Underground Railroad, Kurt Rongey, Bill Pohl, et al

[bigjohnwayne]

Any fans?


Here's the thing: I was a snot-nosed 16 year old kid in the early 2000s (decadent times, those). I was starting to feel diminishing returns re: the Spock's Beard style of new prog. Not to pile on Spock's Beard, they are among the best of that kind of music.

I bought "Suffocating the Bloom" by Echolyn. Loved it. I wanted more prog like that--a bit more challenging. More complicated harmonies. Something Gentle Giant-ish but updated. I got the first Land of Chocolate album. Liked it quite a bit. Got the Bubblemath album (whatever happened to them? Update--they put up a new track on Facebook last fall). I liked it, but it didn't quite scratch the itch.


But "Through and Through" by The Underground Railroad? Oh me oh my. What an album.

From what I gather it is an album people love or hate.

It has a couple short jazzy/quirky songs (May Fly, Mars). A gonzo instrumental (in the factory). A bizarre everything but the kitchen sink parts A through Q type of song (The Doorman). An abstract loooong song (the title track). The other song's good too.


The keyboardist/lead singer was Kurt Rongey, who had a couple solo records to his credit. If I remember correctly he was the program director of a classical radio station down in Texas somewhere. That would explain why the band has actual, real-live classical influences, and not just third hand classical influences from listening to proggers who listened to Jon Anderson who listened to Stravinsky.

The guitarist Bill Pohl has at least one solo record.



I waited (for what seemed like) many years for the followup. when "The Origin of Consciousness" arrived I found it inscrutable and intimidating.

It's not that I don't like it. It's just I still don't know what to make of it. Usually I can tell if something is awful and I don't get the awful vibe from this.

Have you ever read the "America's Test Kitchen" magazine? Every so often (it might be every issue), there's someone who has written in with some strange kitchen implement they got at an estate sale and they don't know what it is. (Spoiler alert-It's usually something built for a very bizarre and specific purpose that any sane person would normally do with a knife or peeler, like cutting carrots or shredding cabbage)

Anyway: that's how I feel about "The Origin of Consciousness".

But how do all you people feel? Are Rongey and Pohl's solo albums any good? I saw Rongey has a duo album with David Bagsby, in which they based some compositions on logarithms or something. It sounds very progressive.

[gflorio]

Absolutely love The Origin of Consciousness. It was my introduction to them - I saw them at the NJ Proghouse shortly after they released this and was hooked. I only recently found a copy of Through and Through and have listened to it 2 or 3 times. Also an excellent disc. I also picked up a copy of Bill Pohl's disc Solid Earth at the Proghouse show iirc and enjoy that too. Not sure if there are any other discs by the band or members but would love some recommendations to hunt for.....

[Prog Lives]

They really clicked for me live - NEARfest 01'. Same year as birdsongs

I love throught and through thanks for inspiring me to spin it again

[helicase]

I love Kurt Rongey's solo albums; for me they're on a par with the UR albums. So check them out, especially the second one, That Was Propaganda. Bill Pohl's solo album Solid Earth is also very good.

Kurt's a PE member BTW, but I don't know if he's still very active on the board. And Bill's in the latest Thinking Plague line-up. Looking forward to what he will bring to the TP sound.

[Scrotum Scissor]

And Bill's in the latest Thinking Plague line-up. Looking forward to what he will bring to the TP sound.

Seeing the "listenary evolution" of the OP, he'd might want to check out Thinking Plague next. They are one of the most advanced and *defining* progressive bands of the past 30 years, although they move so far beyond the strands of the 70s that they transgress the whole concept. Mike Johnson, TP's mainman, posts here on occasion as well.

That upcoming TP album with Bill P. has a kickstarting campaign going for it, btw - announced earlier today in here.

[Digital_Man]

I like the first URR album. I saw them at Nearfest and Progday. I thought they did a great job. They are sort of a mix of symphonic, canterbury and maybe a bit of avant or rio in there too. If they are considered symph(and I don't doubt they are)then they are not your typical symph prog band. There is certainly no "neo" in there sound. I had a Bill Pohl album a long time ago. Very good playing on it but the sound was very muddy. I also had Kurt Rongey's "book in hand" which I remember liking a lot and even thinking parts of it sounded like outtakes from Genesis' "Lamb." Great Banks inspired keys on that one. It's now out of print I believe. I do have "that was propaganda" on cd somewhere but haven't listened to it yet.

[aith01]

Based on this thread, I decided to check out Origin of Consciousness on Spotify. It's interesting... Very cerebral, challenging. The guitar playing often reminds me of Allan Holdsworth, which is a good thing.

[MJBrady]

I love both the UR records, and the Kurt Rongey albums are also good, Bill Pohl's album has some great music, but hurts in the sound quality dept. You might also like Finneus Gauge, A Triggering Myth, Frogg Cafe, Ken Watsonm they are all involving prog with hints of fusion tossed about.

[bigjohnwayne]

Thanks for some suggestion everybody.

I like what I've heard from Thinking Plague. I like some RIO, but I find the emotional content lacking sometimes (the better way of putting that is probably that I don't quite connect with it on an emotional level). I steered clear of Thinking Plague for a while for that reason, but I find their stuff very interesting now. I really like "Fountain of All Tears" and "Rapture of the Deep" is exquisite.

I forgot Triggering Myth existed. I'm listening to "Forgiving Eden" on youtube. The production sounds makes it sound a bit like an old school computer game soundtrack but there's quite a bit of meat on this bone.

[No Pride]

But "Through and Through" by The Underground Railroad? Oh me oh my. What an album.

From what I gather it is an album people love or hate.

It has a couple short jazzy/quirky songs (May Fly, Mars). A gonzo instrumental (in the factory). A bizarre everything but the kitchen sink parts A through Q type of song (The Doorman). An abstract loooong song (the title track). The other song's good too.


The keyboardist/lead singer was Kurt Rongey, who had a couple solo records to his credit. If I remember correctly he was the program director of a classical radio station down in Texas somewhere. That would explain why the band has actual, real-live classical influences, and not just third hand classical influences from listening to proggers who listened to Jon Anderson who listened to Stravinsky.

The guitarist Bill Pohl has at least one solo record.



I waited (for what seemed like) many years for the followup. when "The Origin of Consciousness" arrived I found it inscrutable and intimidating.

It's not that I don't like it. It's just I still don't know what to make of it. Usually I can tell if something is awful and I don't get the awful vibe from this.

Have you ever read the "America's Test Kitchen" magazine? Every so often (it might be every issue), there's someone who has written in with some strange kitchen implement they got at an estate sale and they don't know what it is. (Spoiler alert-It's usually something built for a very bizarre and specific purpose that any sane person would normally do with a knife or peeler, like cutting carrots or shredding cabbage)

Anyway: that's how I feel about "The Origin of Consciousness".

But how do all you people feel? Are Rongey and Pohl's solo albums any good?

I got my first computer around 2001 (I know, I was a latecomer) and shortly thereafter, I learned of prog's resurgence. I went on a bit of a mad buying spree, but aside from a few albums, I found most of it to be from slightly to greatly disappointing. At the top of those few I dug a lot was "Through and Through." It was pretty much what I'd hoped prog would've progressed into, 30+ years after it's inception. Mindful of the genre's past but forward thinking, with abundant 20th century classical and fusion influences. A decade and a half later, I still think it's fantastic... and amongst the most grossly underrated modern prog albums out there.

"The Origin of Consciousness" is also great, though I prefer the debut by a slim margin. The style they established with TaT is still very much in evidence, but TOoC is heavier, more brutal and has less of the beautiful, pastoral and "symphonic" passages than the debut. Still, I'd recommend sticking with it and letting it stick with you. The epic title track on the first one took me a long time to absorb, but eventually I fell in love with it. Their music is the kind that takes some commitment before it clicks, but the result is well worth the effort!

I love Kurt Rongey's solo albums; for me they're on a par with the UR albums. So check them out, especially the second one, That Was Propaganda.

Yeah, it's pretty great and about a third of it sounds very much like an Underground Railroad album. The opening suite alone is worth the price of admission!

[Scrotum Scissor]

I personally think Through and Through is one of the finest "borderline" prog/avant releases of the post-90s - this and some of Dan Britten's stuff. Somewhat rooted in the ol' "symph" for sure, but absolutely dedicated to the mission of exploring things way further and with other impulses.

I love that lengthy title track, although I can see why your average Roine Stolt-afficionado wouldn't want to sit through those motions.

[aith01]

[...]
I love that lengthy title track, although I can see why your average Roine Stolt-afficionado wouldn't want to sit through those motions.

Speaking as a huge fan of Roine Stolt, there are those of us who can -- and do -- enjoy both. Though maybe that means I'm not average.

I listened to all of Origin of Consciousness in a single sitting and was quite pleasantly surprised by most of it. The first song proper was a bit difficult, but I intend to give it a few more tries. The rest was quite enjoyable, and made me think of what echolyn might sound like if they joined up with Allan Holdsworth. That is a gross oversimplification though.

Really want to check out their debut now.

[Scrotum Scissor]

I'm not average.

[Don Arnold]

I have both UR albums and love them both. Their first, TaT was immediately enjoyable, but OoC took additional spins to experience the listening love.

And, not to derail this thread, but count me as another Roine Stolt fan who must not be average.

[aith01]

I just realized you were speaking about the title track from the first album and not UR's music in general. Sorry about that.

[Scrotum Scissor]

^ No need for sorrying!

Carry on... Life is fairly fine.

[aith01]

Well, I went ahead and ordered a copy of Origin of Consciousness from Wayside. This stuff is just too cool to pass up.

Would like to check out Rongey and Pohl's solo efforts, but they seem hard to find now.

[No Pride]

Well, I went ahead and ordered a copy of Origin of Consciousness from Wayside. This stuff is just too cool to pass up.

Would like to check out Rongey and Pohl's solo efforts, but they seem hard to find now.

Well, I found this for you:
http://www.discogs.com/sell/release/4833340?ev=rb

BTW, Kurt made a third solo album called "Within Form It Threatens Silence." It used to be available (download only) on a site called Mindawn, but that site doesn't seem to be in working order now for some reason. I downloaded it a few years back, but lost it somehow.

I also just found this video of The Underground Railroad. It's a tune that isn't on either album, which makes me think they might've had plans for a third album. Unfortunately, I'm guessing that isn't going to happen now that Kurt and Bill live far apart, but you never know. Looks like Kurt is playing drums and sequenced his keyboard parts, possibly because they couldn't find an available drummer for this gig.

[aith01]

Well, I found this for you:
http://www.discogs.com/sell/release/4833340?ev=rb

BTW, Kurt made a third solo album called "Within Form It Threatens Silence." It used to be available (download only) on a site called Mindawn, but that site doesn't seem to be in working order now for some reason. I downloaded it a few years back, but lost it somehow.

Hey, thanks Ernie!

Hard to argue with that price point too.

How would you describe That Was Propaganda overall?

[No Pride]

How would you describe That Was Propaganda overall?

Like I said, about a third of it sounds like an Underground Railroad album, no small thanks to the fact that Bill Pohl is on it. It uses drum machine, but with Kurt being a proficient drummer, the programming is very good and it doesn't bother me the way most drum machine albums do. There's some stuff on it that's more like pure modern classical and there's a bit of ambient stuff too. But the opening four track suite is excellent imo; as good as anything on either of the UR albums. I'm not into everything on it, but there's more than enough great stuff to make it well worthwhile. I think Kurt is a brilliant composer (and musician, of course) and that's very much in evidence on this album.

[aith01]

Like I said, about a third of it sounds like an Underground Railroad album, no small thanks to the fact that Bill Pohl is on it. It uses drum machine, but with Kurt being a proficient drummer, the programming is very good and it doesn't bother me the way most drum machine albums do. There's some stuff on it that's more like pure modern classical and there's a bit of ambient stuff too. But the opening four track suite is excellent imo; as good as anything on either of the UR albums. I'm not into everything on it, but there's more than enough great stuff to make it well worthwhile. I think Kurt is a brilliant composer (and musician, of course) and that's very much in evidence on this album.

Oops... I'd forgotten you already mentioned the album in an earlier post. Sorry about that.

It sounds like something well worth hearing!

[TheH]

Well, I found this for you:
http://www.discogs.com/sell/release/4833340?ev=rb

BTW, Kurt made a third solo album called "Within Form It Threatens Silence." It used to be available (download only) on a site called Mindawn, but that site doesn't seem to be in working order now for some reason. I downloaded it a few years back, but lost it somehow.

I also just found this video of The Underground Railroad. It's a tune that isn't on either album, which makes me think they might've had plans for a third album. Unfortunately, I'm guessing that isn't going to happen now that Kurt and Bill live far apart, but you never know. Looks like Kurt is playing drums and sequenced his keyboard parts, possibly because they couldn't find an available drummer for this gig.

Mindawn went out of business some years ago.

A third Album was actually written and performed live (at least in parts) but never recorded...

Also note Bill's announcement on the "New Releases Only" thread a few days ago!

[No Pride]

Also note Bill's announcement on the "New Releases Only" thread a few days ago!

Bill Pohl? I looked, but couldn't find anything. Please enlighten!

[TheH]

Bill Pohl? I looked, but couldn't find anything. Please enlighten!

Ahmm, most likley confused that "bp" guy on the second to last page....

[Steve F.]

Ahmm, most likley confused that "bp" guy on the second to last page....

BP is Bill Plummer, of Oblivion Sun and etc. FINE player, but not Bill Pohl and a keyboardist, not a guitarist!