaser93 View Post
    It's almost as if there's music NOT actively trying to be prog. Hmmmmmmmm...

  16. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gruno View Post
    Her 2004 song, "Toxic", is also a pop gem!
    Yeah, but that one IS prog!

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  17. #67
    ALL ACCESS Gruno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Progatron View Post
    Yeah, but that one IS prog!
    They almost ruined it… but that was a good version!

  18. #68
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    Phil Collins ruined retirement.

  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by bob_32_116 View Post
    I tend to take everything Phil Collins says at face value.

    But seriously... he's simply stating what he believes to be a fact; other people are reading a "lament" into it.

    The outfit that sang "I Can't Dance" was a completely different act from the one that did "Cinema Show". If a five man reunion ever did occur, it would be against all odds.
    No! "Jack It" Required!

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gruno View Post
    Her 2004 song, "Toxic", is also a pop gem!
    I love "Toxic"! There was an article somewhere (and I can't for the life of me find it) that claims "...Baby One More Time" was one of the most important tracks of the '90s -- that from the moment you heard the "oh baby, baby" at the beginning, you knew the landscape of pop music had shifted dramatically. I can't really disagree with that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gruno View Post
    The best "Baby, One More Time" cover I have heard was done by the Zappa brothers:

    Never heard this one before. Great stuff!

    Quote Originally Posted by Progatron View Post
    Yeah, but that one IS prog!

    Hehehe. I love this DVD so much, in part because of this tune and in part because of the ABBA cover (speaking of artists who deserve more respect in the prog community...)

    Quote Originally Posted by Gruno View Post
    They almost ruined it… but that was a good version!
    h could sing the menu at a Denny's and I'd be drooling.


    Anyway, yeah, Genesis. I'm very happy to have seen both The Musical Box and Steve Hackett's recent tours. But in the incredibly unlikely event that a Genesis reunion tour would happen, I'd go anywhere to see it. I'd blow my current is-a-poor-grad-student savings if it meant seeing Genesis live.

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    It doesn't get much more bizarre than this - a thread about Genesis turning into a discussion about Britney Spears.

  22. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by bob_32_116 View Post
    It doesn't get much more bizarre than this - a thread about Genesis turning into a discussion about Britney Spears.
    To be fair, I didn't bring her up first. I'm just happy to push the discussion in unintended directions.

  23. #73
    Maybe Collins/Gabriel et al. could start a The Musical Box tribute band and do their Lamb shows.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bob_32_116 View Post
    It doesn't get much more bizarre than this - a thread about Genesis turning into a discussion about Britney Spears.
    You jest, but as forward thinking, consummate professionals, if Genesis was recording in 2004, they would most certainly have kept their eyes and ears peeled on the latest pop trends, including Spears, et al.

    Just like the "eureka moment" that propeled them to stardom over many decades ago, when they keenly took note what the Chritopher Cross's and the Ambrosia's and the Air Supply's and the Little River Band's were doing.

    And then only a few years after that, pivoting seamlessly, they became acutely aware of what the Thompson Twins, Culture Club were doing.

    They don't miss a beat. They had their pulse on exactly what was musically important at any given moment.

  25. #75
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    I think it's ridiculous to think a reunion would not be monumental and a hot concert ticket ----a reunion was never going to include pop hits--from what I read--it was to do a few concerts of The Lamb----(like Floyd doing The Wall) ---Supper's Ready maybe. That's what Peter said he'd be interested in revisiting. He also said his voice had changed and it was not high anymore. Of course drummers would have to come into this and Phil could share vocals if this very unlikely fantasy were to happen. They would film this and offer to the fans. It doesn't matter if it's as big as 2007 Genesis huge tour. There will always be "fans" who show up to Yes concerts and want to here Owner of a Lonely Heart and have not idea what Yours is no Disgrace is. Same with Genesis fans--there are those who want to hear Phil sing In Too Deep and never heard Firth of Fifth. I thought a reunion of The Lamb had more to do with the old fans than the pop fans of either of these two 70's prog monsters.

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