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Thread: Is Zappa Prog? If so, why not in the Big 5??

  1. #126
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrotum Scissor View Post
    No! Prog should sound somewhat like what WE want it to and can identify with - for it to be prog! Death to all false prog! Long live only true prog!

    You're just jealous of the hair, admit it.

  2. #127
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrotum Scissor View Post
    No! Prog should sound somewhat like what WE want it to and can identify with - for it to be prog! Death to all false prog! Long live only true prog!
    And the code is a play, a play is a song, a song is a film, a film is a dance...

  3. #128
    Certain Zappa pieces were most definitely (small 'p') prog.

    As others have said: odd meters, complex and difficult instrumental passages, multiple sections within a track, jazz and classical influences, etc. are plentiful in Zappa's music, which are the same things I associate with prog.

    Small 'p' prog is not a style. It is music with the above attributes, that is not in the jazz or classical realm.

    Inca Roads, for example, is a prog piece (one of the best ever, IMO), by my definitions.
    And if there were a god, I think it very unlikely that he would have such an uneasy vanity as to be offended by those who doubt His existence - Russell

  4. #129
    Quote Originally Posted by trurl View Post
    You're just jealous of the hair, admit it.


    I can only be human, so yes - I'll admit. I so want those mullets to serve as my new moust.
    "Improvisation is not an excuse for musical laziness" - Fred Frith
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  5. #130
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    The Big Six bands weren't even considered "prog" back in the early 1970s. They were nothing more than another style of rock music. The labelling came afterwards, except for the critics like Bangs and Christgau who called it "artrock." Which it wasn't.

    For me, Zappa is a genre all its own.

    Bob

  6. #131
    Recently Resurrected zombywoof's Avatar
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    Shut up and order your DVD! It's a good day to be a Frank fan.

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B014R...LiL&ref=plSrch

  7. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean View Post
    FZ is just so BEYOND the Big 5. Just listing him in the same breath as the Big 5 seems odd since I think of him as inhabiting a diverse stratosphere miles above all that.
    Man, this is exactly it. I don't exactly find myself reaching for his work a lot but you can only really classify his work as "Zappa" - more than any other artist I can think of, he's his own thing.
    Critter Jams "album of the week" blog: http://critterjams.wordpress.com

  8. #133
    chalkpie
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    Quote Originally Posted by A. Scherze View Post
    Because Genesis were prog weenies. They were twee and precious; so saccharinely sweet that you want to barf. They were prog pablum - easily digested prog, which is why today's youngsters like them so much.

    They were the Teletubbies of prog. Genitubbies.
    .
    Do you really believe that shit your spewing or is this an act of rebellion to come off looking hip? Do you secretly own 6 posters of Phil Collins in tank tops? And for the record, I have never barfed while listening to Genesis and I don't know one "young" person that likes them so much. At least in my zip code.

    Boooo.

  9. #134
    chalkpie
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scrotum Scissor View Post
    No! Prog should sound somewhat like what WE want it to and can identify with - for it to be prog! Death to all false prog! Long live only true prog!

    That version is pretty, pretty, pretty good.....but I do admit having a preference to this reading of this exquisite composition:


  10. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAMOOL View Post
    Man, this is exactly it. I don't exactly find myself reaching for his work a lot but you can only really classify his work as "Zappa" - more than any other artist I can think of, he's his own thing.
    Indeed. Frank Zappa and the Mothers of Prog

  11. #136
    Member moecurlythanu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chalkpie View Post
    That version is pretty, pretty, pretty good.....but I do admit having a preference to this reading of this exquisite composition:
    Bah!...Go to the Way OT section and see the New Maps Of Hell thread to discern the true art of that song....

  12. #137
    So Zappa is the Gigantic One. Then there's the Big 5, the Medium 29, the Small 287, the Miniscule 1220, and the Microscopic 7453.

  13. #138
    Member Since: 3/27/2002 MYSTERIOUS TRAVELLER's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by undergroundrailroad View Post
    So Zappa is the Gigantic One
    heh... there are many, many "gigantic 1"s... but none of them are ever the 'lowest common denominator' popular among the largest % of the masses
    Why is it whenever someone mentions an artist that was clearly progressive (yet not the Symph weenie definition of Prog) do certain people feel compelled to snort "thats not Prog" like a whiny 5th grader?

  14. #139
    Quote Originally Posted by BigSixFan View Post
    The Big Six bands weren't even considered "prog" back in the early 1970s.
    It has been documented that in the 60s, Hendrix was called a "progressive rock" star.

  15. #140
    Quote Originally Posted by chalkpie View Post
    Do you really believe that shit your spewing or is this an act of rebellion to come off looking hip?
    So, you concede that even in a prog-rock forum, Genesis aren't hip.

  16. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by A. Scherze View Post
    So, you concede that even in a prog-rock forum, Genesis aren't hip.
    What's this? Taking an excerpt of someone else's comment completely out of context to support your "argument"?

    Typical.

  17. #142
    Member Since: 3/27/2002 MYSTERIOUS TRAVELLER's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigSixFan View Post
    The Big Six bands weren't even considered "prog" back in the early 1970s.
    correct, because the 4-letter word "prog" was invented in the mid-80s (by the Neoboys I guess)

    and though there were quite a number of artists who were blending Rock with other styles of music and being called "progressive"; the two word term "progressive rock" didn't really start becoming common until the mid 70s

    signed, old guy who was part of the NYC scene in the early 70s
    Why is it whenever someone mentions an artist that was clearly progressive (yet not the Symph weenie definition of Prog) do certain people feel compelled to snort "thats not Prog" like a whiny 5th grader?

  18. #143
    I didn't even realize that Yes, ELP, Genesis, etc. were "prog rock" until I got on the internet (1996 or so). I always referred to them as "art rock", I term I always preferred anyway (though I realize that there really is an artrock genre, that isn't prog rock).

    As to Zappa, I never really lumped him in with what I thought of as Prog. He really is his own musical universe. Much of what he did was in the general "rock" format, but a good amount of it wasn't, so I'm not sure how you really pigeonhole him. Of course, as you get older and go through enough endless arguments about what is or isn't "prog" or "progressive" or whatever other genre categorization you care to name, you start to realize that the categorizations are really just a reference, like a section in a library. I mean, are all Sci-Fi stories the same? Are they even all similar? Not when you've read as many of them as I have they aren't. There are so many musics that cross the line of "genre" that you really just have to learn to listen with an open mind and heart and like what you like and discard what you don't, regardless of "genre".

    Wait, sorry, this is PE, what the hell am I saying??? Phil Collins ruined Prog Rock!! Peter Gabriel ruined Lady Gaga!!!!!

  19. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by chalkpie View Post
    That version is pretty, pretty, pretty good.....but I do admit having a preference to this reading of this exquisite composition:
    Oh shit, I only KNEW Dream Theater had to try their hand on that tune...!
    "Improvisation is not an excuse for musical laziness" - Fred Frith
    "[...] things that we never dreamed of doing in Crimson or in any band that I've been in," - Tony Levin speaking of SGM

  20. #145
    Member Since: 3/27/2002 MYSTERIOUS TRAVELLER's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by infandous View Post
    ...you start to realize that the categorizations are really just a reference, like a section in a library. I mean, are all Sci-Fi stories the same? Are they even all similar? Not when you've read as many of them as I have they aren't. There are so many musics that cross the line of "genre" that you really just have to learn to listen with an open mind and heart and like what you like and discard what you don't, regardless of "genre".

    Peter Gabriel ruined Lady Gaga!!!!!
    absolutely agreed... except, err... did Gabe give Gaga herpes?
    Why is it whenever someone mentions an artist that was clearly progressive (yet not the Symph weenie definition of Prog) do certain people feel compelled to snort "thats not Prog" like a whiny 5th grader?

  21. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by MYSTERIOUS TRAVELLER View Post
    absolutely agreed... except, err... did Gabe give Gaga herpes?
    Hmm, you know, I probably should have reversed that. Or something.

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